Does anyone else have a success story doing the exercises?

Would really appreciate any feedback from someone else other than Anni because then it would appear more real that it does work.

IMac,

She actually saw my posts on here and invited me to her website.  She has done a lot of work.  I have been there and have posted about my crawling.

Lara,

I hope it works for your children.  I know that it has worked for me.  I think that if the STNR reflex is what is causing the ADD or the ADHD in your children, then it will work.  It has worked for me,

Please everybody,  don't listen to the other Anni here on this board.  This is somebody who is trying to act like me and is saying things that I would not say.  So,  please look for the right Anni  the one spelled correctly. 

Wow, you would think that people would have something better to do than to pretend to be someone else and say things that I would never say. 

Annidagostinni ----- Why don't you just post your ideas and your results under your own user name?  I would have so much more respect for your opinion, even if you disagreed with me.   

KellyonaPoll,

Sorry it hasn't worked for you.  Maybe you could call the website and ask them for advice. 

You might want to give it more than a month.  I didn't crawl at all as a baby due to casts on my legs, so I might have gotten the fast results because of that factor.  If you gave it more time, you might see better results.   The authors say that it will take 8 months.   So, you probably need to give it more time.

On a totally different note, has anybody else's kids been bugging them, as badly as mine have been bugging me, to hurry up with reading the book so they can get to the part that makes them all better? I swear I can't possibly read fast enough to suit them! If we don't see positive results from doing these exercises, I'm afraid I'll have a family mutiny on my hands!

[/QUOTE]

I sure hope it works for your family.  I have all the confidence in the world in the exercises.  I am starting my own son on it too.  I am just not consistent enough.  I have only done them three times with him.

As you are reading the book, do the symptoms that the book talks about match your children's symptoms?  When I read it, it was like looking in a mirror at all the things I had done all my life and struggled with.  I was so glad to have something concrete to deal with.  And to actually have hope that there might be something that could cure this incurable disorder.  That was an amazing thing to me.  I was worried about the disappointment that I might have if they didn't work.  But they have worked for me.

Let us know how it is going.

Wow, and I thougth I was gushing on too much about the possibilites of the book.  I guess I should have put my concerns to the other areas of my writting.

BTW, thanks "...tweedle" for defending me.

Well, likewise not to open this thing back up after it took so long to quite it down, but I used the ill fated word so maybe I should explain. 

When we first heard my sons diagnosis: I was upset; my head was spinning; I was told there is no easy solutions; and the Drs gave us some nasty drug as a "remedy" (statement made based on personal experience with my son using specific medications. He currently takes Strattera.).  I used the word "epidemic" to convey how confused and frustrated I was at that time with:  Drs who didn't seem to be much help;  Teachers who said your son will not sit still, pay attention, do his work, etc. (and wanted me to "SOLVE it"... like I had all the answers)

I certainly know that ADD / ADHD is not "contageous" or "infectious".

When I was a kid in elementary school, I knew 2 maybe three kids in my whole grade level that in retrospect could have had ADD or ADHD.  Today, it seems to be like 1 out of every 5 kids could be classified as ADD / ADHD.  I base that on observation of my son's public school classes for the past 3 years.  Every year there are 4 to 5 children out of 20-25 who demonstrate behavior similar to my son's. So, it might have been around for years, but in my PERSONAL OPINION it is more prevelant than when I was a child. My question was and still is "WHY"?

So chalk it up to a bad word choice.

However, I think this whole subject brings up a good point.  Is there that much frustration out there with how "the public" views ADD and ADHD? Are we who deal with it in ourselves and/or loved ones finding it a constant battle to fight skeptisim and ignorance on the subject.  If so, I suggest we created another thread to discuss ways to deal with that specific problem.

Sincerely (not Skeptical),

gmamdad,

You make some very valid points.  The authors of the Stopping ADHD book say that the reason so many people are suffering from ADD and ADHD now is due to all the devices that we use to help us raise our children and that prevent crawling enough - swings, walkers, playpens, jumpers, etc. 

Others say that television causes ADD.  Others point to our diet that has changed so much over the last little while.  There are so many preservatives in food and it is so processed!  Others point to inactivity.  There are so many changes in our lives now compared with years ago.  I think many more studies will have to be done to answer all the questions.

I can understand where you are coming from gmamdad.

[QUOTE=IMac]Perhaps Anni could communicate with Ylenia, what a lovely name; very musical. Her site is gorgeous and she has spent time posting so much information. I couldn't find a follow-up to her blog entry about trying the exercises with her son, but I haven't read everything on her site, yet. There is a discussion forum just waiting for people and I'm sure she would appreciate the contact. It's a shame for someone to go to that much work and not get more feedback from the public.  [/QUOTE]

Hmmm, a compliment? No. I must be reading that wrong. How did you find the site? The excercises haven't been tried yet.

My book came in 2 days ago and we started the exercises this morning.  It was difficult to get my son to take this seriously!  After he stopped giggling, we were at it!!  I told him that we will do this every morning before school.  I just have to keep myself motivated because I am famous for starting something and not finishing it. 

When I read the book and saw the kid standing up and doing his work, I thought of my son!  He either sits on the edge of his chair like he's ready to go or he stands.  I asked him why does he sit like that and he told me that he feels like running when he's doing his school work.  He said that he feels like an animal locked in a cage that just wants to get out and run.  He said that maybe if I get him a treadmil he'd be able to run and then when it's time for school, he could sit down.  I never knew that was how he felt.  I hope this book helps!!

Thanks, Lara

Anni,

Yes it did seem that the book is talking about me, I mean my children. I was a bad kid then, they are ADHD kids now...that's an improvement. Back then, I got my backside tanned at least once on a daily basis, but now that we know that the condition is one that is not easily helped and they have put a name to it so it can be officially researched, kids are not as likely to be punished for their actions and are dealt with in a much different manner. Even if this book doesn't solve all of our problems, at least that advancement has been made! I think we will be ready to start the exercises next week. Did anybody notice a difference in the way they or their children felt and dealt with the issues of the day if they did the exercises before starting their day or did them at the day's end? Just trying to pre-think scheduling issues. Also, on average, how much time does this take each day?

If I may ask a question about the board's interlopers...what would they have to gain by trying to side-track the thread? All I can think of is just the amusement factor...are they truly that petty? You said that you knew who they were. I encounter people like that all of the time in the military, but they rarely have any real success in approaching anything that way.

Kelly, When Dr. ODell said the school is helping them, does that mean the kids are doing excercises at school or helping in other ways?

Also, Anni, our real Anni, you noticed improvements sooner than 8 months right? Good to know though that it may take awhile, eight months. Now that is perseverence. I think most of us dealing with add/adhd know what perserverence is all about! Still waiting for my book!

Joemom,

That sounds like a great idea.  I think it takes longer than a week though, even if the crawling is intense.  But it would be a good training for the parents and the kids. 

Susieb, I'm glad you can see how much sense it makes, too.  When I first started to post here about it, nobody had heard of it.  So it is nice to have others who can see how much sense it makes. 

And if it can help a child out there - even one !  - I think it is worth taking some some heat, hey! even being impersonated!!! 

kppy,

What was your undergrad work?  I have a degree in education, but not special ed or anything.  I'd like to study about this reflex mostly.

as far as the pol-loves things goes, people are going to do what they are going to do.  It is too bad that all of this has sidetracked us from the real reason we are all here, to help each other and to help our kids.

kppy,

Homeschooling can be tough.  Good for you!   Your son is very blessed.

Anni,

Yes it did seem that the book is talking about me, I mean my children. I was a bad kid then, they are ADHD kids now...that's an improvement. Back then, I got my backside tanned at least once on a daily basis, but now that we know that the condition is one that is not easily helped and they have put a name to it so it can be officially researched, kids are not as likely to be punished for their actions and are dealt with in a much different manner. Even if this book doesn't solve all of our problems, at least that advancement has been made! I think we will be ready to start the exercises next week. Did anybody notice a difference in the way they or their children felt and dealt with the issues of the day if they did the exercises before starting their day or did them at the day's end? Just trying to pre-think scheduling issues. Also, on average, how much time does this take each day?

[/QUOTE]

MilitaryMother,

You make some valid points about the reaction people have to ADD today compared with yesterday.  I'm sorry you had to go through that as a child. 

I usually do my exercises in the evening during the week and after I get up in the morning on the weekend.  Sometimes I forget to do them - I teach school and I have a family to care for at home - but I am keeping on with them.  You don't have to start over or anything if you skip a few days.  It just takes longer. 

I will love to hear how the exercises are going for your children in the months ahead!  I do hope they help.

We will have to be patient on the board, as it does take time.  

[QUOTE=cynthiatweedle]Original Anni---

I appreciate your patience, gentleness and kindness, too.  You are also intrepid, a quality I greatly admire.   Keep posting.  It's great to have you here.
[/QUOTE]

Thanks cymthiaweedle,  I love this board.  I enjoy your posts too. I hate to see things like this happen, but people have their own choices to make. 

It makes life interesting, though. 

I started the crawling exercises with my son last night. 

He complained several times that the Rocking exercise was silly.  But, I noticed that he struggled to keep his chin up and a slight swag in his back. And, he would drop to his elbows and lay his head on his forearms every so often to rest.  I let him do this for twenty to thirty seconds and would start back up again.

He is small and I am tall so I used the option B of the Crawling I. He fought me on doing all 15 repetitions.  Again, he was struggled even more with keeping his chin up and not arching his back. Once again after a few reps my son would collapse on the floor and complain about being tired or that it was difficult. He even tried to argue with me about how many he had remaining. (he's quite the trickster - but I won  )

In all, I found his difficulty in doing the exercises a positive thing.  It must mean that he has an immature STNR! I told him that the book says if the exercises were easy to do then he would not need to do them. (i think it says that) In general my son is receptive to motivation and loves a challenge, so I played to that and got him to finish the first day. Only seven months and 29 days to go... LOL! 

My son starts with the crawling exercises again tomorrow.  We're going to do them MOn-Fri a.m. before school.  I'm going to have to bribe him to do the exercises, so I bought a big pack of Yugio cards and I told him that I will give him 2 cards a week.  One is for him not giving me problems with doing his exercises and the other is for him taking his Focus Factor vitamins and Fish Oil vitamins without giving me any problems.  He keeps bugging me to give him the cards now.  But, I am not going to!!  I am going to stick to my guns this time!

Lara

Our two kids both craweled very little.

daughter pulled up and crawled all in same day. No disorders. She was the colic child.

Son crawled 1 legged. walked at 16 months.

I don't want to encourage the football thing TOO muchHe has played every other sport to keep him away from football! He is a big kid, he weighs more than me and I only have about 4 inches on him. It is a workout to give him the resistance for the excercises! His grandfather wants him to play soooo bad. My husband played and had 2 knee surgeries and has a messed up shoulder. So it is the running joke around here that he will be the first 6'2" 280 lb. person to win Wimbledon! I probably will get him a jersey though, he would love it.

I have found that having a hard time keeping the head up is a sign that the STNR is bothering you.  I would much rather have crawled with my head down.  I crawl with a book on my head to remember to keep my head up.  This is hard for a child because they can't balance it on their heads, but it really helps me to keep my head up.  Maybe you could put a bean bag or a stuffed animal on his head to help him remember to keep his head up.

I think the more you do it, the easier it becomes.  I tried to do the exercises that come later on in the program and they were actually pretty hard for me to do.  The author told me that is because I didn't do all of the first ones!! So there is a reason for all the time you spend on each one. 

I tried an experiment in my 4th grade class and had the students crawl with books on their heads to see how far they could go.  I really wanted to see which ones had a harder time with the exercise.

The ones that show ADD and ADHD symptoms (some I know who are being treated for it) had the hardest time.  They didn't want to keep their hands flat either and would get up on their fingers.  The students who have an easy time staying in their seats seemed to be able to crawl with the books on their head quite easily and really enjoyed it.  One little girl went home and did it for an hour!

So, it is hard for people being bothered by the STNR to do these exercises. 

Just be patient, it gets easier.

MilitaryMother,

Thanks, my inbox was full.  Sorry it wouldn't go through.

I just wanted to update things in my department.  I have had some interesting results and I took the crawling test again.

I twist my hair - it sort of runs in my family.  But I do it to a more intense degree than any of my family members.  I twist until there is a big knot and sometimes I've even had to cut it out with scissors. I also chew on it if it is long enough.

But, hey, this is research, so I am letting you know a really embarassing thing about me. 

It's strange, I can control it in public, but when I am home, or in the car (sort of by myself) I don't control it.  I think it is a stress releaser. 

Anyway, I have noticed lately that I still twist it, but the degree of intensity is lessened.  I don't twist it so much that it is in a knot anymore.  I cut it a little shorter, so maybe that is the reason.  But I was wondering if the crawling is helping me.

And here is the update on the test:  I took the crawling test today, the one where you crawl backwards with resistance and spell a word.  When I first took it, a few months ago, I slowed way down in my spelling, and I couldn't concentrate on the letters.  It is very frustrating, because I am a quick speller.  When I am not crawling backwards and I am just sitting there, I spell quickly.  Well, I took the test today.  My husband helped me.  He gave me lots of resistance, more than I am used to.  I could spell small words just fine, but longer ones like "library" or "individual" I got lost in the middle of and had to slow down.  It is better than at the beginning though, when I struggled to think it through all the way.   I find it so interesting, this test.  I do see an improvement in my spelling though, but I can tell that I am not totally done with the exercises.  I need to keep going.

This is a long process and for all ADDers I think it is hard to keep it up and not want to be just done with it.

keep crawling everyone!!!  You are all inspiring me!! Thanks!!!

Anni,

That is very interesting. What would be more interesting is to try this on a person without ADHD and one is a pretty good speller. I would volunteer but my spelling has never been that great..

joemom

I have tried it on my son, 19, who keeps his room neat as a pin.  I don't suspect him of having ADHD at all.  He could spell just fine.  I remember him crawling a lot and I remember he walked at about 12 months. 

My one son who walked early (9months) shows signs of ADD.  He even sits on his legs and he is 21 and a big guy!  He won't take the test for me.  He thinks he has no problem.  He loses his wallet just about everyday, but hey, he is on his own and grown.  I can't get him crawling now.

