Crawlers Unite! | ADHD Information

That is the website about reflexes, and you may also google "moro reflex", which is considered one of the main culprits of anxiety.

~ogram~39425.386724537

jpmomagain wrote: That is the website about reflexes, and you may also google "moro reflex", which is considered one of the main culprits of ADHD and anxiety.

Can you please supply us with the conclusive medically scientific research and/or data that indicates and concludes that the moro reflex is considered the main culprit of ADHD? I am not looking for opinions from an author. I am looking for the documented research from medical science. Thanks.

Sam E39409.9008564815

I have read alot (but not all) of the great info you all have on this thread. May I ask one question -

Are you or your kids mostly hyperactive type - or inattentive - or both?

Some of the reading I have done makes me think the peristance of these reflexes tend to cause hyperactivity. My son is inattentive type. Does the book tell how to check for the presence of these reflexes?

Okay that's two questions. Thanks

When I try to google INP or INPP, I find nothing about reflexes. Am I using
the wrong letters. When I tried to go to the website that someone posted a
few pages back, there was nothing there. I'm interested in doing the online
reflex testing that someone mentioned being on the INPP site.

Also, what is MindMoves and do you still have a copy you would email.....????

Has anyone been to the Bender Clinic and been evaluated? I ask because I was getting ready to order the DVD and wondered if I would learn enough from the DVD to do the exercises or is going to the clinic essential. I'm afraid that I'm not going to provide the correct amount of resistance.

I guess I feel like I would miss something by viewing the DVD and therefore cheat my son in the long run.

Also, how are you adults doing the exercises? How do you provide resistance or do you just crawl. My son would never provide resistance for me. He's not even going to want to do the exercises.

Thanks.

The book is called Stopping ADHD and it is written by two authors, O'Dell and Cook. They have a website where you can get more information:

You can also get used books on Amazon for less than the book costs in the stores. I have purchased a number of them this way.

Good luck to you and let us know if the exercises help.

ms.mom39247.5517708333

LITD, did you send your request to the moderator? I know it's a huge thread by now.

I have the DVD, and it is available on the website. I'm glad I got the DVD to complement the written instructions!

I see a posted info site for INPP where they have the online tests for all of the reflexes, which is great! I had such a hard time finding all the info on all of them in one handy place, and could not even find a test for the STNR anywhere. We totally went on symptoms alone. I'm glad they have that available now, and will check it out later!

ms.mom39304.7471527778

Hello everyone,

I was just looking in on this thread and saw that my name has been removed from beginning where it tells who started this thread.

Weird. It says someone named "guests" started it. That is pretty impossible since the thread was started in 2006 and the person named "guests"'s last visit to this site was in 2003.

Just to set the record straight, I started this thread. I love the crawling program. It has helped me more than any other thing I have tried for my ADD.

Why would someone change my name from the original starter of this thread?

Anni

I have just read the first post and it isn't the first post of this thread. The first posts are missing from this thread.

That is disappointing. Perhaps it is a computer thing. But there are other threads with more posts.

It makes me wonder what was there. I should have saved them on my computer or something.

Anni

On a positive note. . .

I have read more this summer than any other summer in my life! I love to pick up a book now and it is hard to put it down. I read on our trip to CA. I had to buy a book at a store along the way because my hubby packed the books I brought along under the seat and I thought I left them at our house! I can't believe the change in me. Reading has not an activity of choice throughout my life, but it has changed.

i have a suggestion for this thread - should make a sticky with all of the FAQs on it, and then do a weekly check-in in separate threads?

i have another question - is the crawling video available on DVD, and if so, does anyone have a link? thanks in advance.

GC, I answered your other thread regarding the DVD details. Good luck! :-) Hi, all. I'm new to this and searching for answers. I found a discussion about the Bender therapy on another forum with someone who completed the therapy. She feels it was a waste of time and believes the Dore treatment is better. Any thoughts?

Hi lostinthedark

saw your post about the bender programme and whether it is useful, the main aim of the programme is to suppress the primitive relfexes which remain active long after they should be. It is believed that many learning difficulties and balance issues etc are because these reflexes have never shut down. the bendre programme does help to suppress the reflexes which is its aim.

I do not know what your issues are with looking for a treatment but usually the reflexes are only a part of a adult or childs problems and the treatment on its own will not solve them all. The Dore programme incorporatse exercises into their treatment which will suppress the reflexes that are found to be still active in their initial assessment and treats all their other difficulties in learning IE ADD/HD, dyslexia, dyspraxia, aspergers etc. My daughter Leila was positive to ATNR on starting Dore and was negative when she finished.

