Too Fat! | ADHD Information
[QUOTE=reality]My friends and I do it for free.
So, what is the catch? Do you try to convert me to your religion?
I have no medical training whatsoever and neither do most of my friends.
I didn't think so. Aren't you afraid of being sued?
BUT, wasn't it the "medical professionals" that told you that you can just stop taking A/Ds anytime you want ... until 2 years ago. Now they say what we've been saying.
Reality, you need to face reality. Medical science discovers new things everyday. It is not a big conspiracy plot. They pull things off the shelf all the time because they discover that particular med may do harm to many. They change the ingredients when they find something better. They put warnings on things so we know. Things evolve. Things change. People are so different they can't know what will happen to each and every person who takes a certain drug. I can't take Ibuprofen because it makes me violently ill. But millions can take it no problem. Should they pull it because it almost killed me? Heck no!
And by the way, "Who is "we've"? What group are you from?
I used to get "You Saved My Life" emails about 6 times a year from people who just quit taking the drug and then contacted me a week or so into their withdrawals. But I really don't reccommend doing that.
I suspect, and I may be wrong, that these people who have thanked you are in fact all involved in your cult, religion, or group and the high they are getting from feeling needed is just temporary - if they indeed exist which I doubt. Are you tracking these people years later. How are you sure these people didn't at some point end their lives after being off anti-depressants. Show me the data. If you aren't tracking these people years after then you are irresponsible and playing a dangerous game.
If you don't want to quit.... you won't hurt my feelings.
If you want to quit, I'll put you in touch with people who can help you with a "doctor approved" protocol and forums like this one just for people quitting these drugs.
If you just "quit", I'll lean on you to go back on the drug... even pay for it if you can't afford it and refer you to my friends.
You put your life and the lives of those around you in danger when you just "quit" an SSRI antidepressant. THAT'S A FACT !!!
Yes, but not being on them is far more risky. THAT IS A FACT! JUST ASK ME! Ask thousand who felt "their lives were indeed saved by going on anit-depressants". If I hadn't I would be dead. There is no doubt in my mind. DO YOU UNDERSTAND THAT? NO DOUBT IN MY MIND I WOULD BE DEAD.
[/QUOTE] I am overweight.I am on RitalinLA.
What's wrong with this picture?
In 8 years on RitLA and anti-D therapy, I've gained 50 lbs, and can't lose it on my old diet/workout routine, and I just don't have the energy to cut back more calories, nor the stamina to exercise more. I am 50, and FAT. I've been just accepting it for years, but after reading all the posts about stims and skinny, why am I not thin?
Am I a Bear, that I should ROAR!?
who wants to be thin? thin is stupid. fat is good.Am I An ADDer, that I want to be like everyone else?
Now I wanna be FAT!
How about somewhere in the middle?
I was just speaking to a mother of someone on my caseload at work and they thought her son had ADD as a child and put him on Ritalin and he too gained weight so I guess different people it affects differently. My client actually was mis-diagnosed however but the med did the same thing to him.
David, could it be middle age spread??
I'm 36 and gained 20 pounds in the last two years. I've slowly been taking it back off. They problem...the old excersise regime <sound familier??> just doesn't work. I've been jogging 2-3 miles 4 times a week with the fat just sitting there...like a lump....won't budge....it loves my tummy.....AAARRRGHHH
David,
You are fat because of the antidepressant you take.
More than half of A/D users gain weight... anywhere from 30 to 70 lbs.
That's a recorded fact.
Now for my own personal "facts"....
After years of helping people get off antidepressants, I've noticed that they do not lose any weight until about 6 weeks after taking the last pill.
If they switch antidepressants, they generally will not lose any weight either. It seems that if you gain on one, you'll gain on all of them.
So you have a choice.... either accept the fat or quit the a/d drugs.
If you want to quit, just email me at realityab@yahoo.com . It takes about 6 weeks of hard time and another 6 weeks after that to come back to normal for most people. If you're on Paxil.... YOU BE CAREFUL !!!
sorry but I've been heavier for some short times in my life and I didn't like it. Not the way I looked, felt, couldn't race for a bus or defend myself if necessary, not so much about being "bigger" if you gained 50 pounds of muscle that would be okay cause you would be strong and fitI love being in good physical shape...strong bones prevent bentoveritis and hold off cronedom...and you just feel better from all the endorphins!