My husband, who I suspect has ADD, could spell just fine too.  He might have ADD caused by something else, I guess.  But I know that I can't spell and crawl backwards with resistance at the same time.  But I find that it is getting easier the longer I do the exercises.

joemom,

You could still try it even if you are not a great speller.  Have someone give you easy words.  You have to crawl backwards with someone giving you resistance (puching on you from behind, or pulling on you from the shoulders.) The test isn't to see if you can spell well.  It is to see if you have to stop crawling to concentrate enough to remember what to say.  Or you might spell in cadence with your crawling pace.  It is weird, when I am crawling backwards, it is like my mind goes blank, or short circuits or something.  Like there are gaps in the words when I visualize them as I spell.  This does not happen when I am just sitting or standing and spelling.

I will  give it a try...I am not a terrible speller I am just not the spelling bee winner

Anni,

I wanted to check that you got my reply. It mentioned that there was some sort of problem. So, I thought I'd better come here and let you know that I did receive it from you...thank you.

Here is an idea for those that are crawling with their children.  I crawled with my son who is eight this afternoon.  I have been using a book on my head to keep my head up. It really has worked well for me and helps me to keep myself straight.  My son had a hard time with a book, so we put a bean bag on his head and he thought it was so funny.

Then we crawled up and down the carpeted hall.  Well, if you can imagine, every time we met in the middle he would give me a kiss.  Sparks would fly, literally!  We kept on shocking each other.  It was like a science experiment with electricity!  We had a blast, giggling every time he gave me a kiss, he would give me a shock. 

It was really fun.  I don't think the teenagers would be too into the fun of this experiment, but younger kids will get a blast out of it. 

Well, I'm a little disappointed today.  I forgot a major thing today.  I remembered most everything else.  There was so much going on, my son is sick with a fever and cough, my youngest just recovered from this cough and fever, and my oldest son is going to be leaving so to go on a mission for our church. 

I just can't believe that this slipped my mind.  I am a little down about it, but I'm going to keep on crawling.  Eventhough things aren't perfect, they are so much better than before when I would forget almost everything!!  Anyway, so I need to be grateful.

I also must say that I am twisting my hair so much less and that has never happened in my whole life except for a two week period after I has some hypnotherapy.  So, all in all I am still very happy with the results of the exercises.

Anni,

Don't keep beating yourself up over your one oversight.  You have come such a long way and your progress, coupled with your excitement over your newly acquired skill keeps us all going. 

Thanks, you guys are the best!

I actually remembered to take my daughter to her eye appointment today, and I am remembering that the garbage gets picked up tomorrow.  I know I have a meeting in the morning that I need to go to, so I think I'm still doing ok.

I just want everything to be perfect and it's not going to be perfect - ever.

But it still is so different from what it was before, so I am still excited.

Thanks for all your support!  It means a lot to me.

gmandad,

I sure hope these help your son as much as they have helped me.

I was trying to figure out why they are working.  I think that my brain did not connect back to the things I just thought.  I would tuck it away and be able to remember it if I was reminded by some external reminder - like my kids, or a note, or the event passing and I see a reminder of it somehow. 

Now, after crawling, I remember these things all by myself.  It's like my brain got connected up somehow.  I think about things I have to do tonight, tomorrow, this week.  I just remember them now.  I can't explain it any other way. 

I read a site once that talked about how important crawling is, and I remember it saying that crawling will connect receptors in your brain somehow.  Some people dismiss it because they think only of the physical aspects, but I think there is more to it.  I think that crawling can connect the two sides of our brain, because it deals with both sides working in coordination.

I think that is what is happening in my brain.  The receptors from one area that stores the information is connected up to the other area that puts it into my thoughts, before it just sat there until someone else reminded me.

It's not like I would forget those things completely.  I would always say, "Oh, yeah!  Great! I forgot!"   Now, I just remember.  It is so amazing. 

I'm not sure if my explanation is correct.  It is my hypothosis.  I know that the exercise also make me more comfortable just sitting.  I can sit at plays now, just fine.

I hope it works for your son and everybody's children on here who are trying it. 

It certainly has been amazing to me.

AmbersMom,

Annidagostini seems to be the furthest one along in the exercises.  I think she is 6-8 weeks into the exercises (correct me if i'm wrong annidagostini).  She has serveral comments on here you can read.

My son has just finished the first two weeks of exercises.  He's ten and had been diagnosed with ADHD.  Today I asked him several questions about how he was feeling (please note the book strickly states not to expect even minor results for 3 months).  But I had several things I plan to ask him about as we go along. He said his neck ached a little (for which he milks a neck & back massage out of me each time. but i don't mind).  The sore neck is a pretty common response from those doing the exercies (per this site).

I asked if he felt different from the exercises.  He was quite for a couple of minutes and then said that he thinks that he is able to site still a little longer a little easier.  It's kinda complicated trying to get answers from my son...  but he said that when he tries to sit still for a long time, he has to end it with balling his hands and feet real tightly.  He said that the urge to ball his hands and feet is slightly less strong than it was before.  That was the best way he could explain it.

Mixed in with all this, we had a very confusing week.  He got a note from the teach for being very good in class just one day after being sent to the principal's office for poor behavior.  He was also good the following day too. One of his worst behavoir day's this year followed by two of his best days. 

I'm so confused!  But, I am encourage! The book makes so much sense to me.  My son fits so many of the scenarios described in the book.

We're still crawling. I'll keep reporting in.

Thanks Imac, it is good to know that you guys are here when I need to talk.

Hey!  Guess what I just did for the first time in my WHOLE life??

I filed my income tax return today!!!  I always have done it in the past on April 15th or later!!! 

I can't believe that I actually have filed it already!  

Keep crawling!  I am!

I don't have an urge to clench my fists after sitting, but I do twist my hair.  I think it is a way to relieve tension.  I wonder if people choose different methods to relieve the stress caused by this reflex.

To clarify, I used to twist my hair so intensely that it ended up in knots.  I would literally have to cut them out of my hair.  I would also bite and chew on it, mostly the left side.  I would have a whole section of hair with bad split ends.   I have done this all my life.  The only way I could get relief from it, was to cut it short.  I would still twist it, but I just couldn't get it in my mouth that way.  (There was a two week period of my life in which I didn't twist my hair - that was when I had a hypnotherapy session and it relieved all sorts of stress for me.  I felt like it was the first time in my life in which I was totally relaxed without being asleep.  Also, I felt relief from the twisting when I first started taking Adderal.  But it didn't last.  After a week I was back to twisting it as intently as before.)  So the relieving tension thing makes a lot of sense.  Since I have been crawling, I have noticed, especially in the last couple of weeks, that I don't have the intensity for twisting that I had before.   I still am twisting itm but I play with it in a calmer way.  If it ends up in my mouth, I usually am a little put off by it now, when before, it was just part of the whole deal.  I hope that makes sense.

I crack my knuckles all the time also.  I haven't noticed if I crack them less, probably because it does not annoy me like the hair twisting.

My family does the hair twisting thing.  My psychiatrist told me it was related to Tourette's syndrom, but wasn't actually Tourette's.  I don't know if it will totally disappear or not, I don't know if I can wish for that much, but you never know.  I would be eternally grateful to Miriam Bender (the originator of these exercises) for that gift. 

Does anyone else have the urge to ball your hands and feet after being still? Have your heard it from your kids? Does anyone remember reading that in the book? It seems like I read it, but since I see and hear about it from my son all the time, I cannot recall.

[/QUOTE]

gmandad - the closest thing I can come up with in my experience is when I do the crawling exercises - I want to change my hand position.  It is getting easier, but at first, I wanted to raise up on my finger tips when I crawled.  I didn't like and still don't really, keeping my hands flat.  So, perhaps that is related to what your son is feeling. 

Remember, you can always call the number in the book or on their web site to talk to one of the authors or a trained person.  You could ask them if they have ever seen that particular reaction from someone they have treated before.

I'm glad that you have stuck with the exercises so consistently!! You are doing better than me and will probably pass me!! I do them at least once a week, if not twice a week.  That is why I have been posting on this board for so long!!  I am going to keep doing them though, even if it takes me years to finish. 

You may notice changes after the first month if you are like me.  It hink the good reports from school are a good indicator.  I hope it continues for you.

Is your son on medication also, or is he not? 

[QUOTE=AmbersMom]Anni, that is so interesting about the hair twisting thing, my sister does that exact same thing while watching tv, driveing i was behind her in line one day after getting my son from school waiting at the red light and noticed her twisting her hair. she will also be sitting and watching a movie and when the movie ends her hair will be breaded and she didnt know she had done it. So are the exercises working for you. Her doc suggest meds. such as zolof. she does not want to take them. I think i am going to get the book for her to read. thanks[/QUOTE]

The exercises are working great for me.  I am dx ADD inattentive, (but they work for both ADD and ADHD).  I have noticed that I can concentrate and finish projects, I can organize better, I have a better memory for things,  I can come back to what I was doing more easily.  I have also noticed that I can sit comfortably through plays with my mom and sister (I always used to squirm, cross my legs, lean to the right and to the left while they sat still and were comfortable)  And I still have weeks left to go before I am finished with the exercises.  So, I am so grateful for them. 

I surely hope they will work for you too, and for your sister if she needs to find relief from this reflex.

I got an extra copy of the book off e-bay for only a couple of dollars.  I think I was lucky, it was a used copy, but it looks brand new.

[QUOTE=gmandad]

You may notice changes after the first month if you are like me.  It hink the good reports from school are a good indicator.  I hope it continues for you.

Is your son on medication also, or is he not? 

[/QUOTE]

Anni,

Yes my son is currently taking Strattera.  He has been on it on and off since it came out two years ago.  We try to give him a break from it in the summers.  It does not seem to be as effective as it once was.  And, I don't like all the newly discovered side effects I am reading about lately.

Actually, the medicine has been a concern of mine for another reason.  In relation to these exercises if they work (and I expect that they will), at some point the STNR will begin to be overridden by the exercises.  At that time he would become calmer.  However, if he is still taking the medication (which speeds up the system to force the body to slow down) it will be like a normal child taking the prescribed ADHD medicine.  So, the result will be that he become more hyper, etc. which would be the opposite desired effect.

Am I making sense?  I am trying to say that during the 8 months of exercises there may\will be a point when the medicine makes him more hyper than the STNR.

I would just take him off of the medicine.  But, he starts to struggle with school work if I do.  We live in Texas and have to take the State required exams (TAKS).  If he does not pass thoses tests he has to go to summer school and potentially have to repeat the 4th grade.  And there are three portions to the TAKS test spread out over the next three months.  So everything starts to get very tricky.

At the current time, I am considering working with his doctor to put him on Attend or some similar alternative and ease him off of the Straterra while continuing with the exercies. One problem is that the transition period will be expensive (buying all this medicine).  Too, Attend takes a while to ramp up in the system.  And, People taking Strattera must be weaned off of it.  All the while, the STNR is slowly being overridden and his behavior will be changing too. 

 My head is spinning.  Am I making sense?

Has anyone else had to jump through hoops like this yet?

 My head is spinning.  Am I making sense?

Has anyone else had to jump through hoops like this yet?

[/QUOTE]

Any suggestions or lessons learned?

gmandad,

I can see your concern.  I suppose you could always call the authors of the book and see what they suggest.  They have a section in their book, I'm sure you have seen, that talks about medication and the possible side effects.  Another area of the book talks about stopping medication in the right way, when you are ready to do that.

If you are keeping your son on medication during the exercises, I would just consult with your doctor or the authors to get their suggestions. 

I can see your concern.

annidagostini, I love reading your posts!!  I can't wait until my son makes that much progress. 

Hopefully I didn't slow him down.  It just dawned on me yesterday that I had him doing 3 round trips of the crawling instead of six.  For some reason I had the number 6 in my mind and figured 3 round trips totalled 6.  Anyway, it's a battle sometimes to get him to do the exercises.  I have him doing them in the morning when he wakes up, before school.  Nobody's home then and it's easier that way.  I just have to keep bribing him with the Yugio cards.  One on Wednesday and one on Friday if he does his exercises and doesn't give me problems about doing them.  He did really good in school this week.  His behavior grade is an A.  It's usually a C. 

Lara

annidagostini, I love reading your posts!!  I can't wait until my son makes that much progress. 

Hopefully I didn't slow him down.  It just dawned on me yesterday that I had him doing 3 round trips of the crawling instead of six.  For some reason I had the number 6 in my mind and figured 3 round trips totalled 6.  Anyway, it's a battle sometimes to get him to do the exercises.  I have him doing them in the morning when he wakes up, before school.  Nobody's home then and it's easier that way.  I just have to keep bribing him with the Yugio cards.  One on Wednesday and one on Friday if he does his exercises and doesn't give me problems about doing them.  He did really good in school this week.  His behavior grade is an A.  It's usually a C. 

Lara

[/QUOTE]

Lara,

That is wonderful that you are so consistent with the exercises.  The six round trips is easy to mistake for three, so don't worry too much, just keep on going!The authors say that once you start to see progress that people stop before they get all the way through.  I'm glad a didn't stop after just one improvement.

I think it is wonderful that your son had such a great week in school!  His behavior grade is an A!!  From a C to an A is a super improvement.  Let us know if it continues.  Do you think the exercises are helping him already?  How long have you been doing the exercises now?

Thanks for posting too!! I love reading your results also.

Here is an update for you!  I noticed something today. 

I have this suitcase that my hubby bought for me to carry school stuff in from school and to school.  I teach 4th grade.  It has wheels so it is easy to carry things back and forth.

Well, every so often, I pick up the handle and head off with my suitcase to find everything on the floor because I never noticed that the zipper wasn't zipped.  I even did this on a rainy day outside once and all the kids' papers ended up wet.

Well, I noticed today that I hadn't zipped it up before I took off. I closed it before I tipped it up.  Then I thought about it and realized that I haven't tipped it over once since I started to do the crawling exercises.   I will have to see if I can keep it up.

Keep on crawling! 

He's been doing the exercises going on 4 weeks I think.  I'm not sure if it's the exercises, the Omegas or him just wanting to be good so he can get his Yugio cards.   We have Mardi Gras holidays coming up real soon and the kids are off for a week so I think I will have my daughter help him catch up on the crawling we missed.   

When my son says that he thinks he's stupid I tell him that some people just have to try harder than others and that he should be proud of himself.  I also remind him that everybody's good at different things.  He can outfish just about any man.  He can sit there for hours and be quiet waiting to catch a fish and reel fish after fish in.  He just struggles in school.  Spelling, reading and english are the hardest for him.  His best subject is science and his grade in that right now is a B.  It's interesting to him.  In every other subject he's a C student - which is ok, if that's the best he can do.   I am not putting him back on Adderall just so he can make A's & B's.  When I had him on it, it changed who he is, and I don't like that. 

We'll just keep crawling away!

Lara, you sound like a great mom to see the good in your child - like the fishing!!  Way to go!   