Dore is expensive there is the Learning Breakthough programme but as far as we know they do not deal with the reflexes so there are those who are doing it incorporate them into their exercise regime to make sure they are dealing with all the issues.

If you have a child or yourself who has a multitude of learning problems, then the reflexes alone will not solve them. It is better to go to Dore and deal with all of their issues than to just do the bender programme and find it only deals with part of it and the child/adult still continues to struggle. A friend of mine locally took two of her children on the treatment and it did suppress the reflexes but they still had learning issues which remained but she wa unaware of the Dore or learning breakthrough programme at the time.

Hope this helps you and let us know. Ellie XXX

Lostinthedark, that was probably me that you saw on the other forum.

Please let me clarify.

I did the therapy with my son. We both did it. I felt some very positive benefits from it. So did my son, though not as clearly as I did. IT was definitely worth doing.

I felt it may have been a waste of time for him, since he was later undergoing the Dore program, and I recently found out that they in fact DO wrap up any of the remaining reflexes into their therapy. They just did not make that very clear to me at the time I was searching for that answer. So for him, perhaps doing it that way was a waste of time.

The Bender therapy WAS beneficial, it is not a waste of time, but for someone undergoing the Dore therapy, they say that all the reflexes will be taken care of during the program, and that if anyone tested positive in the initial evaluation, they will test as negative at the end.

If you just want to work on the reflexes, it is an excellent program, as well as the MindMoves program I believe I also posted about.

Also, the reflex therapies, I believe, only take care of some of the issues, and the more I learn about these things, it can part be a multifaceted approach to help these children, but not a one-and-only fix-it-all sort of thing.

Thanks for the quick reply, Calicorose. I hope I have this right. So, in your opinion, the reflex therapies only take care of some of our children's issues. Which issues will the reflex therapies help? Sorry for all the questions, but I'm trying to get as much information as I can before I sign up for more therapies. yes, lostinthedark, the reflexes only take care of some things. After that, there still may be more work to do!

I was given permission to pass on the MindMoves booklet, which is the best all-in-one tidbit I have come across that explains all of the reflexes, how they my affect learning and other issues, and how to correct them. They are geared for the young set. There is also a book that the sets come from that is mentioned in there, and I would highly recommend it, can't think of the name at the moment. If you would like the tidbit booklet though (its a lot of pages) let me know by pm and I can get it to you. Just let me know.

So MindMoves is better than the Stopping ADD book? My child does not have learning problems just ADD. Which program would be better for her?
Lostinthedark39276.9120601852I think MindMoves is better, it shows all of the primitive reflexes and how to test for them. I think I forgot that part. To test is simple, and they seem silly, but they are actually verifiable neurological tests. You don't want to be walking around with primitive reflexes still present. ADHD is caused by so many things, it may be worth your while to check if your daughter still has any of the reflexes present, if not, than I would not bother with any of the Bender or MindMOves activities. I don't recall there being a very good test for the STNR in the Bender book. For the STNR, either program would work just as well. Just make sure you test for them first, and don't bother if she's clear.

Programs such as Dore and Learning Breakthrough target higher neurological issues and ones that occur a little later in developmental life. The lady that does the MindMoves program clears the reflexes first for the children, then works with them with LearningBreakthrough, or the children go on to the Dore program, or she has other activities they do to do whatever it is it does neurologically and I cannot explain it this late at night!

Hope that helps. Let me know if you have more questions, I'll do my best!
Yes, I can say from experience, yes there are!

sorry, it must seem like i'm here at the computer 24/7........Sigh.......
calicorose39277.921400463

Stimulant medication has been around sinced the 1950's and tons of research has been done on ADHD medications, real credible research by medical science and when used as directed by a competent physician, medication has been proven to be the most safe and effective method of treatment for ADHD. Any medication can be dangerous if its abused or not sued as directerd. Studies done are only as good as the person or people conducting them. When the study is done by the person selling the product or method, I don't give it much credence.

Hi Sam E,

It took me a loooooooooong time to see your post. Sorry.

Anyways, in case you ever see this post again: On their website and books (I own two of Dr. Goddard's books), they discuss the work they have done with children, with "before" and "after" pictures of their handwriting, some drawings and a short story written by each child (pre and post treatment). You can see a big difference in performance and organization.

As far as conclusive research, I think we all wish there were enough research to reach any conclusions on any type of treatment. Not even medications have proved safe and effective for children as of yet in the several medicalt trials conducted for children.

I found a paper that might help you, although I don't know how to do a link. It is "Primitive Reflexes and Attention-Deficit/Hyperactivity Disorder: Developmental Origins of Clasroom Dysfunction" It is in the International Journal of Special Education 2004, Vol. 19, No. 1. It is by Myra Taylor, Stephen Houghton and Elaine Chapman of the University of Western Australia. This paper is well controlled and thorough.