"If you vote for me, all your wildest dreams will come true!" Vote for Pedro!
Reality,
You seem nice enough but is that why you are here...to drum up business for yourself? How much does it cost? Are you a doctor or a nurse? How do we know- YOU KNOW- what the H*ll you are doing? Why should we trust you over what has made us have a life?
My friends and I do it for free.
I have no medical training whatsoever and neither do most of my friends.
BUT, wasn't it the "medical professionals" that told you that you can just stop taking A/Ds anytime you want ... until 2 years ago. Now they say what we've been saying.
I used to get "You Saved My Life" emails about 6 times a year from people who just quit taking the drug and then contacted me a week or so into their withdrawals. But I really don't reccommend doing that.
If you don't want to quit.... you won't hurt my feelings.
If you want to quit, I'll put you in touch with people who can help you with a "doctor approved" protocol and forums like this one just for people quitting these drugs.
If you just "quit", I'll lean on you to go back on the drug... even pay for it if you can't afford it and refer you to my friends.
You put your life and the lives of those around you in danger when you just "quit" an SSRI antidepressant. THAT'S A FACT !!!
reality38654.5444328704Didn't you know contrary? According to Reality All use of all medications that help us are us lying to ourselves - and they are actually killing us? The reports on that being not true- we're just reading them wrong!
If you quit antidepressants, not only will you lose weight - but your dog will come home, you'll win the lottery, you'll clear up acne, Tony Robbins will personally come to your home and read his books for you - all wonderful things come to you!
David, a sensable diet and excersise program will help you lose weight. It's a simple fact, calories in vs calories out is what regulates your weight. Excersise also gets the calories out and keeps your metabolizm active.
Yes, some drugs may make you gain weight. But refer back to common sense, calories in vs calories out. In conjunction with excersise. When I took anti depresants I jogged around 3 miles a day. I did not gain a pound. What are you doing for excersise David? Perhaps I can help you in a common sense manner. I know quite a bit about fitness and diet. Email me if you would like.
who is Tony Robbins?yeah, yeah i know already "just google it, you lazy sh*te-head"
alrright, already! besides you don't need to lose weight D'O --- you're fine!
chjones38654.5816550926
I was on antidepressants when my Dad dropped dead of a heart attack while we were jogging. I didn't gain one once. As was ya'lls experience, I lost weight.
I thank my doctor for helping me through this time. Antidepressants were also very helpful in getting me back on track. Without them I was unable to function.
sdw22738654.4601736111Ladypeace wrote...
"Then he stopped taking them for a little bit and came back to el doctoro and he put him on wellbutrin XR. Seems like the total opposite results. gained. alot."
One thing that I would like to point out to ALL of you....
JUST BECAUSE THAT CERTAIN SSRI ANTIDEPRESSANT WORKED FOR YOU BEFORE.... DOES NOT !!!! ...MEAN THAT YOU WILL HAVE THE SAME EFFECT IF YOU TRY IT AGAIN !!!
I've got lots of stories about SSRI users taking a drug "successfully" for years, quitting for a couple years, restarting on it and then freaking out and committing suicide.
[QUOTE=LadyPeace_82]My husband is on wellbutrin. But I thought wellbutrin came out about 2 years ago. His dr. said he wanted to try him on an anti-depressant not yet on the market. He was on reg Wellbutrin at the highest dose taking 2 a day. He lost about 30 lbs right off the bat. Just didn't feel like finishing everything on his plate. No seconds. It was great. Then he stopped taking them for a little bit and came back to el doctoro and he put him on wellbutrin XR. Seems like the total opposite results. gained. alot.
[/QUOTE]doc just put me on wellbutrin, for that, and b/c Cymbalta was too dreamy for me. So he cut my dose in half, and added wellbutrin at 150 mg/day. I feel the same. Maybe I should get some of those weight aids the TV keeps advertising...