I was wondering if the crawling exercises have helped him be more comfortable when he is sitting yet?  I noticed that right away.  I could sit at the theater with my mother and sister to watch a play for 2 hours without the antsy feelign I used to feel after doing the crawling.  Do you think he is more comfortable now that he has done the exercises for a month.

One test you could make is to take away the Omegas  - like in the summer or something.  Then you could tell if it was just the crawling.  I have never taken Omegas so I don't know their effect.

Thanks for posting, keep letting us know how things are going.

Lara,

I wouldn't worry about the upper part of his body going in a different direction.  I do know that when I would crawl, my legs seemed to move before my arms, and I worried that I should coordinate them better, but when I asked the authors (you can call them, the number's on the website and in the book) they said that my body would adjust to it and not to worry about it.  So, perhaps his body will adjust just fine. 

I am glad that homework is going better for him.  Perhaps he is more comfortable sitting for extended periods of time and it doesn't bother him so much to do his homework.

Things for me are still going well.  I still am working on organization.  I can get my desk organized at work every day, which is very good.  I don't like the fact that it gets piled up during the day.  (It never bothered me before, I just didn't seem to notice the mess) I have plans to keep it organized.  I also have more plans with homework and getting work turned in by the students.  So I think things are going great. I still get frustrated by a few things.  I have forgotten one thing this week - but I did remember about 7 other things.  I used to forget all of them or perhaps remember one of them.  So all in all, I am very happy with the results.

I did some research into some other exercises in England that addresses the same STNR reflex.  They stated in their website that to stop the exercises for a period of time would not be good, so I am going to try to be more consistent.

Oh, and I wanted to add also that my hair twisting is still greatly diminished.  I can attribute it to nothing else but the exercises.  I don't twist it when I'm driving now, and I used to do it then all the time.  I remember going into Walmart and having to stop and untwist the knot I made without realizing it before I could go into the store.  That would happen all the time. 

It just doesn't happen anymore.  I drive to the store and get out and I haven't even twisted it at all!  The only time I twist it tightly now is when I am concentrating really hard on something and I am sitting with my arms and legs bent.  I am so grateful for these exercises. If it had helped only that one thing in my life, I would have been so happy.  But it is helping with so much more.  I am amazed.  I feel like spreading the word about how much they have helped me is the only way I can really pay back these women and their research.

I feel like the Lord led me to this book and I feel like if I don't spread the word about it, that I would be ungrateful to Him also. It is like a miracle in my life.  It is so simple and yet so many people don't even take the time to research it or to try it.  And that is too bad.

annidagostini wrote:
I feel like the Lord led me to this book and I feel like if I don't spread the word about it, that I would be ungrateful to Him also. It is like a miracle in my life.  It is so simple and yet so many people don't even take the time to research it or to try it.  And that is too bad.

I have been following this thread and I find it very interesting. I do know that hair pulling or twirling can be as a result of having anxiety and its not uncommon for Adhd'ers to have anxiety. While its not a symptom of Adhd, it happens as a result of having Adhd. Perhaps the excersize alleviates some of the anxiety that can go along with having Adhd. Some things are also about power of suggestion and thats why when accuate studies are done, they do double blinded studies and  test the placebo effect. Unfortunately, like biofeedback, double blinded studies cannot be done for this type of therapy. With thse type of therapies, its usually the people that provide these services that promote it and highly recommend it.

I am all for alternatives  when they are proven in the long term to work and are safe and I highly respect what you have to say Anni. For those of you that have found something that is effective and safe, I applaud you and while the excersize cant hurt by trying it, I would think that if such a therapy was so effective for managing or curing the symptoms of Adhd, it would be getting a  lot of exposure and press. Its true that many people are leay and wont try it to see if it does but by the same token, I am sure that many have tried it or these clinics wouldnt be making business. Also, Im sure there are many testimonials saying it does work but I would like to see the long term studies saying it in fact does work in the long term and not just studies by those who promote it.

Again, the information your putting out there can be very valuable for some and people need to know of all the options available but this is almost turning into an infomercial lol Again, no disrespect meant as you are a very valuable contributor to this board and I do respect what you have to say. My son never slouched like that and he was a professional crawler so much so that he crawled up walls lol So, the theory in the book wouldnt apply to my son.  However, I guess if children are in a position that relaxes them, I would think that would also alleviate some of the anxiety and tension that goes along with doing homework.

In any event, this is just my opinion and I hope that those who are trying it have continued success

Thanks Cynthia, I appreciate your kind words.

I am totally sold on this theory.  I wasn't at first.  At first I wanted to prove it wrong.  But there was not much information out there on this type of physical therapy.  I even came to this board and asked about it.  That is one of the reasons I came here.  I can only say what has been my experience.  I decided to try the exercises because the book made so much sense when I started to read it.

Lusmykids02, I'm sorry if I sound like I am being pushy or something.  I get nothing myself from posting here, I just believe in the exercises.  These exercises may or may not work for everyone.  Your son's ADHD could be caused by something else or maybe it is caused by this reflex also.  

They are helping me.  And the effects are not wearing off.  Who knows? Maybe they will in the future.  If this is a placebo effect, then after a while, I should notice my old ways returning.  That is one of the reasons that I started this thread.  If I end up leading people to false hope, I would feel horrible. 

You bring up a good point about why this method isn't better known. I would really like to know why this method is not getting more exposure and press.   Even if it helped only a few people with ADD, I think it should be in the forefront of the media.  The authors say in the book that because the research for this theory came through education and not medical research that is it not as well received.  They are doctrorate professors of education who received their graduate degree under Miriam Bender, who started the theory.  I find it facinating and I want to let people know about it.  I don't mean to offend.

Maybe you could check the book out of the library and read it and see what you think.  It is very interesting.  If it is right, then it is a major breakthrough, and we as parents and people with ADD should not sit around and let it go without telling everybody we know. 

Others on this board have said that I sound like a commercial.  I don't know what else to do about that.  I just hope to help others.  That is all I can do.  I am sorry if I offend anyone.  But if one child or adult is helped by it, then it was worth it to offend, that is the way I look at it.

Anni

Luvmykids02,

I agree with you on the questioning thing.  I believe in open forums like this one.  It can only give us more options. 

You might want to give the authors a call.  You can find their number on their web site.  They have been doing these exercises and helping people for 30 years.  Maybe they could give you a reference to call - someone who was helped years ago.  If the results have lasted for years for them, it would be good to know.  If I were you, I would ask them specific questions regarding your son.  You know, it can't hurt.  And if it were to help him, it would be well worth the minimal investment in the book.  All the exercises are right there.  You don't have to go to their clinic.  That is what I find refreshing about these women. They truly believe in this method, and they are not taking advantage of people.  Also, if the exercises do work, as they claim, then there is a cure for this disability (if it is caused by the STNR).  It is a hope that I have, I am still testing it. I am still in the middle of the crawling and will keep doing it for the months that I am supposed to.

It would be interesting to know what the authors say to you, seeing as your son has crawled and was a good crawler and is still diagnosed with ADHD.  I would like to know their response.

Good luck to you, I can tell you really care about your kids. 

Imac, thanks too.   You said it very well.

OK, here is another update.

My daughter said to me tonight that she noticed something that has changed about me since I have been crawling.   I asked her what and she said that I used to have so many projects that never get done.  Things I get all excited about and I am all hyperfocused on - (she listed a bunch of them and she was right!!!)  but I never actually finish them.  THAT IS SO TRUE!!!  I have piles of projects - prints in my basement that I am supposed to turn into a business, books I am supposed to write, grammar projects that I am supposed to market and sell !! The list goes on and on  . . .

Anyway, she said that I haven't started a project like that since I've been crawling. She said that I am pretty much focused on my job - teaching and the family. 

Well, I guess that is an improvement.  So, now I have no projects?  I was wondering what will happen when I finally start another project.  Or now, will I start one I know I can finish?  It is a good question.  I guess we will see.  During the summer when school is out and I am not teaching, perhaps I will start some projects and finish them. 

annidagostini,

This is so cool...I am sure that when you do pick a project you will do great..I just love some of your IDEAS...they say people with ADHD have the gift of creativity.

thanks joemom,

I believe in the ADHD creativity gift.  I notice it in all the kids in my class who show signs of ADD and ADHD.  Others have creativity and artistic gifts also, but it seems that most of the ones who suffer from ADD and ADHD have a good share of them.

I'm not sure if he is more comfortable sitting yet.  One thing I did notice is that when he does the resisted rocking exercises, the upper part of his body seems to be going in a different direction than the lower part.  Does that make sense? 

He does seem to be getting better at homework.  (knowing that he has to do it and doing it.  He'd usually come up with every excuse why not to do it, but lately he's been doing it without a problem.  I still have to sit down with him and help.)   

How are you doing?

Lara

gmandad,

Wow! That is terrific about your son and his batting!  Keep on crawling!

Reporting in:

We have completed 4 weeks of exercises.  We got off track when the flu rolled through the whole family and we have just this week got back on schedule.

My son is ten years old. We have started the baseball season and we had a scrimmage the other day.  When my son got up to bat I noticed something different. For the last 5 years (YES! 5 YEARS) at the plate he would continuously move, scratch and wiggle.  It was amazing to me that he could still hit the ball despite the fact that he was often a little behind the pitch.  However, at the scrimmage last weekend when he got up to bat HE STOOD PERFECTLY STILL (i.e. no wiggling, scratching, etc.).  SERIOUSLY!

What is funny is that I didn't notice it at first because there was nothing to notice.  It was his second or third at bat before it dawned on me that he was not moving. After the game, I mentioned it to my wife and she had noticed it too.  We told our son about it, and he had no idea he was still that day while at bat.

It goes without saying that so far this season he is hitting the best he has ever hit!

Four weeks into these exercises he is beginning to fight me on doing them.  I think it is because he feels they are hard because of the weak STNR.  However when I pointed out how much better he did at batting after only four weeks, it convinced him to keep doing them.

Keep it up folks and share your experiences!

I don't remember reading anything about clenching of fists, but it certainly seems a viable way to focus, relieve stress, and fidget. We are a family (me, my daughter, my son) of knuckle crackers. We do it so often...it's not because our hands ache, it's because it's our way to relieve stress and fidget. I'm afraid that this is my nasty habit that they picked up...shame on me! And, all 3 of us fit most of the descriptions in that book. It's a wonder my husband has any of his sanity in tact.

We start crawling tonight, before we go to bed. So, keep your fingers crossed and wish us luck...it's a whole family affair at Schlosse Pope! Auf Wiedersehen!

Oh, I wanted to ask everyone about this:

In my previous posted I stated

It's kinda complicated trying to get answers from my son...  but he said that when he tries to sit still for a long time, he has to end it with balling his hands and feet real tightly.

Does anyone else have the urge to ball your hands and feet after being still? Have your heard it from your kids? Does anyone remember reading that in the book? It seems like I read it, but since I see and hear about it from my son all the time, I cannot recall.

I skimmed a couple of chapters in the book but I couldn't find it. I thought someone might remember.

MilitaryMother,

In my classroom I allow postural freedom without making a big deal about it.  If a child is sitting with legs up by his or her chest, I just don't say anything.  I allow them to be as comfortable as they can be.  I have one little girl who actually gets out of her chair and sort of hovers around her desk.  I don't say anything unless she is blocking someone else's view.  I also seat her on the edge of the class, toward the front, so that I can redirect her in a non-obvious way.  I just touch her desk as I go by or point to her chair while I am still talking so I don't make it obvious to others that I am redirecting her back to her work.

These things help keep my class as pleasant as possible. 

A teacher I work with has always had the policy that if you are tired of sitting, you can stand by your desk, as long as you don't bother another student.  She makes it a rule for everybody in the class and doesn't single out any one child.  A policy like this might help.

kppy, the book has a chapter in it that tells about a school that actually did and experiment for the authors of the book.  They had about 200 students sign up for the study who showed signs of the reflex bothering them.  They gave them all tests at the beginning and recorded the scores. (tests that test for attention, etc.)

Then they had half the group do the exercises and the other half not.  At the end of the year, the TEACHERS all wanted the other half to do the exercises too.  They gave the tests again at the end of the year and the group that exercised scored higher in almost every test - if not all, I can't remember.  The other group scored higher in just one test. 

I think you could contact the school to make sure the experiment was legitimate.  I can't remember the name of the school and I lent my book to someone so I cant' go look it up.  But it is in there.

I think it would be great if OT's got trained in this therapy.  I have found some on line that use it, but it was only one that I found.  I haven't searched anymore.  And to have them at a school would really help the students who struggle.

I would love to go back to school, get a masters in Learning Diabilities in education and implement this therapy in schools in which I would work.  I think it would help a lot.  That would take a long while, but it would be so worth it to be able to do more studies about it and further this work.

Anni,

We just can't seem to get ourselves together to even start. Mondays we get home late because my son has Cub Scouts, Wednesday we get home late because my husband and I teach Boy Scout Merit Badges, Friday we get home late because my daughter has Girl Scouts, and the last Tuesday of the month my husband and I have committe meeting and the last Thursday of the month we have our Pack meeting. We're talking get home and have less than an hour before the kids are due in bed...still have homework and supper and baths...makes for a busy hour. I hate making all of these excuses, but they are not just empty excuses. Now my daughter, who needs to crawl more than my son and me together, just had surgery on her wrist and is out of commission for who knows how long. Normally we get up at 5am every weekday morning and don't get home until about 6pm on a normal night or 8pm or so on a Scout night.

We can do the exercises on Tuesdays, Thursdays, Saturdays, and Sundays, except for the last week of the month, and all bets are off then. I can only imagine how much longer we'll need to do them at that rate. It's very daunting and disheartening to even try to start when you know that you aren't going to see the end for such a long time.

Anyways, you wanted to hear from those of us who haven't posted for a while...now you know why, but I have been reading these posts.

anni's taken some heat for being enthusiastic about the book, Stopping ADHD.  Well, I bought the book and have only read a few chapters but I can already see the logic behind it.  The idea is that for an infant, crawling is an important exercise as well as a developmental milestone.  However, the use of things like playpens, walkers, bouncers and swings cuts down on the time a baby spends crawling.  The "back to sleep" campaign has also contributed to it (lay the baby on his/her back to sleep in order to prevent SIDS).  Newborns have a reflex that usually is suppressed by about 6 mos called the Symmetric Tonic Neck Reflex.  This is part of the reason babies have an automatic sucking reflex among other things.  When an infant does not spend enough time crawling before he/she walks, this reflex is not suppressed.  This causes discomfort down the road when a child attempts to sit still, write, participate in atheletics, etc. making it hard to concentrate. 