This paper shows a correlation between retention of the Moro, ATNR, STNR and TLR reflexes and adhd symptoms. The moro is not the most important reflex for adhd.. STNR and TLR retention levels were linked to higher levels of adhd symtoms. But the moro reflex comes earlier in life, and it is indirectly related to adhd symptoms because it impacts the inhibition of the other reflexes.

I do find it very difficult to study this stuff because the journals are not in pub med. Does anyone know a database for education journals?

In their book Stopping ADHD, O'dell and Cook show a study (although not very well controlled) that the crawling exercises do work on inhibiting the STNR reflex. Their study doesn't show much else because it is too small. I did email them and they believe that the STNR is the most important reflex for helping adhd.

So as far as I can tell, there is a good scientific study by an independent research group that some of these reflexes are retained in adhd kids. THen there is the study by odell and cook showing that the STNR reflex can be inhibited. Looks very promising, but the final step of showing that inhibiting these reflexes helps with adhd symptoms has not been shown conclusively.

Hi bubbles,

The books I have from Dr. Sally Goddard talk a lot about all those reflexes, and it sounds like a promising theory for promising treatments on moro reflex, STNR, ATNR, etc.

I tried their INPP exercises from a INPP practitioner, and they worked wonders at first, but then they didn't work any longer. So I am still doing OT w/ my son, with much success, but lots of work at home and therapies twice a week with his OT.

My experience so far with crawling has been good. I started with my son in October and in November the teacher gave him "Student of the Month". This is a big deal for him. He has gotten so many yellow slips since starting school last year. This was really unexpected. We had been crawling for about 3 weeks at that time. She said that it was like he was not in the class. Well with the holidays, we slacked off and he started getting in trouble again.

So, I strongly believe that his "good" behavior was related to the crawling.

We have lately been trying neurofeedback and have not been doing the crawling for lack of time. His behavior has not been like it was in November since we stopped crawling.

jpmomagain - could you share with me what you are doing at home with the OT. Our therapist doesn't give us anything to do at home but physical exercise. My son has problems with his vestibular system.

Thanks.

Hi tegary,

My first and original OT tested JP and concluded that he had an underresponsive vestibular system. She proved it to me by sitting him on a rotating swing. She spun my son 25-30 times, and he was not dizzy at all, he stood and walked a straight line, and his eyes were not moving in circles like you see in people after spinning several times (this reflex is called "nystagmus").

She prescribed a "sensory diet" which consists of: brushing (DPPT technique), joint compressions, spinning, and then "heavy work" exercises for the muscles.

The spinning consisted on sitting him on an office chair and spinning him rapidly until he felt dizzy. At first (we started on 9/06), it would take abouth 12-15 spins on each direction, and gradually, it became less and less. Now he can't tolerate it, so we have been variating the vestibular input (jumping up and down, linear movement as in a scooter, etc.). Of course, the best vestibular input comes from the suspended equipment (swings) they have at the OT's.

My ds gets pretty silly and impulsive after vestibular input, so he needs a lot of heavy work to calm him down and put him in a "just right" state (not too high, not too low).

His vestibular system is pretty functional right now, and we are fine-tuning it with his sensory diets and his listening therapy, which provides another type of vestibular input through music.

We've moved since we first started with his OT, and we have switched OTs twice, but none of them has been as good as the first one. The second actually made him regress, and her approach to vestibular input was different (slow spinning w/ eyes closed).

So now I'm working with an OT here who executes the sensory diets prescribed by our first OT over the phone, and they keep in touch. We fly to see this OT whenever money allows.

I hope this has helped!

Hey Sam E, I've actually started back to crawling with my two. We did it back about two years ago because my son was having problems in school. During that time he made student of the month and the teacher even commented that she hated to say anything because she thought it might jinks it, but it was like he wasn't in the room and she couldn't believe it.

Unfortunately, I stopped doing it because it was so time consuming. I have done it a little bit over the last two years but after the first 8 weeks, you have to do three of the laps on your knees. That really worked on me and took me forever because of the pain in my knees. Then I developed vertigo problems and couldn't do them, and the bending over may have caused the vertigo.

I've gotten that fixed thru therapy, and now my husband does the crawling on the knees and I do everything else. I trully believe it helps. The clinic that tests and supports the crawling is run by two elderly ladies and I don't think they are actively pushing the program, like someone out to make money. I've called their clinic before and spoke to one of them.

What I've seen... My 7yo has been having attention problems in school and the teacher has commented on how he is doing so well now with answering questions and paying attention.