Sabina,
As far as I figure, most of the 120,000,000 people taking SSRI antidepressants should not be on them. I was seriously involved in helping Paxil users quit and I always seemed to get the ones who quit "cold turkey".
The FDA approved SSRIs for a MAXIMUM 6 months consecutive use. They've never been approved for long term use.
In my post, I said that more than half of A/D users gain weight. Some stay neutral and some actually lose weight. At one time Prozac was being prescribed to "lose weight".
(Wellbutrin is the mildest antidepressant and is generally easiest to quit.)
David,
TV weight aids won't help much. If you try real hard you might lose a few pounds.
But if you quit taking antidepressants, you'll lose a lot.
My husband is on wellbutrin. But I thought wellbutrin came out about 2 years ago. His dr. said he wanted to try him on an anti-depressant not yet on the market. He was on reg Wellbutrin at the highest dose taking 2 a day. He lost about 30 lbs right off the bat. Just didn't feel like finishing everything on his plate. No seconds. It was great. Then he stopped taking them for a little bit and came back to el doctoro and he put him on wellbutrin XR. Seems like the total opposite results. gained. alot.So, are you saying you help people get off anti d's they should not
have been on in the first place? I've been taking Wellbutrin for about
6 years and it actually supresses appetite somewhat but still possible
to have lovely stuff your face episodes if you so please.
chjones,
I've already stated a few times that 120,000,000 people are on antidepressants and not all of them go nuts. Only about 1% do.
The withdrawal problems with A/Ds are.... about 78% of Paxil users, 50% of Zoloft and Effexor users , 40% of Lexapro, Celexa users and 35% of Prozac users will experience severe withdrawal problems.
I think Glen is just having trouble accepting the fact that the manufacturers, the FDA and Canada Health have all put warnings on SSRIs because there are problems with SSRIs.
I think we need a REALITY CHECK.... some one pay the check so reality can leave. I hate to think he has donated all his experience and life changing adhd revelations, for free. Oh wait, he does not have adhd, nor does he know anyone with it. Maybe it has it. in denial???? who knows... i can say, what fun and joy it is to know that reality as a child had adhd and is telling his experiences as a kid with medications for his condition.[QUOTE=reality]David,
TV weight aids won't help much. If you try real hard you might lose a few pounds.
But if you quit taking antidepressants, you'll lose a lot.[/QUOTE]
I don't think I'd lose alot,
I'd lose it all... (shhh, I was murderous and suicidal: took care of
things with machine guns and hand grenades and helicopters. The platoon
in my head disappeared on Ritalin).
Besides, chJonesy talked me
into staying FAT. It's healthier in the long run than being skinny.
It's a good source of reserve energy if I run out of food b/c of my
ADHD, and it keeps me warm in cold environments, where I get very
distracted b/c of my ADD.
yeah, yeah i know already "just google it, you lazy sh*te-head"
alrright, already! besides you don't need to lose weight D'O --- you're fine![/QUOTE]
Oh, wow! I just quoted you, and look, here's the reference!!! Thanks, chjo!!!
Who is tony robbins, btw? I'm to busy here to google...
Tony Robbins? - think of if Lurch from the Addams Family sold self-help tapes on late night TV.[QUOTE=sdw227]David, a sensable diet and excersise program will help you lose weight. It's a simple fact, calories in vs calories out is what regulates your weight. Excersise also gets the calories out and keeps your metabolizm active.
Yes, some drugs may make you gain weight. But refer back to
common sense, calories in vs calories out. In conjunction with
excersise. When I took anti depresants I jogged around 3 miles a
day. I did not gain a pound. What are you doing for
excersise David? Perhaps I can help you in a common sense
manner. I know quite a bit about fitness and diet. Email me
if you would like.[/QUOTE]
Thanks for the offer, Steve-O. Do you know how anti-D's increase one's weight? I'd be curious to know.
As for exercise, I walk the
fields almost every workday, and I ski aggressively on weekends. I get
my heartrate up well on weekends, but not on weekdays.