As I think back, my son did not crawl a whole lot as a baby.  We were in a house that had wood floors that were cold in the winter.  He also had asthma and we didn't really want him down on the floor, for fear that he'd have an asthma attack.  I can see where this deficit might have a role in ds's ADD.   

I've only read 3 chapters, but I'm posting to say that anni may be on to something.  I'm going to finish this book and then give it to my husband to read.  I'm going to try the excercises, too.  I'll keep you posted.

Thanks, anni! 

I would love to see some type of Crawling Camp Day.

 It would be interesting to see the results after an intense week of crawling exercises.

If you read the study in the book the kids all crawled together and had 6th graders who were their partners ( ha kids will do anything to get out of class) .It was probably lots of fun in the group setting. My son is not a fan of the exercises but I think it may be helping. At least the days he does some exercises before school seem to be better.

Hey Anni wanna run crawlers camp in the summer ?

Imac,

Yahoo addresses work here just fine. And, I've started an account for my children since being here, why do you ask? Have you heard something different or just a curiosity question?

jerbear,

I hope that the exercises help you. 

I could never do a cartwheel or a backbend like the other girls my age.  I even put on my brother's football helmet once to keep practicing the back bend because I would fall on my head!  I was so determined!  But I still couldn't get it.     I loved swimming the backstroke, the side stroke, or the doggie paddle.  But I hated the front stroke where you bend your arms and legs and turn your head to breathe all at the same time.

I was just reading through this post and was noticing all the people who started the exercises, but haven't been posting the results.  I really would love to hear about your experiences, good or not so good.   

Thanks to those that have posted!! 

I was trying to think of any updates and have not had any dramatic improvements lately.  I would say that things are continuing to be good.  I have bad days and good days, but I still feel such a difference from the way things used to be that it seems strange now, to ever go back to the way it used to be.

I was at my Mom's today, making gnocchi (an Italian potatoe pasta - yum yum yum!!!) and my sister was listening to me complain about how my kids were making messes in my house.  She looked at my mom and said "She never noticed these things before!!"

It is funny how things have changed for me.  I can't say that it is perfect.  I forgot my son's scout meeting today, but I remembered about 7  other things this week that I know I would have forgotten before crawling when I wasn't on meds.

Anyway, it is still working for me.  And the improvements are consistent.

Keep posting!!! 

Hey jerbear,

I'm not taking role or anything.  I have skipped a week too.  Just keep going if you want to try it out.  It still is helping me.

oprah sux!!!

oprah sux!!!

oprah imac!!!

What's weird is, Tom Cruise says he has ADHD!  He is the one jumping on the furniture.  It is too bad that Tom Cruise doesn't embrace his ADHD and help others with it instead of putting others down for doing something about it.

I think that Tom's success is one of those rare times when ADHD works to your advantage.   He became successful quickly enough to not let his ADHD nature work against him. 

Does that make sense?   He can't see the forest for the trees now.  He thinks that everybody can get a break like him and that ADHD is something that fuels his creativity and everybody should be ok and love it.

Well, some of us struggle with day to day living when we don't live in the fantasy world of a movie star.

As far as Oprah goes.  It may be something that she has done in the past.  Also, it may be one of a million different suggestions made that the people on the show have to sift through.  I think it would make a great show, but then you never know what producers will think. 

Well, guys, I am posting here something that I noticed since crawling, although I haven't been crawling enough lately.  It seems to me that my progress is slowing because I am not finding the time to crawl.  I am posting things on e-bay to sell my artwork, and so I have devoted all my time to that.  (maybe that is an improvement also!!!  I can post on e-bay and teach school at the same time - I never was able to do that before.  I always waited until spring break or something. ) 

Anyway.  I have noticed that in my class, when I am explaining things to the kids in history, I don't get as mixed up as I used to get.  I would mix up words and the kids would correct me and I wouldn't realize I said the wrong thing. I sill do it in math - the kids still correct me, but in reading and presenting text, I don't have as much of a problem.

So that makes me happy.  Also, my room is neat, the floor is picked up each day, the room gets a bit messy, but I keep up on it better than ever. 

I gave a test today, I graded it, and I recorded the scores.  I have never done that all in one day before!!!  I usually put it all in one big pile and get overwhelmed on Saturday.  So, I am proud of myself for being able to get things done.

Hi Anni and Imac......I have written to the oprah show on numerous occcasions and all I ever got was a standard email thanking me for my comments. I have requested several times to go on the show and speak about ADHD from the view point of a parent of a child who has ADHD it but it has been to no avail. I guess average folk cant bring in the ratings. That really makes me angry Oprah had two upcoming shows listed on her website at the time and was looking for participants so I sent out several emails requsting to be on the show.

Anni, i hope you have better luck in terms of a response from the staff on the oprah show and Imac, I missed the shows too but I doubt we missed much.

Hi Anni, Have you seen this site before. I think it re-enforces what your book it talking about. It makes so much sense. I have got to make this crawling thing a priority!

http://ond.manofchange.co.uk/ond_content.html

• Reading and Writing Difficulty
• Numeracy and Organisational Difficulties
• Co-ordination Problems and Clumsiness
• Poor Concentration / Distractability
• Visual and Auditory Processing Difficulties
• Daytime Poor Bladder Control and / or Bedwetting
• Delayed Speech and Language Disorders
• Hypersensitivity: both physical and emotional
• Impulsiveness
• Agressive Outbursts: verbal and physical
• Hyperactivity or Immature Behaviour
• Stressed, Withdrawn, and over Tired
• Lack of Energy and Poor Motivation (Couch Potato)
• Balance Problems
• Fear of Fairground Rides
• School Phobia
• Hearing and sequencing difficulties

Go kppy!  I really believe more and more that the primitive reflexes cause a lot of these problems.  There is so much research - not in the US - that is going on.

cj - I can understand your hesitancy in thinking that this will change who you are, but I tell you, this past weekend I have posted so much of my own artwork on e-bay (art) and it is the same quality or even better than I used to do before crawling.  Before, in the fogginess of my ADD, I might not even get around to posting arwork, let alone finish it.

The things I was afraid of it changing, it just doesn't for me.  I worried that the exercises would change my art.  It hasn't changed it at all.  I have more time now - I'm not in the ADD time warp.  I have time to do my art, even during school.

The things it does change for me are good things.  I don't feel like I am being like you said in your post

"i reckon anni will always be ok no matter what she does because she is a small angel, always being altruistic and considering others and changing herself for the benefit of others. "

I surely do not feel like I am crawling for anyone else but myself.  I was angry when I found out I had ADD.  I was frustrated because I know I am smart.  I know I have intelligence.  All the ADD stuff gets in my way and puts up road blocks for me. 

I crawl for me, to improve my life.

I find it amazing.  I feel like I am standing on the edge of a pool, having washed off all the fogginess, the forgetfullness, and the misplaced items and standing there, reborn!!!  I know that sounds dramatic, but I feel great!  Over spring break I put on two groups of e-bay paintings with 10 to 15 paintings I did during the break, I cleaned my house - which was a mess.  I actually have made my bed two times since the break started.  (I never make my bed!!!)  So, for me, personally and in my soul, I feel like I am the person I was always meant to be and the road blocks have been taken away.

cj - no one can force you to be anything other than what you are.  If you want to stay ADD, it is fine with me!! I totally understand and I will support you. 

I have a colleague who seems happy and content.  I know she has ADD.  She has all the symptoms I had and more!!  She reminds me of myself a couple of years ago when I started to teach.  She is a teacher too. I have told her about the exercises and she doesn't seem as interested.  I can see so clearly how they could help her.  But hey, she has to want it badly enough.  She has to hate the ADD problems like I did.  She laughs at them so much more than I did.  I used to cry over them.  Now, I don't have very many to cry over.

I am more confident than ever. 

Well, that is my spill on things.  Sorry to go on and on, ladies.  It is an interesting thing we are all going through.

Bumper...

Anni, I wanted to share with you some things I've learned that validate the crawling theory.

In my informal survey of the many folks I know that have ADHD and their kids, not ONE of them crawled well as a baby.

There was a documentary on recently about the children in Africa that have learning disabilites, and they cited not getting down on the ground with the snakes and crawling as being the cause.  (Likewise, I think we should get our babies out of those walkers that are so popular.)

My son's school couselor has done work with her son in regard to the midline issue, which crawling addresses, and saw within 2 weeks a huge difference.  She also said that some children in China who had learning disabilities had not learned to jump up and down well or enough.  Well guess what?  They read up and down.  Amazing connection.

I ordered the book, as I did the combat crawl and am a scatter brain.  I'm joining you folks real soon.  Thanks so much for sharing your efforts!

Here is another update.

I haven't been crawling as much as I should and so I haven't noticed as much improvements lately, but I did have a good experience shopping - which is something I hate to do.

I was looking at the CDs for my hubby (our anniversary is tomorrow) and I thought, it would be great to get a CD from that group he mentioned the other day.  I remembered that it was a guy's name.

Now, usually that is all I would be able to remember and I would be frustrated and go home to get more frustrated when I ask him about it and find out the name!!!!

But tonight, I remembered!!!  I even cried a little in the store because I never remember stuff like that and it was so cool.

I am going to rededicate myself to crawling more.  I did it tonight, so here goes again.

How are you all doing with the crawling?  Have you noticed improvements too!!

Thanks for all your support here.   It means a lot to me.

Anni

 Imac, she did a different program, but it did include crawling.  Perhaps I missunderstood her, and I apologize if in my scattered enthusiasm I spread misinformation. Perhaps she read a different book or did a diffrent program than that we are talking about here.  There are more than one way to skin a cat, they say.  I did not get the specific name from her. 

Also, seems like many "programs" have their own names for issues that they address. For instance, Dore will not label anything like ADHD or autism, for example.  They have come up with their own term for it, called cerebellar development delay.  (CDD)

By the way, I am sitting on my foot as I type. 

cj, I tried it and I could get my hands up but not over my head.  This exercises is in the area of the STNR, I'm sure you could be right. 

I think that the STNR and the other reflexes affect us more than we know.  I wish there was more research.

calicorose,

It is great that you are getting on the bandwagon too!  When I was reading the book, I remember a part, or maybe it was when I was talking to the authors, I can't remember which.  But they said that the exercises will help things that will surprise you.  I think they told me that when I was talking to them, come to think of it.  My threory is that crawling will mature more than just the STNR.  I believe it will mature other reflexes too.

When I read about the reflexes, I find that I have symptoms of many of them.  The startle reflex is one that I know I have.  It is a different reflex than the STNR.  I still startle, I am trying to notice if it isn't as bad. 

One more thing to post here - and I know all of you will laugh!!!!

I have made my bed for the last 6 days!!!!

I have never done that in my whole life!!!!  It is so nice to crawl into a nice made bed each night.  And it only takes me a minute in the morning.  No amount of any telling me from my mom made me do this at any time in my life before!!!  It is only since I have noticed on my own and that I can see the process is simple and easy for me that I have begun to do it.  I find it so nice and refreshing!!!

Crawling has made my life so different.  I hope it helps all of you too!

Anni

jerbear,

I used to jog all the time, but I haven't for a few years.  I will have to give it a go again to see if I notice anything like you describe.  I know I have the habit of stubbing my toe when I jog and I don't pick up my feet enough sometimes.  I have to think about lifting my feet up.  Once I tripped and had to walk back home with blood from my knee all over.  I can imagine that your balance problem could be connected to the STNR or to another primitive reflex.  There are a few different ones.

BTW congrats on your weight loss - that is terrific!!

jerbear, it will be very interesting to see if the crawling helps with these things for you.  Please keep us posted.

i usually run at night after the adderall wears off but one time i ran 2 hours after i took a 20mg xr and i felt like my shoulders were straight and my posture was good and my knees didn't hurt, like my body was lined up perfectly!

i haven't read this entire thread - but has the author of the book Nancy O'Dell created a DVD with the techniques on it?  i do better at visual explanations.

does nancy have a website?  maybe we could bombard her with e-mails.

chjones,

That is cool that you are helping your friend.  I found that the book did the same thing for me.  I would read more and identify with it more. 

Keep us posted as to his progress and yours too if you try it!!!  It certainly can't hurt anything.  That was my view when I started.  And it has done nothing but help me.  (Well, maybe embarrass me a little as I crawl across the floor each day!!)

ok, i sent a second e-mail to Patricia Cook (the co-author whose e-mail is shown on the site) asking for specific info about the DVD (run time, # of minutes allocated to the demo of the exercises, whether you can "workout" to the disc until you have the moves down).

the DVD costs $30.

i have questions for the crawling veterans -

how many minutes did it take to learn the moves

how many days did it take you before you got the moves down,

and now that you know the moves, how many minutes a day do you spend working out with the moves?

gettingclear,

I don't have the DVD.  I just have the book.  I looked at the pictures in the book and I followed the written instructions.  I do the exercises when I can.  I teach school so I do them at least once a week.  They take 15 to 20 minutes to do each time.  It didn't take me long to get the moves down.  They are simple crawling and rocking moves.  I guess they took me reading the instructions a few times and making sure I had them right.  I was just a little uncomfortable at first because the reflex was bugging me.  You have to keep your head up in a crawling position when you would rather look at the floor.  Also your hands have to be flat and I would rather be up with my fingers when I crawl. 

So, it isn't that hard to begin them, it is just a little uncomfortable to be in the position until you get used to it.  The exercises increase in difficulty only when you are ready, so I have found them to be easy.  It is hard to keep doing them consistently.  But when I do , I see results. 

Good luck to you.

The authors haven't approved my method or anything, but it seems to work for me.  What I do when I don't have someone to help me is . . .

I put a heavy book on my head. That gives resistance, especially in the area of the reflex, in the back of my neck and shoulders.  I usually have to pause after a while and massage my shoulders and straighten my head and neck and then go on, because it gets sore.  I do both the rocking and the crawling exercises that are in the first 8 weeks that way.

I also wear those ankle weights that you use to do aerobics.  I know that isn't the same as someone pushing on you, but it does add some resistance as I crawl. 

I don't think the second round (the second eight weeks of the exercises) will work alone because you have to listen to a command before you crawl.  So, with the second round, which I will get to soon, I will need to get my family to help me more.

Good luck to you and your friend. 

goinsunshine,

That is a totally awesome site.  It really explains a lot of things to me.  Like why using omegas works and supplements.  It also addresses the issue of primitive reflexes in a more comprehensive way. 

I'm so glad you posted it goinsunshine.  Thank you.  I bookmarked it and I am going to read it more thoroughly.