The 10yo is homeschooled right now and he has be more pleasant and has been paying attention to things he never did before. For example, in the past if I told him to go turn a light off, he would first not hear me and then argue with me about it, eventually being forced to do it in the end. Now, he can be watching TV and he will get up and go turn off any light he sees on and without asking him. I've been in the bathroom and he will turn the light off on me.

He's also been concerned with my 7yo not cleaning his plate after he finishes eating and wants to do it for him.

All that said, I've started giving both iron and vit C pretty consistently also. But, from our first experience with the crawling, I'm almost 100% sure it's the crawling.

Also, I just got hooked on researching iodine deficiency and have tested the 10yo to find that he has problems with this. You might want to check into iron and iodine deficiencies.

My sons have been seeing a doc who checks four different iron labs because the one usually checked may show no deficiency, so their other labs are showing deficiencies.

P.S. I do remember reading in the thread about one of the poster's daughter finishing the program with success.

Hope this helps.
Meant to mention that I'm using my sister's laptop since mine crashed. So, I'll be taking it back to her today and hopefully will be getting mine back soon, if you respond.
tegary40170.5894791667

I think your on the right track with the deficiency issues. I've been dealing with my kids adhd issues for years and what I do know is that deficiencies and/orallergies can produce adhd like symptoms.

Home schooling can be better for these kids because they respond well one on one. There isn't tons of distractions around them or tons of external stimulation from other kids so they are better able to listen

As a parent I think sometimes we don't give ourselves enough credit and attribute a change in behavior to a tool being used instead of recognizing good parenting skills. These kids go through phases with behavior and sometimes they are well behaved when we don't expect them to be. My kid had also gotten student of the month before I even had him on treatment and when he got the award I thought I was dreaming. Another thing is that as these kids grow, they learn how to compensate for their difficulties and after consistently teaching them a skill,eventually they learn it. Sometimes we see what we want to see too. Not saying this the case with you and I really appreciate your sharing your results.

As far as the elderly ladies that own this clinic, I personally spoke with them and they claim to be doctors but aren't. Oh boy, real red flag.

That's pretty fraudulent and misleading so it makes me question their agenda. They are not doctors and this is a business and they wouldn't be in it if they weren't making lots of money. They don't have to get out there and promote their business because they get good parents to do it on these message boards

The woman that started this thread I think is the one that was saying it worked for her kid and she kept promoting that book over and over and over. Another big red flag. Anyway, jus my opnion and thanks for responding tegary.

You're right. I don't know what is normal now. Sometimes I think he is normal acting then he has a meltdown like today with a lot of anger and aggression. But, I can tickle him and he will change up and is happy. My sister-in-law and a friend tell me that he's fine, that their kids do that, but I see him with other kids and see him struggle to get them to talk with him and play with him and carrying on topic conversations.

His self-esteem is so damaged. We started him on Straterra last week at night and moved that to day this morning. He has been so sleepy today and just out of it. We did this because he told me before Christmas break that he wanted to go back to school, but I don't think he can handle the schoolwork or the teachers demands. All he wants to do is play and play and play. It's his way or he can't cope with it.

He has other issues to like an arachnoid cyst that I'm looking at getting him another neurology appt, because he has had a few Alice in Wonderland migraines and one real migraine, and he has started hallunicating at night when he has a fever.

You know you really don't know who to trust when you are looking for answers to these kinds of problems. My husband and I feel the crawling helps him. And, maybe it's what I think I'm seeing, but I try to go by what others tell me that they see in the kids, like their teachers. I don't tell people what we do because I think most would think it's crazy, but I heard Dr. James Dobson on Focus on the Family say that crawling was so important for neurodevelopment. He's a psychologist.

I think they say in their book that they are PhD's, not medical doctors. Of course I have this problem (add) and can't find the book right now. ;-)

And, my parenting skills have really been lacking since dealing with my son's problems. It has really fried my brain.

Blessings and Merry Christmas!
Hi,

It is a shame that this thread has kind of lost its
momentum -

I am new to the forum but have been doing the crawling
exercises with my 9-year old ADD daughter for a few
months now and we are now in Phase 3. We crawl five times
a week.

Changes have been many, some subtle some not so subtle.
What is evident that she is able to participate in school
and do reasonably well with less medication. This is in
and of itself a huge change. I made a list of
behaviors/difficulties she had when we began and I often
look at it to remind myself how far we've come.

Tegary - you are right, they (O'Dell and Cook), have
Ph.D.s in learning disabilities from Purdue University.
Both are professors emeriti at the School of Education at
the University of Indianapolis.
Just wondering if anyone is still crawling or finished the program with success? Hi everyone,
I am so glad I found this threat. I will be reading it word by word.