One thing I found out is the
fruit I munch on in the fields has a lot of calories. Each grape
berry has 6 cals, and each bunch has ~100 berries. Each cantaloupe is a
minimum 10% sugar. Too bad I don't work lettuce, or broccoli! But I do,
but those are inedible without being washed. The others I can eat
around the pesticides with a trick of the tale. So, I'm trying to cut
back on the field candy, but found my elf sneaking pounds of almonds
and raisins!
OMG!...and the calories in
Gatorade! I switched to water this year, as I was consuming about 1/2
gallon / day of gator. switched to Crystal Lite from Texas Ice Tea, b/c
of the sugar cane extract they put into it. But still can't lose weight.
Can't lose for winning...
contrary,
No, I don't try to convert you to my religion. I'd have to get a religion first.
No, I'm not afraid of being sued.
The reason there are "Black Box Warnings" on SSRI antidepressants is not because the FDA or the drug companies discovered something "new" about them. All of the "data" had been there for nearly 20 years.
The reason is that my friends and I finally caught the media's attention to the rapidly growing pile of dead children. Drug companies got stupid and thought they could sell this crap for use on children and the internet provided a means for all the victims to start grouping.
I'm not from a "group". I just gotten involved with people from all walks of life in all parts of the world. And I only know 4 Scientologists. Most of my "friends" are grieving parents, lawyers. anti drug doctors and people who have taken my advice and come back to push an anti SSRI agenda.
To "show you the data", I'd have to introduce you to my friends. (You've already met some of them on this forum.)
I honestly don't know where a lot of the people I've helped have gone. What I do know is that their last emails to me say things like "You saved my life. I'm alive again. I can't remember feeling like this. It's been so long. You're doing a wonderful thing."
They always promise to write, but the emails get further and further apart. I have gotten some a year or so later... still thanking me for helping them.
These drugs wouldn't have been accepted if they didn't "help" some people. Perhaps you are one of them, but I've heard many people claim that they would be dead without them and then turn completely around a few years later. That happens a lot.
Canada Health has a proper warning.... "MAY CAUSE PERIODS OF SEVERE AGITATION RESULTING IN SELF HARM OR HARM TO OTHERS."
Now that means that SSRIs can kill you... even if you're not the one taking them. NO OTHER GROUP OF DRUGS COMES CLOSE TO CREATING SUCH HOMOCIDAL TENDENCIES IN THE USERS. !!!
In a group I helped create there are over 700 members. There are over 20,000 names on the anti Prozac, Paxil, Effexor petitions that we created. I belong to a bunch of other groups related to the cause.
All we want is to force the government health agencies such as the FDA to simply DO THEIR JOB and serve the interests of the people first... not accept bribes from the drug companies.
[QUOTE=GlenW]Tony Robbins? - think of if Lurch from the Addams Family sold self-help tapes on late night TV.[/QUOTE]Lurch, he was the tall guy, that rang the bell? Who was the bald guy?
Â
Reality,
First, I want to compliment you. You have been polite and I appreciate you answering every one of my questions. If only all your other "friends" would be like you, your group wouldn't be met with such anger.
The problem I have with you is that you "say" there are people like me who can get off and be O.K. You are so wrong. I did stop and I plummeting back into depression. I can't just take your word for it. I believe there are far more helped than harmed. Bottom line.
You said: All we want is to force the government health agencies such as the FDA to simply DO THEIR JOB and serve the interests of the people first... not accept bribes from the drug companies.
When people say this I immediately shut off from anything else you have to say. I will never buy into this conspiracy stuff.
But thanks anyway for being so upfront on how you feel.
Here's from the journal of abnormal psychology:
Clinical & Research NewsSSRI, Suicide Link Called Weak
A week before the FDA’s contentious hearing on SSRIs and child and adolescent suicidal behaviors, the American College of Neuropsychopharmacology (ACNP) released a preliminary report at a Washington, D.C., press briefing concluding that popular antidepressant medications do not increase suicidal behaviors in patients under age 18 with depression.
"The evidence linking SSRIs to suicide is weak," said J. John Mann, M.D., co-chair of the ACNP task force examining the issue and a professor of psychiatry at Columbia University College of Physicians and Surgeons. Mann is also chief of neuroscience at the New York State Psychiatric Institute.