• If you are in a job where some of your difficulties are advantageous, you may not be able to perform this role. E.g. architect, artist; your perception of the world will change, so will your drawing.
• Emotionally the effects can be very disturbing, with people experiencing flashbacks, regression.

MiliataryMother,

I have found that even when I do them once a week, they still seem to help me.  It is just going to take a long time.  But doing a little is better than doing none. That is what I figure.  So, if you can do them for a few times a week, go for it!  Maybe once your life is settled a little and there is more time, say in the summer during school break, you will be able to work hard on them.   Don't be too hard on yourself.

jerbear,

That is interesting what your physical therapist said about your muscles.  I could never do a pull up to save my life!!  I'm wondering now in my forties if I'll be able to get them back in shape after the crawling exercises.  It seems odd that this reflex could affect muscles too.  But hey, it affects handwriting and coordination and brain memory, so I guess muscles are just another piece of all of this. 

I found the crawling exercises got easier to do, the more I did them too.

How many times have you done them now?  I keep a chart in my bedroom - I could post it or e-mail it to you if you want it.  It helps me keep track of how often I have done the exercises.  I would never know when to move to the next one if I didn't keep track somehow.

NEW UPDATE!!

I asked my family to notice if I slouch as much since I have been doing these crawling exercises.  The reflex that I am trying to mature is located in your upper back.  I always slouched as a kid and I have terrible posture usually. 

I noticed it a lot when I would drive.  I would stick my head out almost horizonally to my body.  My neck and head would be sticking way out.  It is hard to describe.  But it looked odd. 

My daughter told me that I don't stick my neck out anymore when I drive.  I was hoping that it would help and it has. 

For those of you who are wondering what I am talking about -

There is a primitive reflex in your body when you are a baby called the STNR.  It is located in your upper back.  When your arms and legs are bent at the same time, it urges you to move, to unbend your arms or your legs.  This is really a reflex.  I have researched it, and there are more reflexes than just the STNR that we have as babies.  Well, when you drive, you are forced to bend your arms and legs at the same time, sometimes for long periods of time.  I know I used to hate to get into a car and I never have enjoyed driving.  And my posture when driving would be embarrassing.  When I would catch myself doing it, I would sit up, but I would eventually resume my slouching.  I believe I was always trying to get comfortable because this reflex was bugging me.

Well, the theory of this book (Stopping ADHD) and other researchers is that these reflexes when not matured can stay with us and give us the symptoms of ADD and ADHD.  Some believe they can cause other learning disabilities also.

The reflexes can cause other things like poor penmanship, poor posture, and poor coordination. 

So, the exercises are helping my posture.  This is awesome!!! 

That is an awesome benefit!  Thanks for sharing.

sdinenno,

I read a book called Stopping ADHD with a totally different theory as to what causes ADHD and ADD in 75% of all cases (according to the book). 

We all have primitive reflexes that are part of our development when we are babies.  These reflexes normally mature and do not bother us.  But sometimes when a person does not get the appropriate amount of crawling done when he or she is a baby, or does not crawl in the right way (dragging a leg or the spider crawl) then the reflex can stay with you as you grow and into adulthood.  There are many primitive reflexes (you can search for them online and find them) but the one the book claims to be able to mature through crawling exercises is called the Symmetrical Tonic Neck Reflex (STNR).

I was very drawn to the book when I began reading it because I had semi-clubbed feet when I was born and had to be in casts and shoes with a bar.  I did not crawl much before I walked. 

According to the theory, if you still have this reflex bothering you, you will be uncomfortable with your arms and legs bent at the same time.  In other words, you will feel this reflex urging you to get up, move, or straighten either your arms or your legs.  Children and adults that have this reflex bothering them will sit on their legs, wrap their legs and feet around chair legs, to trap the reflex so that they can stay in their chairs.  They tend to be distracted because they have to deal with this discomfort all their lives and they think it is normal because it has always been this way for them.  The authors believe that this is a major cause of ADD and ADHD.

If you crawl now, and do the exercises in the book, you can eliminate symptoms of ADD and ADHD.  I have tried it and I totally believe this theory.  I have done about two months of crawling and I can remember things so much better.  I am more organized.  I notice things around me when before I wouldn't.  I have better posture and handwriting.  I was diagnosed with ADD inattentive type and medication really helped me for awhile.  But then it wore off.  I am so happy to have found this book and exercises.  The book is not very expensive.  There is a video, but I haven't ordered it.  There is also a clinic in Indiana, but I have done everything from the directions in the book.

I posted this thread to post my progress and so that others who are trying it will have a place to post their progress also. 

I would love to know if you try it and it helps you too. 

If you have more questions, you can ask me or pm me.  You can also read this post, although it is huge and hard to get through.

Didn't mean to beat ya, Anni!  I think writing it and helping others helps to solidify if for me. 

We also start the Dore program next week, and am wondering if both exercises would be OK to start at the same time.  Might as well fix both things at the same time while we're at it, if Dore doesn't  object.

calicorose,

I'm so glad that more people are learning about this program.  So, post away!

[QUOTE=annidagostini]

sdinenno,

I read a book called Stopping ADHD with a totally different theory as to what causes ADHD and ADD in 75% of all cases (according to the book). 

We all have primitive reflexes that are part of our development when we are babies.  These reflexes normally mature and do not bother us.  But sometimes when a person does not get the appropriate amount of crawling done when he or she is a baby, or does not crawl in the right way (dragging a leg or the spider crawl) then the reflex can stay with you as you grow and into adulthood.  There are many primitive reflexes (you can search for them online and find them) but the one the book claims to be able to mature through crawling exercises is called the Symmetrical Tonic Neck Reflex (STNR).

I was very drawn to the book when I began reading it because I had semi-clubbed feet when I was born and had to be in casts and shoes with a bar.  I did not crawl much before I walked. 

According to the theory, if you still have this reflex bothering you, you will be uncomfortable with your arms and legs bent at the same time.  In other words, you will feel this reflex urging you to get up, move, or straighten either your arms or your legs.  Children and adults that have this reflex bothering them will sit on their legs, wrap their legs and feet around chair legs, to trap the reflex so that they can stay in their chairs.  They tend to be distracted because they have to deal with this discomfort all their lives and they think it is normal because it has always been this way for them.  The authors believe that this is a major cause of ADD and ADHD.

If you crawl now, and do the exercises in the book, you can eliminate symptoms of ADD and ADHD.  I have tried it and I totally believe this theory.  I have done about two months of crawling and I can remember things so much better.  I am more organized.  I notice things around me when before I wouldn't.  I have better posture and handwriting.  I was diagnosed with ADD inattentive type and medication really helped me for awhile.  But then it wore off.  I am so happy to have found this book and exercises.  The book is not very expensive.  There is a video, but I haven't ordered it.  There is also a clinic in Indiana, but I have done everything from the directions in the book.

I posted this thread to post my progress and so that others who are trying it will have a place to post their progress also. 

I would love to know if you try it and it helps you too. 

If you have more questions, you can ask me or pm me.  You can also read this post, although it is huge and hard to get through.[/QUOTE]

It sounds looney. But as they used to say in the old TV shows "it's so crazy it just might work." And it wouldn't be the first unusual treatment I've tried. If all I need to pay for is a book, then why not give it a whirl?

Is the book you mentioned the best source of information about this method? Is there anything on the web about it? I'll do some searches and see what I can find.

Everytime I meet someone with ADHD, I ask (and I seem to know and come across TONS of them, kids and adults) "how was your crawling as a baby?"  Every single one of them had some issue with crawling.  That's where I find validity in what this book is about. 

Anni, one question for you, do you remember ever coming across information about "midine" issues and crawling?  I mean the issues that effect crossing over one part of the body to the other in daily activities or in sports.  Does crawling help with this one to?  As a kid, I did piano, and had such a hard time compared to the other kids; I just could not get the left hand and right hand going together, and read the music at the same time.  (The only way I could play something well was to actually memorize it after much tedium, or learn to play from ear.)  Also, with the guitar, it's such a struggle, but I love them both so much I wish I could do better.  I think both would be considered midline issues.   Do you think the crawling exercises would help in those areas? 

And, do you thin all those funny postures become normal after crawling?  Did you have any of those?  I'm getting too old to keep foling my legs underneath me...it hurts!

calicorose!!!

You beat me to the punch!  You explained it all so well.  Thanks!   Be sure to let us know how long you have tried the exercises and if they help. 

Crawling? What is this all about? Please explain to me what crawling exercises have to do with treating ADHD. I'm willing to try anything at this point, but I don't know what you're talking about and I don't see how it can work. What's the theory behind it?

Stuart

Many ADHD'rs did not crawl, crawl well, or for long enough as babies.  There is a reflex that matures during the 6 or so months of crawling as a baby.  This reflex, if not matured, causes some of the symptoms of ADHD, having to do with being comfortable sitting still, concentration, etc.  I just got the book and started reading it.  I've had the crawling theory presented to me for years, but I guess now I'm ready to listen, because of reading this thread!

With an unmatured reflex, the top part of the body wants to be straight when the lower body is bent, and vice versa.  Thus, the many odd positions we see our kids in.  I was reading some of the typical postures these kids take on and was laughing my head off!  It's both me and my son!  Neither of can sit still, or in the "proper position" for very long, it's just too uncomfortable, because of this reflex.  I sit on my legs in an attempt to stop squirming and take on an odd postures at work sitting all day, I look like a slacker. But, it's just more comfortable.  Same for my son.  I keep saying to him, "sit up, you slaker" and he becomes more uncomfortable and stops concentrating.  I owe him a huge apolgy.  He was just trying to be comfy, like I was as a kid.

The crawling exercises basically teach you to crawl and get what we missed as a baby, to mature that reflex.  Takes 6-8 months to go through the program.

I just got the book mentioned here, "Stopping ADHD" by Nancy E. O'Dell, Ph.D, and Patricia A. Cook, PhD.  Now it all makes sense.  We will start crawling next week. 

That's it in a nutshell.  Anni is wonderful, and has been doing these since November, I think.  It's a lot to read through in the threads, but you can read her amazing progress there.

Imac,

No worries.  The midline issue is interesting to me also.  I guess I didn't really understand it fully until calico answered your question, so I'm glad it's on here.

I think I am more comforatable switching hands to give a pen or pass something across the midline too.  I never have studied that and I am going to notice if it affects me more.

Very interesting.  I am going to read your new post calico.

Anni, we did 2/3 of both the initial exercises for the first time tonight.  My son was so funny!  a 13-yo kiddo putting his hands on his mum's bum for reistance was almost too much!  And our wrists and our necks hurt!  It's NO WONDER we skipped this painful step as babies!  But now we have each other to go through this horror with. 

What became of the other crawlers???  Calling you out! 

calico,

I couldn't handle the hands to the bottom idea.  The authors said that I should think about it like it was physical therapy.  I can understand that, but it still bothers me.  I use a different way to provide resistance.  It is not approved by the authors, so I guess it might not work as well, but here it is.  I have my son or daughter kneel in front of me.  I have them hold onto my upper arms and pull as I rock backward.  That provides resistance as I rock by pulling instead of pushing.

Another thing you can do that the author told me about was to put some kind of pillow between the hands and the bottom.  It sounds a lot better to me.  I guess I could be more laid back about it, but I it bothers me.  I still love what these exercises have done for me though.  

joemom,

I have this idea of adding resistance in an easier way.  What do you think everybody?  

If you put some kind of jacket or harness on the person (child or adult) and held onto it with a strap to provide resistance.  I don't think this would work with the second set of exercises, but maybe with the first set.

sdienno,

The book is all I use.  I have even bought used copies of the book on Amazon for only $2.50 and about the same in shipping.  I give copies away all the time or lend them out and then I don't have one for myself.  The authors have a website

On the website you can buy the book and a DVD that shows the exercises if you are a visual person. 

I have done lots of searches on the internet and have found more research being done on the primitive reflexes and the problems they leave.  I have much in the UK and some is Australia.  Search for primitive reflexes or the STNR and ADHD together and you get some good research; I did.

I think that this theory is so different from what we think ADHD is that most people think it is a fluke or a scam.  But I don't.  I did at first.  I actually picked up the book from the shelf because I thought it was wrong.  I thought that there was no way anyone could "stop adhd."  I believed I would have to live with it all my life.  Now I find the symptoms extrememly reduced and almost gone.  I still need to do 6 more months of crawling, I do it on the weekends.  This summer I will hit it hard.  I hope to be done with them this summer.

I think it is definitely worth reading about and trying. 

Let us know if you try it.

Everytime I meet someone with ADHD, I ask (and I seem to know and come across TONS of them, kids and adults) "how was your crawling as a baby?"  Every single one of them had some issue with crawling.  That's where I find validity in what this book is about. 

Anni, one question for you, do you remember ever coming across information about "midine" issues and crawling?  I mean the issues that effect crossing over one part of the body to the other in daily activities or in sports.  Does crawling help with this one to?  As a kid, I did piano, and had such a hard time compared to the other kids; I just could not get the left hand and right hand going together, and read the music at the same time.  (The only way I could play something well was to actually memorize it after much tedium, or learn to play from ear.)  Also, with the guitar, it's such a struggle, but I love them both so much I wish I could do better.  I think both would be considered midline issues.   Do you think the crawling exercises would help in those areas? 

And, do you thin all those funny postures become normal after crawling?  Did you have any of those?  I'm getting too old to keep foling my legs underneath me...it hurts!

[/QUOTE]

Calicorose,

I have done the same thing with many students in my classes at school.  When I suspect that this reflex is bothering them, I will ask their parents if they crawled much as a baby.  I ususally get the answer that they walked early, or that something happened to keep them from crawling.  Sometimes the parents don't remember.  But usually they answer that they didn't crawl much.

It's funny that you mention piano playing.  I had trouble learning the piano's left hand too.  My parents had a player organ and I could learn a left hand chord fairly easily, but when I had to play something more complicated, it was difficult.  I took piano lessons in college.  I have actually found playing the piano easier since I've been crawling.  I used to skip over the more difficult pieces.  Then I noticed since I've been crawling that I can play those that I usually skipped fairly easily.  It made me cry when I could finally play them. 

When you were practicing your piano, you had to have your arms and legs bent at the same time and move your head up and down to look at the music.  That is a classic position to be in to have the STNR bothering you.  According to the book, you had to try ten times harder to play the piano and to concentrate than someome who is not bothered by this reflex.  It makes so much sense.  I love the piano too and always wished I could play it better.  That is awesome that you play guitar.  (bent arms and legs for that instrument too, unless you are standing. )  Perhaps you should give it a try to play your guitar while standing and see if it seems easier. 