At the moment I doing the crawling exercise with my son. We are in week 3 or 4.

Hopefully, some other people will join here again.

Annika
I am going on holiday for 2 weeks today but we will be doing the crawling every day. Hope to meet someone here when I am back
Annika
Hey Annika, I don't check the email I have tied to this forum that often, so sorry about missing your posts. I started the crawling again back last year, but I have two boys to do and I've been having problems with my joints and vertigo, so I can't keep doing the rocking and stuff. I think the bending over has caused the vertigo. I got my husband to do a lot of the crawling part, but my shoulder hurts so bad now, I can't stand the rocking back on my shoulder joint.

I've thought about trying to start back and get my husband to do the rocking and I do the crawling because I really feel that this has helped them the most.

We have also found a doctor who did a lot of testing on him and found a lot wrong with he biochemistry. We have been working on getting that straight since this summer. Hope you had a Merry Christmas.

Luvmykids0240538.7803703704Annika, are you the orginal starter of this thread many moons ago that went by the name Annie? Just curios.This thread seemed to die at some point so I guess there werent too many happy campers. I would also like to know how successful anyone was with this program and whether they crawled their way to a cure. In going through this thread I observed that there was great interest in this method but it seems no one ever comes back saying the treatment was sucessful and their child was cured. I guess the promters of this method were very succesful as far as marketing strategies. I really hope someone can come back and say a few years later that this method worked. Anyone?I just have a quick question, I'm pretty sure my son crawled for the full term that was required, and he doesn't have the tendency to sit on his legs, does this mean that this isn't that cause of his ADD/ADHD? If so, will these crawling excercises help? I'll certainly still try the excercises, if anything it'll be a fun thing we can do together, I'm just curious as to whether or not it'll improve anything.

IMac38942.9401967593I did?

IMac38942.9406365741

IMac,

She actually saw my posts on here and invited me to her website. She has done a lot of work. I have been there and have posted about my crawling.

[QUOTE=IMac]Perhaps Anni could communicate with Ylenia, what a lovely name; very musical. Her site is gorgeous and she has spent time posting so much information. I couldn't find a follow-up to her blog entry about trying the exercises with her son, but I haven't read everything on her site, yet. There is a discussion forum just waiting for people and I'm sure she would appreciate the contact. It's a shame for someone to go to that much work and not get more feedback from the public. [/QUOTE]

Hmmm, a compliment? No. I must be reading that wrong. How did you find the site? The excercises haven't been tried yet.

IMac38942.9378009259Well,

I've been going to a library at a UAMS (a medical university in my home town) and researching the cerebellum. From this I figured out a lot of exercises for myself. The rest of them I got from watching their DVD (if you pause it you can see the instructions for the bean-bag throwing to the floor exercise and the leaning side to side, forwards and backwards exercise, plus they explain the theory of their approach --they try to stimulate the various functions of the cerebellum equally), reading the news links off their site (where other exercises were being described).

By going to the medical library and reading journals I was able to come up with one or two of their exercises before I even saw it in their video!

The cerebellum is like a really fast math-coprocessor for the brain. It can take in multiple channels of input (vestibular, auditory, occular, signals from other parts of the brain), and anything that the brain has learned previously, it can "automate" it, including the retrieval of information responsible not only for motor movement, but for cognition and memory as well. Anyway, exercises are just designed to challenge the cerebellum's ability to perform different combinations of these functions at the same time so it grows and gets more efficient.

Here's an interesting finding: People who have lesions on their cerebellum from injuries (for example alcoholism), and people who have cerebellar disease, begin to experience problems with working memory and selective attention. This is how Dore knew to look to the cerebellum in the first place.

I'm sorry my posts are so long! I hope people don't just start skipping over me!

Oh, I've GOT to find a way to get a wobble board. Can I buy one from someone after they complete the program? I may just have to buy some wood, go borrow my dad's skill saw, and make myself one! I'll get one somehow!

Wade, you better keep posting those long informative posts. I have a really tough time understanding exactly HOW this stuff works. My emphasis, what I can grasp, is on the end result. The way you explain the cerebellar function in ADHD ties together the reading and research I've read as well, I just cannot begin to try to pass that information on in any way! Brain/mouth barrier you know.... So please, bring on the information. People, on the board, and from everywhere around the world can read this and know there are other ways to approach their ADHD symptoms if they wish.

As for the wobble board, physical therapists use them, so you might try doing a search for suppliers. The Dore wobble board is a bit more stout that actually their previous one the used to sell. So do try to check them out if you can, as it does make a difference on how easy or hard you find the exercises to do.