"There are strong lines of evidence in youth—from clinical trials, epidemiology and autopsy studies—that led the ACNP task force to conclude that SSRIs do not cause suicide in youth with depression."
The ACNP task force reviewed a subset of the clinical trial data available to the FDA (see story on page 1)—both published and unpublished—on the use of SSRIs in children and adolescents with depression. The task force was formed last September following British regulators’ warnings to physicians in May 2003 not to prescribe SSRIs to patients under the age of 18. British regulators based their decisions on a significantly broader database than that which was available to the ACNP. The FDA issued weaker warnings in June 2003 noting the controversy and advising close monitoring of any patient under 18 taking SSRIs.
"The most likely explanation for the episodes of attempted suicide while taking SSRIs is the underlying depression, not the SSRIs," said Graham Emslie, M.D., co-chair with Mann on the task force and chief of the division of child and adolescent psychiatry at the University of Texas Southwestern Medical Center at Dallas. "The potential benefits of SSRIs outweigh the risks."
Mann, who has devoted the last 30 years to the study of youth suicide, noted that suicide attempts and suicidal ideation in youths with depression is common, but completed suicide is rare. Unfortunately, he said during the press briefing, the link between suicidal ideation or attempt and actual suicide completion is highly complex and not well understood. What is known is that "kids who think about it or attempt it are not the same as those who complete it. There may be a link between what I would refer to as failed suicides and completion."
A failed suicide, he noted, is a serious attempt that would have led to the patient’s death if medical intervention had not occurred.
The ACNP task force members emphasized that the current data appear to be contradictory, and it is difficult to draw conclusions on a drug’s efficacy in pediatric depression, for example, when three clinical trials are available, with one trial showing robust efficacy, a second showing small efficacy, and the third showing no statistical difference from placebo. The differences among individual trial results, the researchers said, is likely due to differences in methodology and data reporting.
ACNP is strongly urging that all data held by pharmaceutical companies or the FDA be made available publicly so that ACNP and others can conduct complete, independent evaluations.
A copy of the executive summary of the ACNP report is posted online at www.acnp.org.
[QUOTE=Contrary]Reality,
First, I want to compliment you. You have been polite and I appreciate you answering every one of my questions. If only all your other "friends" would be like you, your group wouldn't be met with such anger.
The problem I have with you is that you "say" there are people like me who can get off and be O.K. You are so wrong. I did stop and I plummeting back into depression. I can't just take your word for it. I believe there are far more helped than harmed. Bottom line.
You said: All we want is to force the government health agencies such as the FDA to simply DO THEIR JOB and serve the interests of the people first... not accept bribes from the drug companies.
When people say this I immediately shut off from anything else you have to say. I will never buy into this conspiracy stuff.
But thanks anyway for being so upfront on how you feel.
[/QUOTE]
Contrary,
There are people just like you who would actually be better off without the drugs. But then, there's 120,000,000 people on the drugs so there must be a need for them.
THERE IS NO CONSPIRACY ! It's just the way big corporations do business with the government. All of the big companies do this... tobacco, automakers, HALIBURTON...
The drug companies pay for all of the clinical trials and therefore feel entitled to be the ones in charge of deciding what the final report says.
There are more registered drug company lobbyists on Capital Hill than there are Congressmen.
Drug company grants account for 40% of the budgets of the Universities Medical Departments.
There is a drug rep FROM EACH DRUG COMPANY for every 10 doctors.
Since 1997, drug companies have been allowed to advertise direct to the consumer. Do you realize what has happened from this ...?
On this forum (and everywhere else) I've noticed that there are people who admit to "self diagnosis" of ADHD... based on "symptoms" from drug company commercials and ads. Then they are choosing a "med"... based on the drug company's advertising and website information.
This "new type of patient" is simply going to their doctor and saying... I have this... I want this med. And 80% of the time they will get it.
I'm not at all comfortable with this. Why did we spend all that money training doctors if they're just going to be "order takers" ?
I just want some changes made that will result in better and safer meds.
[QUOTE=Countrygirl]Love thyself, all of thee
You are who you're s�pose to be
Accept thyself for who you are
Davidornado,
SUPERSTAR!!!!!!!!