So, I guess to answer your question, I believe it has a great deal to do with midline brain crossover, or whatever you call it.  I know that I could never do a cartwheel as a child.  I had an extremely hard time trying to do a back bend.  I never could do one.  I fell on my head one day, attempting one, and blacked out that whole day (small little black outs in vision)  I put my brother's football helmet on and kept trying.  But I never got it.

I think memory works somehow with midline crossover from one side of our brain to the other.  This is just my theory.  But I can't explain how I can remember things so much better now that I have been crawling.  It is awesome and unexplainable to me. I never could juggle either.  I have a hard time coordinating the movement of both hands like that.  I haven't tried to learn to juggle since the crawling, but maybe I should do it after I get all the crawling done.

The book itself doesn't mention these types of things, but I think it is an extra added bonus.   I have found webites that talk about the primitive reflexes keeping connections from being made in your brain.  I can't remember where I read it, but it was on a website I had searched out.  They claimed that once you matured the reflex, your brain could make the connections that it needed to that would help in the areas of ADHD.  I totally agree.  I have lived both sides now.  I would have to laugh if anybody now told me that ADHD or ADD wasn't real.  It definitely is real and it can be changed.  I know that. 

And for your posture question.  I have better posture in the car as I drive.  I don't stick my neck way out anymore when I drive.  I can also sit through a play in a chair with limited leg room very easily now.  I can sit at my computer without sitting on my legs.  So, yes, the exercises do help with posture and with sitting on your legs and slouching. 

Sorry for the long post.

calico,

I really like the leash idea.  That is cool. I'm going to try it.

We have been doing crawling off and on for a few months now....not sure if I see progress...I think we need to be much more consistent...

We have a "baby harness" I am going to see if I can figure a way to fit it to my son so we get resistance near the shoulders...

I will let you know how it works

Hey everyone,

Someone mentioned on the alternative board that chiropractic helps with ADHD.  I was thinking about that and I noticed something.

Before I started crawling I would ask my hubby to crack my back almost every night.  And I would love back rubs in the shoulder blade area.  Oh, I would relax so much!! It was heaven.  I have always loved having my back cracked.  I would ask my hubby to give me a hug and pull up on my spine toward the top of my back.  It felt sooo good to have it pop.

I haven't asked him to crack my back for a long time.  Probably a couple of months.  The only thing I can think of is that the exercises are helping my upper back stay in alignment.  I know I have the better posture in the car like I mentioned in a previous post. 

Funny huh?

Imac, sorry for the wording.  I have always called it that.  It always felt so good to get it popped back into place.  I don't know much about it.  I have never been to a chiropractor.  I guess I should be more careful from what calico said.

calico, that is so cool that it is helping your back too.  It is funny how many things these exercises seem to help me with.

Anni, sorry for all the questions, I got one more......

When you started these, did you ever feel like your thoughts were actually rearranging?  The way I've been thinking today, like some of those pathways "broke."  If you went through this, I think you would know what I mean.  Like a thought process just would not complete, or with a series of structured ordered events like the production I do at work went askew.  I knew what to do, but did something else, and went, "why did I do THAT then?"  Does this make any sence.  I don't recall the book mentioning this kind of reaction.  I do take it as a good sign.

The dog-leash harness thingy is working out great!  My son (the inventor) figured if the leash clips cliped on to my centerback belt loop, and then looped the leashes under my arms and up over my shoulders, and he could hold on to the ends from behind.  It was very comfortable for both of us, with just the right amount of resistance.

Calicorose,

I think I know what you mean.  Before I started crawling, I would get ready for the day in a haphazard sort of way.  I knew what time I needed to be out the door, but I hardly ever made it by that time.  I can't say now what would stop me, or interrupt me.

When I started to notice changes after crawling, I noticed that I began to think about the morning differently.  I actually broke the hour I had into four parts - 15 minutes each - one for breakfast and packing lunch, one for ironing any clothes I needed and getting dressed, one for contacts and make up and one for back up if anything went wrong or helping my kids.  It was weird that I never had thought of it that way before. 

Is that the kind of change that you mean?

I also notice that I don't make as many mistakes in reading outloud to the kids in my class.  I always would before mix up words - like saying "the horse metal shoes" instead of "the metal horse shoes."  My fourth graders always got a kick out of catching me saying things backwards.  We all laugh and go on.  But lately I haven't been doing that very often at all. 

I really love the leash idea.  I'm going to use it for sure.

Go Calico!!

Do you now feel like you did when you were taking your medication that helped you?

Actually, what I'm experiencing now is a MORE disorganization of thoughts than before.  I take it as a good sign, like remodeling the kitchen.  Got to make a mess before it all gets put back together brand spanky new.

The Dore doc said the same thing would happen to my kiddo.  I think I know what he'll be going through soon, and am glad summer's coming.  Hopefully and changes like that will occurr before school starts up again!  Hey, we actually met Mr. Dore tonight!  He is one cool person and dad.

Calicorose,

I feel that my thinking is better than when I took meds because the meds would last only part of the day.  In the evening and in the morning when the meds weren't in effect, I felt in a fog still.  With my crawling, I feel like I can think clearly all of the time.  It doesn't wear off.  And I have no side effects.  Only good things here.

That's interesting that your thoughts seem more disorganized.  I suppose it does take a while.

Keep posting! 

Anni, it was really nice to hear that the exercises did for you what the meds did  for you too! 

I wanted to let you, and the others know, I got the DVD from the Center.  It does explain the exercises much better, and in motion!  I just don't get the later exercises from the written word, I'm so visual.  I also enjoyed the testimonials from the kids themselves who had gone through the program.  Highly recommended! 

I'm on week 2.  My son is wonderful, helping me with these.  He is definately THE BEST!  I love him sooooo much! 

calico,

Maybe I will have to get the DVD too.   I have been doing it all by just reading.  I suppose it would be helpful.  I am very visual also.  It took me a couple of times rereading before I got it in my head what I was supposed to be doing for each section.

Well, crawlers, I am leaving yet another update.  I find things everyday that I do differently.  To me it has been an awesome journey and it is not even over yet!!

This weekend I did so many things that I am just shaking my head in disbelief that it could be so simple now.  Here are some of them.

I started out Friday by taking my son to a soccer tryout.  I remembered!!  Saturday morning was filled with cleaning my kitchen, correcting over half the homework I needed to (I teach school), shopping for a shower gift, going to Home Depot and finding out what I needed to do to fix my sprinkling system for my lawn - which is dying in the middle but green on the edges - , digging until I found five sprinkler heads in my lawn (I rarely do any yardwork), making a roast dinner for my family, and attending a shower with my daughter.  Today, I attended church, came home, helped my daughter start to clean her room which was a dusty, dirty, cluttered mess, attended choir practice, came back and finished organizing and cleaning my daughter's room (I know she should have done it, but I know what it is like - she is just like I was!!!)  And I wanted to do something nice for her.  She has had a rough couple of days - oh the life of a teenager!  I also made lasagna for dinner and cleaned up almost every dish. The dishwasher is running as I type this.  I also have done a load of laundry in the middle of all that.  And, by the way, I have made my bed for the past two weeks (approx) every day!!!!  I like doing it, too!!  I like the smoothness of the blankets and the way it looks.  It bugs me to see it messy.  I was never like this before. 

This kind of a weekend never happened before I began these exercises.  My weekends were always so frustrating!  I could never get anything done and I felt like I was in a daze half the time, daydreaming I think.  I asked my husband what I used to do on Saturday and he said, "Well, you ususally played games on the computer."  I can't believe I wasted all my time like that.  I know that I liked playing games, but I didn't realize I spent so much time on them. 

I don't mean to brag here and seem like I am so wonderful to have accomplished so much this weekend.  It is just so different for me.  It is odd, seeing the world from this other side now.  I can see how people can get frustrated with someone who has ADD or ADHD.  It seems so simple now, to stay organized and to get things done.  I hope I can be patient with my kids who are so much like I was before I crawled. 

I am going to really get the exercises going for them this summer.  It is going to be one big happy crawling family.  I haven't been consistent with my kids crawling at all and I am feeling guilty about that.

This is an overall update.  I feel like I could stop the exercises right now and be perfectly content that I could survive in this world without all the embarrassing moments of ADD problems.  But I am going to keep on crawling until I am finished.  It has been so awesome for me.

Thanks for all your support here.  It has meant the world to me.  :)

Oh, and one other really awesome thing to report!!!!

I noticed and talked to my daughter about this one.  She agreed that I have changed in this regard.

When I do clean, I am calm.  Does that seem strange to anybody?  It is wonderful to me.  Usually when I clean, especially my kids' rooms, I would get all aggitated and annoyed.  I would get frustrated and mad at them, maybe at myself too for not knowing quite how to keep things nice for them.  Today and lately when I've been cleaning the house, I am calm and happy about it.  The happy part I think comes from finally knowing what to do to get the thing clean!!!! It is hard to explain.  There is a major difference in my attempts to clean my house and keep it clean from pre-crawling to now.

So, another plus for crawling.  I have found that my life is calmer.  I do not rush like a mad woman all over looking for things, driving to work in the fast lane, trying to make all the green lights so perhaps I can get to work 5 minutes faster than possible!!  I calmly go about my day, getting things done.   It is totally awesome!!!!  

I hope these help you guys as much as they have helped me.  If it is placebo - it is awesome placebo!!!!!!  I truly do not think it is placebo!! 

It is crazy how much I have changed.  My sister says so too and she lived with me all my life growing up!!! 

It's so good to hear your updates.  Remeber the ladies said about 1/2 way through you want to quit because you are so happy with the results, just imagine what progress you will make by the time you finish!  I am so happy for you. 

I'm week 2 through crawling.  My son couln't help me last week for a couple of days, so I used the book on my shoulders, I figure that's better than not doing it at all.  I can tell I"m in the "under construction' part.  I'm loosing my mind!  Cannot see things right in front of me, though I look over and over again.  Particularly at work on the monitor screen.  The Omegas help me not care too much though!    My son says it will come back even better.  I love my kiddo!  He will feel under construction soon too, as they said that with the Dore program. 

Keep us updated!  You are an inspiration to many. 

Hi,

I just started the crawling exercises with two of my boys after receiving my book on Sunday.  (I also found a few of the "dore" type exercises Friday and tried them with my kids on Saturday.)  I'm excited about all of this and hoping it will help.  It will take alot of self discipline I'm sure.  One thing I noticed, though, and maybe it is all totally coincidental is that after doing several of the dore exercises with my child who has the most significant delays, he was EXTREMELY irritable on Sunday (the next day).  He had a blast doing the exercises, but his mood the next day was HORRIBLE.  Has anyone had this experience or could this just be a coincidence?

Anyway, I will be glad to continue to update as we progress.  I'm not sure if I want to do the dore or the crawling or both.  They both make sense and have offers of help in different areas.  My one who has the most delays and learning problems seems he would need dore more.  Any thoughts?

Frazzle

I jsut

I am not familiar enough with the Dore program to offer any help there.  But perhaps the others can help you in that regard. 

I never noticed any irritablility after doing the exercises in the Stopping ADHD book.  I didn't notice any "underconstruction" part, but perhaps I didn't know to look for that.  The book doesn't mention anything about it.  It is a Dore program thing, I suppose. 

I have noticed that my improvements have gone in swings.  What I mean is, that it will seem to be so much better and then come down a little, then back up, but each time it is a higher swing into the positive.  Does that make sense.  I don't know if that is what the others are exeriencing also.

But anyway, it is wonderful to me.

Today, my bed is made!  I fixed dinner - it was a little late though - and I cleaned up all the dishes!!  It is great to feel the ease in what used to be overwhelming to me.  I have clean clothes in my closet for the week,  my son has clean clothes in his drawer!!!  A year ago, I would be up really late washing clothes I had forgotten to wash, or digging dirty clothes out of the laundry to see which is the cleanest for him to wear to school - it is really embarrassing to admit that, but that is what would happen.  Dinner would be late for sure and usually a stress for me because I could never decide quite what to cook.  The mess would be on the counters for a week before I got to the dishes, or had the kids clean up.  Life is so different for me.   I think of how my life was and now is and I wish I had found this book long ago. 

When teachers come into my room to ask for a copy of something, I go right to my files and pull it out!!  I could never do that before.  I would have to sift through many papers before finding what they wanted, or maybe I would find it a month or so later when I was packing for the summer.

Well, I won't go on and on.  Everyone keep posting.  I would love to know these have helped all of you as much as they have helped me.

Anni,

I can relate to the results you are getting.  I am currently taking Wellbutrin XL to get those type of results and have "normal" thought processes.  

I'm still pretty scatterbrained at times - mostly with losing things and forgetting to do things...setting goals and not following through...etc.  But, I'm a heck of alot better on med...I don't let it get me down as much and at least deal with the frustration better, plus it keeps me motivated. 

I found out from my mom that I walked at 10 mos and didn't crawl alot...so who knows?  I will try these exercises myself after seeing if my kids get results...they are the same way I am...probably worse.  My twins didn't crawl much...mostly because I was a young, overwhelmed mother with noone giving me advice on how important it was to have them on the floor. I managed them the best I could (I had one a year older, too) by mostly keeping them in walkers, carriers, highchairs, strollers, etc.  I wasn't aware of what I know now...that these early stages can have such a dramatic impact on a person's life.  But, I can't go back...just go forward! 

My youngest twin is very gung-ho about it.  He's so silly.. making baby sounds while he's crawling.  Whatever it takes to get him to do it, though.  He's done it 3 nights in a row so far.  I've started all of them on Omegas and magnesium as well.  I will keep you guys posted!

Frazzle

Frazzle!  Your bottom-toning comment made me remember something!  My son, who is 13, my Dore'er, is my crawling coach.  It was very difficult for both of us to be on the floor with him going backwards, so he invented this harness thing which works wonderfully!  We have 2 dogs, and borrowed thier leashes, with their permission of course.  The hooks he hooked onto my back center belt loop.  Then, we take the leashes under the arm, and up and over the shoulder, and he hangs on from the back, just like he's walking me.  I also have a handle from a theraband kit that he attached so he can hang on better with that.  It looks like I'm a boat and he's waterskiing.  It gives a good resistance, and is not as hard physically for either of us.  Keep us posted on thier progress! 

Anni, I'm on week 3.5 of crawling.  The brain is still under construction, and for some reason I'm not seeing things right in front of my field of vision.  It's weird, I hope the space will fill in soon.  I have to be careful driving, especially turnig corners.