How is the crawling exercises going for you? Are you getting sore anywhere yet?

Oh, and there is a specific Dore thread going here also, here on the alts, a bit further down, and you are welcome to post your Dore stuff there, if you like. I will be catching up with that thread more when DS starts there back up again in December.

I know that doing cartwheels was impossible for me. I tried for an entire summer to do a back bend and never could do one of those either. I am going to see if I can do these things after the whole program. So we will see.

Wade, I'm shocked at the Dore price now! OHMYGOSH.......

How/where did you get the Dore exercises? They are really simple (on paper, huh). My son and I had fun with them the month he did them. His balance is actually really good, mine reeks, on both legs! LOL. I fell a lot as a kid, and am very clumsy. I'm thinking about doing the Dores with him when he startes back up, particularly using the balance board. They use this in stroke and head-injury therapy. I've not noticed any balance issues improving with the Bender Program, but will keep that on the radar screen. I think there are many more surpises in store for us, and I enjoy not knowing for sure how the changes will pop into my own life. DS is also still surprised by his ability to focus in the classroom, and get his work done in class, where he would end up bringing a lot home in the past.

Anni, you be careful doing backbends and cartwheels, none of us are 9 anymore.

Hey I was wonder if we could do a quick pole:

Has any body in this group noticed any asymmetries to their balance, like not being able to balance on one leg as well as the other? Whenever I started doing Dore exercises I noticed this (I didn't actually go to the clinic, btw). I can balance way better on my left foot than my right.

And another thing: It would interesting to know whether our balance in general will improve over the course of crawling. Has anyone thought to try to keep track of this?

Wow, Wade, you are so creative in coming up with solutions! Good for you!

I am starting the foot pull of the ninth week and I came up with a more comfortable way for my daughter to help me crawl. I put my ankle weights on my ankles and tie a string like yarn to them. My daughter can walk behind me and give the tug and then resistance. The thing I worry about it that the helper is supposed to keep the crawler's feet flat on the floor. But I seem to be able to keep them flat myself, so it seems to be working.

I'm glad you are joining us. It is great to have you here. Let us know how it goes.

[QUOTE=susan b.] Hi Calico and Other Crawlers-

We are now on week 14 of the Bender exercises. Another Sunday, another opportunity to observe Natalie sitting in church. Her behavior in social situations where sitting is required continues to outperform her little sister's behavior. We went out to lunch after church and she was totally appropriate at the restaurant. She sat well in church and the restaurant. She is so much more compliant than she had been. She is not as dependent on watching t.v., she is not melting down as frequently, she is seeming so much more age appropriate. She is more interested in reading. She is helping around the house more without excessive complaining. She may initially resist, but she will do what you ask her whereas before you had to continually argue with her to get her to do what you wanted her to do. It will be really interesting to see how well she does in the fourth grade, coming up.

[/QUOTE]

Susan, I love how Natalie is being helped!! I am excited for her! One thing that I was really interested in was her improvement in reading. I have never been a big reader. I love to read in sporadic moments. I would read Harry Potter books to my kids when the books came out. I had to hyperfocus on them and we would usually read them in a couple of days.

This summer I started reading Harry Potter again, starting with book one. I can't believe that I have ended my summer having finished book 4 and beginning book 5. I have never before read that much in the summer by my own choice. I have read lots for school, but never just casually reading for enjoyment. It was really fun. I have also noticed that I could keep all the information from the book straight. Harry Potter books are complicated as they go along and it has always been really hard for me to keep track of everything going on. I would always as my daughter to tell me the details after we had read them because I could not keep track of them. But this summer, I actually have enjoyed reading and keeping all the information in my head. It has been really nice.

[QUOTE=calicorose]

First update via my son!!!

Today he shared with me that in science class, after finishing their worksheets, the students could have "free time" meaning chitchat and up and around class. Some of the students finished before him and were carrying on, yet he was surprisingly able to concentrate and focus on his paperwork despite what he felt were distractions for him in the past. It really surprised him, and that was like the first thing he shared with me when he got home!

[/QUOTE]

Calico,

What a wonderful improvement!!! And that he could actually tell the difference in himself is even more wonderful! It sounds like he really is happy to be able to work in school!! That is awesome!

[QUOTE=scribe]

Keep up the encouraging posts calicorose and susan b. It is helping us to keep motivated. We are now in week five so I will let you know as we progress and note any changes I see with Kelly. The exercises seem to be getting easier for us now. We're able to do them right through without taking breaks in between. That, in itself is encouraging. She is going to start high school next week and will be playing field hockey so I worry that the new schedule will encroach upon our progress.

Keep posting, it helps us all!