[/QUOTE]Does this mean I have a fun club, now?
Â
Country girl,
The new FDA Black Box Warnings do not adequately warn about the increase in suicidal thoughts from SSRIs.
One thing that I have learned from reading THOUSANDS of personal stories involving the SSRI drugs is that in many cases...
THE SUICIDAL THOUGHTS ARE RANDOM AND INSTANTANEOUS. A Paxil survivor told me that just shaving would start him thinking about slitting his throat.
Children are far more impulsive than adults and are far more likely to act upon suicidal thoughts.
The youngest suicide attempt that I know of was twin 5 year old girls on Zoloft.
That's totally anecdotal evidence again - I can't find ONE iota of proof of anyone attempting suicide when on SSRIs under the age of 13. You have reference data for the twins? The earliest recorded suicide attempt is age 6, one child alone. That's north american stats - saying that a child under age 6 cannot formalize the "me" enough to contemplate ending life.
Please share the name of these twins, where from and when?
GlenW38655.3577199074Take some anectodal evidence, drink plenty of fluids, get lost, and don't call me in the morning...GlenW,
There's a court case in progress on the twins ordeal, so I don't know if I can get the info. But I'll try.
Glen, please stop contradicting yourself...
" I can't find ONE iota of proof of anyone attempting suicide even when on SSRIs under the age of 13."
... and then...
"The earliest recorded suicide attempt is age 6, one child alone."
Would you like to read some suicide stories of children under 13 years old and taking SSRIs...
The easiest ones for me to post are American ones....
HOW MANY HUNDREDS OF STORIES DO YOU WANT TO READ !!!
.... 6 children per day in the USA alone.... 18 or under.... on SSRIs...
I'll edit that - it was studies of 13 while on - not even.. that was a typo.
There is strong belief that a child cannot make the determination for suicide under age 6. I am interested in reading about it. I would have thought that a set of twins at age 5 - either would be newsworthy but not one posting.
The bald guy was Uncle Fester - who I believe was played by a member of the old "our gang" series - Jackie Coogan I think? Funny guy!
The reference to lurch if you saw him would be appropriate. He's a "self help" guru - and even cameod as himself on that Jack Black show years ago where Jack was hypnotised to see all ugly women as their gorgeous inside should be? Anybody remember that one - maybe it was called "skin deep" or something like that?
Love thyself, all of thee
You are who you're s’pose to be
Accept thyself for who you are
Davidornado,
SUPERSTAR!!!!!!!!
Reality - Here's my reality -Got off Lexapro for depression because "I didn't need it anymore" - my choice
Did ok for months then sunk into another depression, so deep, I was almost catatonic, couldn't work, couldn't function and had such death thoughts of me and my loved ones that I couldn't escape. It was a downward spiral and very horifying. Suicide was a real posibility. My family took me back in for meds because I frightened them.
THANK GOD for Antidepressants! They have helped me return to life. I don't know if I will take them forever, I don't know if it's like this for everyone - but - I know my biggest fear is that I might return to that catatonic state and not come back.
Without Anti depressants - I'd be dead. Just typing this is very upsetting to me, but I hope you can see that there are always at least 2 sides to every story.
Anti depressants for me were a gift from God, to get back and be who He wants me to be.
Oh and Reality, Maybe you haven't heard from those you helped, because it didn't last. Perhaps they needed to return to SRIs and don't want to tell you about it.
Not medicating depression kills too. It's just more difficult to document.
The children - That is a tough one, any parent with a severly depressed child goes through a lot it's a difficult rollar coster ride. To medicate or not to medicate is an individuals choice. I'll always repect the parent, they are the ones that know their children
Try to make the Govenrnment serve people and not the mighty dollar - Noble cause - can't argue there , but seems a little too idealilistic for reality.
Where is this letter from? Can you show me the psychological report behind this - saying he was OCD before and that this med was responsible? Where did his mother get her Psych degree to make the determination that you can take away all ability to control free-will and that urges will become overwhelming. How does "not knowing he could get hurt" translate to attempted suicide?
Anecdotes galore.