I wanted to let Jerbear know I tried his slingshot idea, before I read about it!  I'm doing these on my own every other week, and with help the other week.  My son, my inventor, came up with a modification for the back and forth ones.  I have this theraband kit.  One long band has a clip on each end.  I wrap one end in a loop around my lower hips, and the other end to a sturdy table leg, face the table leg, and  back away from it to stretch it.  I think Jerbear just needed to turn around and FACE whatever he attached it to, then the resistance would be in the right direction.  

I've been crawling with a book on my shoulders, and re-read the past posts, and will add the ankle weights.  It's becoming much easier and smoother crawling by using 2 motions, instead of 4!  I mean moving the right leg and left arm at the same time, then the left leg and right arm at the same time.

Anni, have you found any modifactions for doing the later exercises on your own?  I know the center doesnt' approve them, but it's better than not doing them at all.  We will just be at it longer.

I am also keeping Dante in my thoughts and prayers too, for a speedy recovery, and a resilient tenacious spirit to do just that! 

Just wanted to let you know that I have really enjoyed reading these posts (although I haven't quite finished all of them yet) and seeing all the great progress you guys are making.  Congrats!!  So, I wanna crawl too!!  Actually its mostly for my son, but I am going to do it with him. 

Anyway, those of you who take meds, or give them to your kids, did you take them off the meds while trying this?  My son takes Focalin everyday, but wondered if i should take him off while experimenting with the excersises and new vitamins I am going to try on him.  I mean, how can you know if it is working if he still takes the meds, right.  I guess i could tell in the evenings, when his meds wears off.  Maybe I could keep him on them for the first couple of weeks, then try without them.  Just curious as to how you all handle this.

Thanks,

Mary

Anni, I'm on week 3.5 of crawling.  The brain is still under construction, and for some reason I'm not seeing things right in front of my field of vision.  It's weird, I hope the space will fill in soon.  I have to be careful driving, especially turnig corners.

I've been crawling with a book on my shoulders, and re-read the past posts, and will add the ankle weights.  It's becoming much easier and smoother crawling by using 2 motions, instead of 4!  I mean moving the right leg and left arm at the same time, then the left leg and right arm at the same time.

Anni, have you found any modifactions for doing the later exercises on your own?  I know the center doesnt' approve them, but it's better than not doing them at all.  We will just be at it longer.

I am also keeping Dante in my thoughts and prayers too, for a speedy recovery, and a resilient tenacious spirit to do just that! 

[/QUOTE]

calicorose,

Thanks for your kind words for Dante.  He is finally home at his mom's house.  He still has two of his fingers.  He was in good spirits last night when we visited him for the last time in the hospital before he came home.

That's really strange about your field of vision being altered.  I wonder if you should have an eye doctor check your eyes.  It sounds serious.  I hope that it fills in for you soon.  I never had any vision differences when I crawled that I noticed anyway.

I am almost to the second crawling phase (I am so slow at getting these done!!)  I can really tell if I let two or so weeks go by without crawling.  I start to forget things.  Then I go back to doing it, and things improve.  Anyway, I haven't come up with modifications yet.  I think that with some of the future exercises I am going to have to have a helper.  There is one exercise that a person has to pull on your ankle and you respond to the pull.  I can't see changing that one.  It seems like it is pretty important to hear that command and then respond.

I crawl with the book on my head.   It keeps my head in the right position.  I've never tried it on my shoulders.  

I still find it more comfortable to crawl in four motions, although  they are shortened.  What I mean is that the motion of the arm and leg are occurring closer together.  I still find it uncomfortable to do it in two motions.

Go Calico!!!  Have you noticed any improvements from the exercises?

Anyway, those of you who take meds, or give them to your kids, did you take them off the meds while trying this?  My son takes Focalin everyday, but wondered if i should take him off while experimenting with the excersises and new vitamins I am going to try on him.  I mean, how can you know if it is working if he still takes the meds, right.  I guess i could tell in the evenings, when his meds wears off.  Maybe I could keep him on them for the first couple of weeks, then try without them.  Just curious as to how you all handle this.

Thanks,

Mary

[/QUOTE]

Mary, you have a good question.  I think your solution sounds pretty good.  If you are getting results from the crawling, how would you know if you are taking medication the whole time. 

For myself, the medication wasn't working all that well anyway.  I was going to have to increase or take a med vacation.  So I started the exercises and when I noticed the improvements, I didn't go back to meds. 

Maybe since it is summer, you could try a medication vacation like I did and see if the exercises will help while your son is not in school.  Or is he on year round?

Let us know if the crawling helps. 

He is out for the summer, so now is the time for experimenting.  I just ordered my book a couple of days ago, so we haven't gotten started yet.  I look for it to be here within a week or so, hopefully. 

Seems I remember reading that the exercises usually take a few weeks to see results, so I think i will leave him on meds until then.  My husband and I both work full time, so he is stays with the grandparents during the day for summer.  I don't want them pulling their hair out waiting for things to kick in , so think this will be a good way to handle it.  Also, in a few weeks he will be finished with t-ball as well, so this will be good too.  

I should be able to tell though, in the evenings, so if I see vast improvement before the 3 weeks, i will go ahead and take the plunge and take the meds away sooner.  I wouldn't think the results would be hindered because of the meds, do you?

Thanks,

Mary

Mary,

I don't think the results will be hindered at all because of meds.  You could probably leave him on the medication longer if you want.  I know for me the results were apparent after a few weeks, but the book says it could take a few months to see results.  I will bet that as you begin the exercises and as you begin to see results, that you will know when to let off the medication.

There is a section in the book on medication.  There is also a section in the book about modifications at home and at school to help your child to cope with the STNR symptoms before the exercises begin to help.  I think they are great suggestions.

Good luck to you.  I surely hope that these help your son.  Please let us know of your results!!!

susan b, thanks for sharing your story!  As you might have read, my thinking is in the same line as yours.  My son is currently in week 3 of the Dore program.  I had started him crawling, but they told us to stop as they would address the STNR.  I still have my duobts.  Im seriously considering taking a hiatus from Dore to comlete the crawling, THEN go back to Dore.  I just don't see how they can address 6 months of crawling there.  They only did a very simple test for the STNR too, not like one that would be done at the O'dell's place.  I do believe that the Dore program is very valuable, and they did address the fact that some do not do as well as they expect becasue of the immature reflexes, and have to go back and deal with those, for the exact reasons you mentioned. Bottom up!  I wan to not only get the most bang for my buck, but do what's right and best for my son. 

Hmmmm, I"m really thinking about this one.  Thanks so much for posting this! 

Susan, one more question:  When you start back with Dore, will you have to start from the beginning again with the 12-18 months, or will you be able to start from where you left off?   Will they re-evalutate her again to see if there were any changes from the crawling exercises from the baseline of where she left off there?

I'm figuring this is an almost 2 year committment, doing them both, but well worth it if it all really corrects these issues.  I am interested in checking out the Myomancy sight again for more of what you are talking about too. 

Thank you so much for sharing, as I believe there are others like your daughter who could benefit so much more from what Dore offers if the refelxes are corrected first.

Susan, thank you so much for taking the time to share with us.  I have just gotten off of the phone with Dr. O'dell, and she did also say that it would be best to put the Dore on hold until we complete the crawling exercises.  I spent a good amount of time last night on the puter and my reading concurrs, though there was not alot out there.  My son is only about a month into Dore, so I have to call them and see what we can do! 

I have also been doing the crawling, without a coach, and I think it very important to start over where we can both crawl, and coach each other . Dr. O'dell said it woud be hard, but not impossible, or harmfull in any way.  I was worried that what we have to do to coach might somehow "undo" what we are doing by crawling, like going backwards, and the awkwardness of coaching.

I had also asked Dr. O'dell about the ATNR and she said these exercises also correct that!  So, between the two programs we are doing, our two kiddos have a great chance at a bright future, I truly beleive! 

Would you please continue to post with how it's going for you and Natalie?

Calico and Susan,

I hope that you keep posting here and let others know if these exercises help you.  I think so many children and adults can be helped by these exercises.

I have felt a huge responsibility to share the results I have had with others on this board because I have been helped so much.  As an adult, I can see the improvements in my life.  Children will not be so observant to be able to see a difference.  I can.  That is why I feel such a strong desire to help others.  I don't feel that children have a voice a lot of times.  They can't get on a board and tell others what helps them. 

I am so excited that you are helping your children.  Your posts here can help others.  It is a great feeling to know that this reflex can be matured and that those bothered by it can go on to live comfortable, happy lives without the interference from these reflexes. 

Thanks guys, keep up the great posts!

Anni, I have to thank you for your posts, as well as the others' here, who have been an inspiration for how many??? 

I think we are going to be starting from scratch again, but only a month into each program.  Not much time lost in the grand scheme of things, for the overall good.

Another thing, even though this board gets the trolls and crap, there really is a great, supportive community.  I recently added another board where Ive been posting, and introducing the idea of the STNR, and the idea and ME are getting basically harrassed for having an alt issue with every post I make, even though it was posted in the alt section!  The entire experience there is totally frustrating and I will likely just drop it.  Anytime someone comes on with an interest in it, the harrassement continues.  It's very intimidating and trollish in its own way.  I remember reading your earlier posts, Anni, and you had this too, although you had this supportive community beside you.  So ,I really appreciate it here. 

I appreciate it here too.  Initially there were people here who thought that this alternative method was a scam and that I was here to sell a program or something.  I felt the same way when I first read the cover of the book. I think that through the support and experience of all those who are trying it, those fears will be lessened and the real help will happen.  It is exciting to be in the forefront of this therapy.

Susan, I had called our Dore clinic, and they did also give us a hiatus, even though we had just started, our therapist understood where I was coming from as we had talked at length about it when he first started.  No problems, she said it would be waiting for us when we were done. 

My main concern, is, you and I both got six months, or for Nicole, regression, and both of us would have to go through the re-eval if we took longer.  The exercises are outlined for EIGHT months!  Ack!  Are you doing a different outlilne than what is in the book then?  I thought I understood the home program was 8 months and with the center, 6 months, maybe the home program taking longer to maybe compensate for not sticking with it as closely.   I am concerned my son may not be "done" at 6 months, with still 2 to go.  What are your thoughts and insights?

How are they going so far for you and your daughter?  We are doing them properly now, no modificaitons.  They are harder doing them right!  But, I'm finding, just like with the Dore exercises, a nice benefit is bonding time. 

Both 8 months? We will be doing both for a while too.  Good luck with your next visit.  Be sure to let us know how it's going, OK?

Sorry about the lost post, I have had that happen too, urgggh.  Glad you too the time to re-write.  Thank you.

Hey Anni, that was me who posted about the Chiropractic and ADHD.    I get around.

What you had your hubby do for you was a sort of traction.  Like popping your knuckles.  (You NEVER want to self-twist and crack to pop, even though it relieves, it's actually tearing soft tissue and one can become paralyzed by doing this in the neck and back)  I can feel, only doing three days so far, that this is real good for my back too.  My low-back arthritis pain did not bother me at all during the night, or today.  (I've been to physical therapy, and the gym, and etc and crawling has done more in three days than any of that)  And yes, I can feel my upper back posture is going to be much better.  I hold my head more back than forward now too, already. 

Cool stuff, Anni!

Yes, that's part of it.  My son's school counselor talked with me about it, and had gone to a workshop to teach her son these exercises to correct the midline issue.  It can affect sports like hockey and tennis, and she mentioned the basketball player Shaq (sp) who can only shoot from one side of the court  because of his midline issues.  She had my son pick up a pen on the left side of him, to pass over to me on his right.  He did the typical midline-issue thing, picked it up with his left hand, at midpoint changed it to his right hand, then to me, when he could have just as easily gone all the way.  It's uncomfortable to cross over physically.  It also affects the ability to read well, since your eyes are always crossing over midline.  He often reads with a paper under the sentence or tracks with his finger, and has definate comprehension problems. 

The program she went to was not specifically crawling, she did different exercises, but it seems like each program has it's own hilosophy and terms for things, but can accomplish many the same end-result, somehow.   I just find it all very interesting, noninvasive and promising.

joemom,

Have you noticed it helping your son yet?  How long have you been doing the exercises now?

Thanks for the tips Anni!  I approached my kiddo with the PT idea, and to just put aside any wierd feelings.  I work around too many physicians to be balky about much, so I try to rub that off on my kiddo.  We did great today with them, we both got through all the reps.  And we had done what you suggested too, with the harness!  It was much easier for both of us, it's hard to be the coacher too.  And I worried about crawling backwards, since we are both doing the therapy, in some way might undo what we are trying to accomplish by going foward. 

We used a dog leash under each arm and up over the shoulder, the helper held on from the back.  It was very comfortable for both of us that way.  It just felt too awkward doing it the way they mentioned in the book, crawling backwards.  It's mentioned in the book to, only with towels.  We did have to beat off the dogs though, they wanted to go for a walk too!!   

Calico,

I used ice, yes. It helped.  I have felt so much better since I had my back and neck adjusted by the chiropractor.  My tweeked neck is almost gone.  I will start the crawling again on Monday.

So, how are things going with your son and you, Calico?  Are you noticing if the exercises are helping yet?  Perhaps it is still to early to tell.

Hi Anni!  Are you using ice on your neck too?  That is the most simple, BEST thing for pain and the healing process. 

What a bummer about your neck and the exercises!  I know the Bender program needs you to have the head up, or it won't do what it's supposed to.  My son's hair is really long and in his eyes, so he's coming up with very funny ways to keep himself from flicking mid crawl! 

I will also have to put him to work on the bungee cord idea!  That's marvelous!  I wonder if the therabands would work too, you'd have to have a stap deallie or it would hurt where it was attached.  He'll figure it out!   However, we went right back to doing them the hard way, with each of us coaching each other, the way they said in the book.  It is sooo hard, with us both doing them!    But the resistance in the shoulder area makes a HUGE difference.  For me, three weeks with the leash halter thingy seemed like it didn't do much.  I don't know!

Keep up the healing, and do what you got to do! 

Hey, I have something to add to the crawling modifications. 

If you have been reading in the chiropractic thread, you will know that I went to a chiropractor for a neck muscle strain that was really bothering me.  I feel so much better!  It really helped my neck injury. 

The chiropractor gave me an idea for resistance.  He told me to use bungee cords between my arm and leg as I crawl, the ones that don't move at the same time.  I thought it was an interesting way to add resistance.  I would like to try it.  If anybody else needs a way to add resistance without a partner, this might help.