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scribe, I am waiting anxiously to see if the crawling has helped Kelly yet. Keep in touch!! It is good to hear from you.

Calicorose,

That is great news. Keep up the hard work.

We've just completed week four.

Hi Scribe! Good to hear you are still with us! How are you guys doing with the exercises?

They are not really HARD, but they did hurt us for a while. They don't hurt us anymore, but our arms are getting stronger now, as we are doing the "slapper" ones, because of balancing on one arm and moving at the same time. Those are in part two.

It's nice there are a few of us moving right along together. Keep checking in, OK?

First update via my son!!!

ok. thanks for the info. i dont know if i crawed much as a baby or not. I"ll
have to ask my mom.Hi-

I wanted to share this behavioral improvement in my daughter Natalie with everyone. If you're following our work, we're in week 13 of the Bender crawling exercises. As a bit of history, we have tried the major alternative therapies with little success - 60 sessions of neurofeedback and 9 1/2 months of the Dore Achievement Center. We're currently on a six month hiatus from the Dore to complete the crawling exercises. We briefly tried strattera on Natalie but she couldn't tolerate the meds -she would throw them up. It got to the point that she would even gag before attempting to swallow the pill. Given her small size (10th% for weight, 25th% for height), we really didn't want to give her anything that would curb her appetite and/or stunt her growth. This is just one reason why we've pursued alternatives so doggedly.

In May I cashed in some frequent flier miles and flew Natalie to see Dr. Nancy O'Dell in Indianapolis. She diagnosed Natalie with a retained symmetric tonic neck reflex (STNR) and prescribed the crawling exercises for her. She also said that it takes a while to see improvements, but when you do see them, they will be about three months into the program.

So now three months into the crawling exercises I have the following to share. Yesterday I took Natalie to the grocery store. Her behavior in general has been better, so I've been willing to do things that maybe I wouldn't do with her before - like take her to the grocery store. Her usual behavior at the grocery store is to ask me constantly to buy things (especially junk foods), and to pull things off of shelves. When I say "no" to something she will typically argue and whine. You can see why I don't like to take her shopping with me!

At the store yesterday, and before we even left, she decided (on her own) to bring a piece a paper and a book that she could draw on while I shopped (never has happened before!). She asked for items (not as many as usual), but this time she also asked for some reasonable things that were healthy. She didn't melt down (or even argue) when I said no to the junk items she mentioned. She literally spent most of her time sitting in a kiddie cart drawing! It was PLEASANT!!! She is so much less oppositional. At church yesterday she sat during the 1 1/2 hour service. She is sitting still so much better now too. Usually her younger (7 yr. old) sister surpasses Natalie in behavior, but yesterday Natalie's behavior was better than her sisiter's - like you would expect a sibling who is two years older would be.

Thought this might be an encouragement to those who are not as far along.

[QUOTE=candyhound21410]sorry, but what is a crawler?[/QUOTE]

This is an extremely long post and I know it is hard to start at the beginning and try to follow it, so I will summarize, and so can others who post here.

I read the book called Stopping ADHD by O'Dell and Cook. The idea in the book is that ADHD is caused in 75% of all cases by a reflex in our bodies that we don't notice, but that makes us uncomfortable. This reflex is in all people when they are babies. It is a reflex that urges us to straighten our arms or legs when all four are bent at the same time. The authors say that if we did not crawl enough as babies, that this reflex will stay with us and control us, causing ADHD symptoms. There are exercises in the book, crawling exercises basically, that will mature this reflex and make you comfortable.

I did not crawl much as a baby because I was in casts and shoes with a bar inbetween. When I read the book, I was very interested in it for that reason.

I have done about 8 weeks of the exercises and I keep on doing them slowly. It probably isn't as effective for me to do them this way. I should do them more consistenly. But I have noticed so many differences that I find it amazing. I am so glad others are finding help too from these exercises.

We call ourselves that "crawlers" because it is a funny way to try and help your ADHD or ADD, but it really seems to work for me and others here. It is a permanent solutions, which is a major breakthrough in ADHD in my opinion.

Hope that answers your question.

I am so happy to read all the positive posts!!! Way to go guys!! I am still crawling away, not consistently but still going! I need to start with a partner that will do the middle section of exercises with me, and I loaned out both of my books to my son and to a friend, so I hope I remember them well enough to know what to do!! Looks like I will have to order another book off Amazon!

I am so happy to hear that some of you are feeling what I have been feeling!! I can't wait really, to get to the end. It is taking me too long!! But I will keep on going. I am doing very well off medication still.

Keep posting!!! If all our hard work will help us, think how many more ADD sufferers it can help too!