Are you going to put a report by defunct Dr. Breggin - shyster next? I've been talking to some psychologists in the field to make sure I understand what's in this argument. your information is looking less and less viable to me and others.
[QUOTE=GlenW]Thanks CG - and you should read this link.
IF you were mom - would you go DUH - ok doc - I'll sit and watch my daughter get worse. OR - would you do everything you could to find help?
[/QUOTE]well this is not necessarily a new thing due to anti-depressants. my aunt took my cousin to the doctor and she KNEW something was wrong (this was in the sixties) when he was a baby.
and the doctor turned around a told her to stop being such 'a silly, fussing woman' that there was nothing wrong with her child except a cold and she was being a ridiculous, stupid, over-worried new mother. and when she protested he pulled the 'educated professional' arrogance right out of the bag.
well, he had meningitis and has been brain-damaged ever since. and my aunt (by marriage) had been too unsure of herself to stand up to an 'educated professional'. it happens. fine if you are well-educated and confident and prepared to stand up to this kind of bullsh*t but not everyone is!
it's that that gets me. not doctors getting it wrong but rather their ingrained attitude not letting them be open to anything else. and the attitude 'well, i have a degree, do you? no, therefore i am right.' what????
people are so polarised on this topic --- that is what makes it dangerous. extremism is always dangerous - it distorts the truth.
where is the middle ground. earlier people were going to doctors saying they were having terrible withdrawal side-effects from SSRIs and why could the doctors and pharmas not go.... 'really, well we didn't believe there should be any but we will certainly look into it'
instead of 'nonsense, there are no side-effects because we say so'.
why is everyone so polarised over this. why can't everyone be open and say there are those whose lives have been benefitted beyond repair by meds. glenw being one of them. and those whose lives have been ruined by them.
why get polarised. it is the polarisation of holding on to a position no matter what, which seems to me the problem here regardless of facts staring one in the face. a blank refusal to see anything that doesn't correspond with an already held viewpoint. as someone is shaking and zapping in front of you - saying no you are not because i say it is impossible. what is with that????
you have to be very careful of course, they are strong brain altering chemicals. and if you start to feel paranoid or tense or worse or get other symptoms like muscle tension (where are you, brig???
) --- then look into coming off the drugs. what is so wrong with saying that. if you feel better then stick with it.but those doctors who are rabidly 'pro' will keep on with the drugs at any cost hearing no bad word said about them (it's all in your head) - at best just switching from one to the next .
and those who are 'anti' won't allow a person who could be radically helped to even get that help in the first place.
i don't get it. there seems like such a huge space for middle ground here --- surely we could all meet in the middle.
can we not all agree... that some can and have died from meds and some can and have been radically helped into a life that without the meds would otherwise have been pure hell and misery. and the important thing is everyone is an individual and it is in fact, impossible, to know how their brain is going to react to a certain chemical so to watch and monitor it with a very OPEN mind.
is it so hard to meet in the middle here????
to accept there are truths to both sides here.
is it me? or is it the rest of the world?
Just for you Glen...
I know the mother very well.
http://www.antidepressantsfacts.com/Kara-12-paxil.htm
Thank you Glen. Thank you so much.Reality - you don't want to hear - only listen to yourself - adios.
You still blame the medicine?? The doctor flat out refuses to see a more serious problem with her - and the medicine is at fault? What kind of other-worldly thinking is that??
There was time to change her meds - why would a mother sit when in that situation and not do anything in her power? Is sitting back and letting one doctor say what is best anything? something?
This is a sad thing - but NOT the cause of Paxil. It's a doctor with no heart and a mother with no brain. That's all. I hate to say it - but if it was MY daughter, I'd be running to the nearest alternative doctor with threats of malpractice.
It's like blaming the car because the driver goes 120 mph right into a tree when he could have turned the car. This is garbage and still anecdotal. You prove my point - she knew there was trouble and did nothing. Yes nothing. One doc says leave it - and she caves in.
Sad
Thanks CG - and you should read this link.
IF you were mom - would you go DUH - ok doc - I'll sit and watch my daughter get worse. OR - would you do everything you could to find help?