[QUOTE=sunmiguel]

Question to the crawlers:

Does this only work if you did not crawl as a baby? Or is there a chance that it might work for me if I started crawling and walking normally. sorry about skipping 52 pages, but its time for me to stop "tunneling" and get some sleep...

Good night

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I think that if you crawled as a baby, that you might not have crawled long enough to mature the reflex. The way to tell is to look at the symptoms in the book or go to the web site and see if the symptoms there are what you are experiencing. If they fit, then you might benefit from the exercises. It can't hurt to try them.

Good luck to you.

One other thing, if you want to call it an improvement, I don't get on here and post very much anymore. I am more into getting things done that I am working on. I feel like I don't waste as much time on the computer. Interesting, but it is helping me with that too.sorry, but what is a crawler?

Wade, I'm impressed you read all those pages, I've not done that! Well, Welcome aboard. I really LOVE all the ideas you fellas come up with for modifications. You are so handy, and, CONSTRUCTIVE!

It takes a passion, patience, persistence, and most of all, FAITH to start and keep going. I"m glad you all are here, and we are here for each other. All those things have begun to pay off for me and DS. It is well worth giving it a go. We are just starting into week 11 here.

So Wade, keep us abreast of how it is going for you, and the adaptations you make to make it work for you. I wonder if we can get all of the modifications and present them to the Bender Center for an updated edition of their book, if they would have it!

Thanks for letting us know you have joined us, and we are here for you, you can check in anytime, good or bad.

Hi everyone,

I've read all 54 pages of this post and have decided to become a crawler with you guys! I have all the symtoms (to a T) of STNR.

I have a solution to the rocking forwards and backwards thing without a partner:

1) Use brettlongmore's idea of 3 ft rubber bungie cords with hooks. Hook them to something solid like hooks drilled into the wall. In my case, my window seal is low and sturdy enough that I was able to raise the window, hook it, then close the window to keep the things from popping out. Next, connect it to a backpack.

2) Buy one of those big (mine is 75cm) rubber balls that you use for Pilates workouts. Air it up as tight as it will go. Place it between your butt and the wall. Depending on your height and the size of the ball, you may have to place a phone book or something underneath the ball to make it even with your rear-end. If the bungie cords are placed correctly, they should be stretching just a little bit around either side of the ball. This will keep it in place (your legs will too).

3) Make sure you adjust the back pack straps so that when your legs are 90 degrees from the floor, the bungie cords don't have any slack in them and the ball is tight against your butt.

4) Viola! Rock forwards against the bungie cords and backwards against the ball! Works like a charm... :)
Wade38950.7492708333Thanks so much Calicrose! I've read lots of your posts. I wanted to do the Dore method but I heard it is up to 00 now!!!

Anyway, lucky for me, I think this crawling stuff fits me better anyway. My mom just called me tonight after she found my baby book. I was her first child and so she wrote everything down diligently. Although I was already convinced that I have STNR still by reading everyone's posts, I had no idea it could possibly be this bad until tonight. Here's some of my "firsts" from my babybook:

Sat up by himself on 2/27 Baby crawled 4/23, also reached for a toy. Stood up by himself alone on 6/2. Walked by himself for the first time on 6/29. July 16th climbed some stairs.
This means that at best I crawled for just over 2 months (with me being 9 months old)! Here's the best part: My mom said that so many other family members had bragged how soon their children started walking, that she was convinced that it was "good" if I could be an early walker too. So, instead of letting me crawl, she said I was in a walker for most of those two months. Also, my dad confirmed this but added that I liked walking during this period of time by pushing a little red wagon. Also, my mom said that our house had a cold, wood floor. So, if she didn't have me in the walker she was holding me. She said the only time she let me crawl was on a blanket when she was playing with me (that she can remember).

This makes for an interesting test of Annidagostini's theory that the reason for her swift progress is due to having been in those casts. I might have crawled as little as she did. At worst, I may have only gotten a couple of solid weeks in of actual crawling, if that! My dad's memory confirms this as well.

Well, I should be getting my book tomorrow. I hope to begin tomorrow night. I will definitely keep you all posted on my progress. I will try to do this weekly, especially if I notice anything. I will do it religiously too, best I can without a partner anyway!

As far as doing the middle section when you need someone to tug on your leg, I wonder if a pully system would work. Some way to pull on a rope (whenever you hear your recorder say "crawl"). The rope passes from your hand back to a pully attached to the wall (or floor). The rope passes over the pully, and back to your leg. It would be an easy system to construct and use. It sounds like cheating though, I'm not sure. We need to find out.

Sorry the name crawlers unite caught my attention. I was thinking toddler ADDers posting , couldn't help but wonder what they would post about.