" A week before the FDA’s contentious hearing on SSRIs and child and adolescent suicidal behaviors, the American College of Neuropsychopharmacology (ACNP) released a preliminary report at a Washington, D.C., press briefing concluding that popular antidepressant medications do not increase suicidal behaviors in patients under age 18 with depression. "
GlenW,
That's old news now... the hearing was Feb 2, 2004.
I wish you would have been there. There were 63 speakers, mostly grieving parents. 2 were "pro drug", 1 took a middle stance and 60 were seriously "anti drug"
The best way to describe the "atmosphere" at the end is...
There was a young woman at the reception table just outside the room. She had been there all day and heard all the speakers. At the end, I gave her some links to more "stories" and suggested she look it up on the reporter's computer who was sitting next to her. She said... "I'll look at it tomorrow... I don't want to cry anymore today".
GlenW,
You're not winning any points here...
"This is a sad thing - but NOT the cause of Paxil. It's a doctor with no heart and a mother with no brain. That's all. I hate to say it - but if it was MY daughter, I'd be running to the nearest alternative doctor with threats of malpractice. "
So, what are you saying.... "DON'T TRUST DOCTORS"! ? Well then... who can you trust ?
And GSK agreed it was caused by Paxil... and settled with the mother.
According to my big time lawyer friends, Eli Lilly hates to settle for more than 0,000, but GSK will settle at 0,000
How about Luvox Glen...
12/26/2003
12-Year Old Attempts Suicide on Luvox
Antidepressants
“He honestly did not know that his actions could kill him.”
Please read my letter and respond. Feel free to use this story, but I ask that it be circulated without my name for the time being. I have enclosed my personal information so that I may receive a response.
I discovered the ICFDA after my son tried to jump out a window in 1997. He was 12 years old and had been taking Luvox for a few months for obsessive compulsive disorder. (My son was not taking medication for depression.) He was lucky enough to be stopped by a teacher passing by in the hallway. I immediately knew it had to be caused by side effects from the drug. His behavior lately had begun to disturb me and I assumed it was because of the Luvox, but when I voiced these concerns to his doctor, I was assured that "Luvox had no side effects". It was as if he suddenly became unaware of consequences. I merely put two and two together: the drug was supposed to alleviate obsessive compulsive thought, and obsessive compulsive thought is excessive worry over possible consequences. This medicine was eliminating his worries by eliminating his awareness of consequences, but it eliminated his ability to process real and likely consequences along with the unrealistic and unlikely consequences. He honestly did not know that his actions could kill him.
As I began to research of the side effects of SSRIs, I came across the ICFDA website and have been a subscriber every since 1997. I corresponded with Mark Miller a few years ago and had benefited greatly from his guidance. I was able to put together a well researched presentation to my son's school psychologist and a few teachers regarding the dangers of SSRIs and I'd like to think that I've at least had some impact on making people aware of these dangers. Since the school library prides itself on maintaining books that provide a broad range of viewpoints on any given subject, the library accepted Dr. Tracy's book that I donated. (They previously had just a couple of books that only extolled the virtues of SSRIs).
During the last six years I have struggled with how to share my experience without violating my son's privacy. It has been very difficult for me to weigh the damage I may cause to my son's peace of mind that has been so difficult to attain, and my need to be a part of preventing the horrors that can come from the side effects of SSRIs, especially in children. Now that this matter is finally before the Senate, I would to contribute, but I need more information about testifying or attending.
I had contacted Anuja Patel at the FDA and received a response regarding testifying at the hearings on February 2, but I am unsure if this means I will absolutely have this opportunity. I read in the drugawareness newsletter that speakers have already been scheduled, so I would like to know if it is possible to secure a time slot.
Unlike other parents who have suffered the ultimate loss because of these side effects, my son is alive. He is alive and can speak for those who can no longer speak. He can testify that he "was not in his right mind" and that he never intended to kill himself.
My son is a college freshman now. He is very intelligent, articulate and respected by his peers and his teachers. I would like to know if it is possible for him to testify at the Senate hearings.
I would greatly appreciate any further information you can give me about attending and/or speaking at the Senate hearings. Thank you.
Sincerely,