I talked to the chiropractor about the crawling exercises and wondered if I could keep doing them with my neck injury.  He told me to keep my head down or I could keep the area from healing, so it looks like I have to take a little break from the exercises or at least do them with my head down.  I don't think I will count these as having done them correctly though.  It might help to keep me going with them though.

susan b.

I think that it is great you have gotten so far in the exercises.  I think that the next school year will be a big test for you to see if things have changed for your daughter.  I think that the small improvements you have noticed so far can certainly be attributed to crawling.  The improvements take a while and so I don't think you notice them until you start looking back over the longer period of time.

I am still making my bed every day.  My bills are actually organized in my filing cabinet.  They are in alphabetical order!!!  Isn't that amazing?  I find it to be incredible.  These all happened slowly.  But in looking back at how I used to do things, I see an incredible change.  I can see how far I have to go still and think that I am half way really.  It is amazing how many things I struggled with that I just never noticed.

Thank you so much for posting and sharing with us.  I think you are a terrific mother for helping your daughter!

Anni

Thanks for posting Susan!  I was waiting for your post on how the trip went, thank you for posting an update!  I think that is a big change for Natalie if she was able to sit still during the trip!  That is what is supposed to happen, it's just cool when it does.  I wonder if you will be able to complte her exercises in the 6 months, and get back to the Dore, with out having to do another 2 months doing both.  Otherwise, that is what we are looking at here as well, so please keep in touch with her progress if she gets through with it in 6 months! 

Here, we are only into week 3.  We are doing them everyday, because my son has a week long summer camp coming up, and we don't want to loose that time, and are making it up.  We will progress to the next ones at the six weeks, and stay right on track.

But dang, these are hard to do, when we are doing them correctly.  Also, we are having to get out the book from time to time, and check out the CD just to make sure we are doing them right.  I don't know about how Natalie is, but my son wants to get goofy on me while doing them.  HIs sense of humor is wonderful, but not always appropriate!  Sometimes he'll not resist, and I lunge.  And I get kinda mad.....My low back has just been miserable, so on top of the crawling, AND coaching, I'm regularly seeing MY chiropractor to straighten me out. I think my bum and hips are going to be in great shape when we are both done with these?  I don't know how you are doing them with your dysplasia, that must hurt a lot too.  Coaching is harder than crawling, I think.  Going forward with your arms outsretched and not pushing or keeping your balance on your child puts a lot of strain on the low back. I wonder how those two ladies do it all day long?   And Anni, with your neck!  What a strain anyways, then to have an injry too. 

We have not really noticed any changes yet, except that maybe between the Dore and the Bender program, I think my son's starting to think an itty bit more ahead and to plan ahead for things he's got going on.  It blows me away!  And, I can see that he is starting to think a little outside of himself.  He will ask me how my day is as well, and not thinking so self-centered.  Or maybe he's just maturing a little.  Whatever, it's good to see.  He'll be doing them 3 full months when school starts, so that will tell for sure any bigger changes. 

It is all faith, at this point, but I don't care.  We are not going to pop any more pills, and I don't care if others are skeptical about it when I tell them.  I won't stop trying and working, but i do have the faith that with these two programs, he will be good to go, without ever needing meds again.   I hope the same for Natalie too.  We might be on to somethign doing the STNR's first.

 Thanks you two, Anni and Susan for your updates!

susan b,

Natalie at the airport gives me great hope that these exercises will help her too.  I think at the beginning that the changes are subtle and you often do not know whether to attribute them to crawling or something else.  It is easy with a child to say - they are more mature now.  But with me - an adult, there is no "more mature now"  I am already suppose to be mature!   I believe that the exercises are helping.  I think it is wonderful that you could take her to a large place like an airport and have her sit and be comfortable!  I think it is very cool that you are seeing Dr. O'Dell in person.  I would love to meet them both.  I would have loved to meed Miriam Bender also. 

Keep up the great work with your daughter.  I know how much energy and effort it takes.  You are doing great!

calicorose,

I think you are a great parent to put so much effort in your son's behalf.  I believe that the things you are noticing about your son thinking ahead can be attributed to the crawling.  I think ahead so much more now that have been doing the program.  It is interesting that you can notice that in your child.  You must be a very intuitive person.

I think that the coaching part is harder also!  I am trying to figure out other ways to get that resistance.  But the book's method is the way I probably should go without trying to avoid anything.  Maybe you could get another family member to help out when your back is not up to it, calico.

I am so glad that the exercises seem to be helping even a little bit.  It helps you to keep going in my opinion.

Keep posting away!  It is awesome what you are doing for your child.

logan, do you think you might want to try them for yourself?  or someone you know?  I would get the book if you are considering doing them.  It explains things very well. Keep us posted on what you decide to do.

Well, welocome aboard Brett!  I'm sort of wondering what happened to everyone else who started back awhile too!  But, we are committed to sticking with this, as we have to before going back into the Dore program in six months!  Se, we'll be here. 

You sound like such a guy, with your modifications!  It's kind of funny to hear wht everyone comes up with for those of us who don't have a partner.  You might try Anni's suggestion for the crawling portion, of bungees tied to your wrists and your knees to give some resistance.  The optimal place to have the resistance is from the front, like pushing with your shoulders.  PUlling a cooler would be a good idea, and it would probably give the right resistance. Just hope you don't have to get up in a hurry!  But, you don't want the weight coming down, as if you would put weight on your back.  I also tried, for the rockers, tying an exercise band around my hips, and the other end to a table leg that wouldn't go anywhere, and fasten it real low, just a few inches from the floor.  I had to face it, and pull far away from it to get enough resistance.  Here's where another bungee would work, and give more resistance than tubing.  Again, the important part would be to try to mimic the resistance coming from your hip area, not the waist, so you may want to bring the strap down to the lowest part of your hips, with a very wide strap.  The taped commands sound like a wonderful idea too! 

I really wish those ladies would spend some time to devise a way to make appropriate accomodations for doing these on our own.  I have to go to my son's dad's house every other week to do these with my son, so we don't loose time. Eeesh. 

we are not that far ahead of you, so we can consider it in together, Ok?  Let us know how the accomodations are working for you!  You have some great ideas!  Thanks for joining us latecomers.....

Oooooh, knee pads.   Yeah.  They are mentioned in the book.  We have some that are the flat foam variety.  They work great.  If I don't wear them; owie, specially after shaving.  I told my son, the inventor, about your cooler/book resistance, and he though that it was a great idea too.  I remember reading in the book, the resistance is important, but if you were at it for 20 minutes and sweating, you might have been at it too much?  Did you see the DVD?  Think of it not as a workout, but therapy.  No pain/no gain may not apply here. 

I had e-mailed the clinic one time, and never got an answer, but both times I called I got them both times.  They were very nice and helpful.  Kind of motherly like. 

brettlongmore,

Your modifications sound great!  Welcome.  Thanks for the tips on the hair twisting thing.  I know I do it a lot when I am stressed so the anxiety theory is probably right.  Keep us posted on your progress. 

I just took a cooler (just something I could put weight into (books or jugs of water) that would slide on the floor), tow 3 foot rubber bungee straps, and a backpace.  Hooked the bungee straps to the cooler side handle and the other ends to the straps on the backpack. 

Another was was Anni was using weighted ankle weights....I'm not sure what other people have tried besides that.  If you have any questions just send me an IM.

Brettlongmore:

Thank you so much for sharing!  What are you doing for the rocking?  Have you noticed any changes? Have you been consistent?  Also, I would love to know how many pounds of ankle weight Anni is using.  I think this is probably the way I need to go - I just can't imagine lugging around a cooler - but I seem to recall you are a big strong guy so it probably is no big deal to you (which is why you are putting the gallons in the cooler to create more resistance!

Hey Logan and Brett!  I'm so glad to have more company here, being new doing the crawling exercises too!  We have what, four of in this generation? 

Remember, in the book, it is going to take maybe 3 months before you may notice anything "different."  So hang in there.  I remember she said many people loose motivation at that point because they are seeing so many improvements, but they reiterate to keep going, that there will be even more improvements by the end of the program.   

We just completed week three.  It is a lot harder doing them with a coach.  I did about 3 weeks of them modified, but with not much resistance, so we are starting over.  There is a big difference.  I would say, whichever modification works for you, to get as much as you can, as you are trying to replicate a human body pushing against you, and we are grown people, who would tolerate more resistance, whereas a small child would not.   

I am so happy everyone is here!

Calicorose:  What are you doing for resistance for crawling?  How are you doing the rocking???  I can't imagine someone behind me helping me rock (besides my husband)!!!

If anyone else wants to share - go for it! 

Brett - what do your parents think of your modifications and exercises? 

Hang in there Brett!  I have been researching this issue for so many years - I have tried absolutely everything!  I know DORE is the real thing and I know crawling is a piece of this puzzle.  One other thing that has helped me tremendously  - my memory anyway - is http://www.auditorybrainwavetraining.com/

It is a cd I play continuously 24 hours a day 7 days a week.   I have been playing it since October and my memory has never been better - not that it is great - but awesome improvement.  I did neurobiofeedback, over 60 sessions, and was told I needed to keep on going cuz it just wasn't working for me.  This works on the same theory as that but no work on my part - just play the cd.  My girlfriend also got it and she also swears by it.  I make no money off this - Dr. Bate is someone I have known for a long time - great guy. 

I am still not sure how i am going to do the rocking thing.  UGh!  I feel stuck with this one.  I dont have stairs in my house - so that is not an option.  Any ideas anyone?

Logan, my son and I are both crawling, so we coach each other.  He is 13, so he's big enough to be able to help me.  He is with his dad every other week, so I am going over there 3 days on his weeks to do them together.  His dad, I suppose, is supportive in a minimal way, but not interested in the whole deal.   When I did the crawling with modifications, I did the book on the shoulders, but it messed up my neck too much.  I thik Brett's idea is the best I've heard, dragging that cooler, as it would put resistance in the right area, from the front of the shoulders.  For the rocking, my son helps me with those too, he's better with the idea now than at first, but we watched the DVD, and aproach it like therapy.  For the modifications here, for the rockers, I think the best idea I've come across was the idea of strapping something around the lower hips, also like Brett is doing.  I did these for a while, and think they were about the same as having some resist.  You'd have to get a very strong and hard bungee, and to face whatever you tie it to, and stretch it to the max so that it pulls when you go back.  This is what I did, it it worked really well. 

Now, you two, I don't know about doing modifications for the later exercises. I hadn't thought that far yet. The ones where you have to wait for the verbal command and the tug from the coach.  

I have to say, that I am really proud of anyone who believes in this enough to give it a try.  I've mentioned to a few people I know, and some of them just laugh the whole idea off, and would rather just keep taking their pills.  Especially for you, Brett, as most guys just analyze the thing to bunk if they stop to think about it at all.  It's a HUGE "crawl" of faith, and much more difficult than just taking medication.  But, if the changes work for us, we can be better, permanently, with less or no medication.  Waiting for anything for 3 months for results takes bravery, tenacity, and a huge committment.   Hooorahhhh for the crawlers!!!

Logan, your post added while I was writing my last one!  You guys are quick.  Must be a Saturday.  I don't have stairs either, so I fastened the other end of my stretchy thing to a sturdy heavy table leg.  Something that won't move while you stretch the thing out.  Or, perhaps you could devise a way to fasten it to the underneath of a door while it is shut.  It might be best to find some way where it would fasten about 6-9 (or so)  inches off of the ground, not too high or too low, you want the resistance to be at your hip area.  Not to be pulling down if it's fastened too high.

I don't know if you have read my other posts, but we are doing what Susan b is also doing with her daughther, taking a hiatus from Dore to take care of the STNR.  Then we will start up with the Dore program again. 

Another similar reflex is the ATNR, and I didn't remember seeing it mentioned in the book.  It is very closely related to the STNR in the development progress, and can also cause ADHD symptoms.  When I spoke with one of the Bender ladies, she did say that the Bender program matures this reflex also.  Just a little bit more information if you've researched the other reflexes. I was really worried about that one too, and was looking for similar programs that would mature it, so I was relieved to know it would be corrected too.  The Dore program builds on having these reflexes already matured. 

Another reason I really have faith in the Bender program, is probably from my son's evaluation at the Dore Center.  I have not posted this yet, but he came out as "borderline."  Meaning, he almost did not qualify for the program, because he tested not very severely.  That was scary, because they never spent a day in our house, or in the classroom with him!  I know he will benefit from the Dore program, but I was stronly inclined, after his evaluation, to believe that he would benefit even more from the Bender program, because he so perfectly fit the profile for immature STNR.  I kind of scared me, because we paid so much to get him into Dore, and it seems the measure they can help lies in the measure of severity of symptoms.  I'm just gonna make darn sure he gets as much out of both programs as he can.   That is the main reason we took the hiatus so soon into the Dore program. 

Anni - what weight are your ankle weights?  Do you have a coach or are you on your own most of us? 

Thank you all for your great comments and suggestions.  I am on my way to buying knee pads, ankle weights, and bungee cords!

Hey Anni!  I'm happy to know you are on the mend, and can start back up again! 

My son and I are only into week one, but seems like forever!  I've been doing overtime at work, then meeting him at his dad's house every day to do them, and coming home to my two other "babies" who need exercised.  I'm so pooped!  He hurt his knee yesterday, and we could only get through part of them today.  I told him NO INJURIES are allowed for 2 years, then made sure he put some of that fabulous ice on his knee!   Anni, there really is a huge dif doing them with resistance than without! 

As far as me noticing a difference, I had done three weeks worth that now I'm not counting.  The vision thing i think I compensated for and is not bothering me anymore.  Whew.  What I'm really waiting for is for my handwriting to get better, and to loosen the death grip.  It's always been so exhasting to write, and when I do it's horrible! 

Hang in there Brett!  I have been researching this issue for so many years - I have tried absolutely everything!  I know DORE is the real thing and I know crawling is a piece of this puzzle.  One other thing that has helped me tremendously  - my memory anyway - is http://www.auditorybrainwavetraining.com/

It is a cd I play continuously 24 hours a day 7 days a week.   I have been playing it since October and my memory has never been better - not that it is great - but awesome improvement.  I did neurobiofeedback, over 60 sessions, and was told I needed to keep on going cuz it just wasn't working for me.  This works on the same theory as that but no work on my part - just play the cd.  My girlfriend also got it and she also swears by it.  I make no money off this - Dr. Bate is someone I have known for a long time - great guy. 

I am still not sure how i am going to do the rocking thing.  UGh!  I feel stuck with this one.  I dont have stairs in my house - so that is not an option.  Any ideas anyone?

[/QUOTE]

Here is a suggestion that I thought of but I have never tried.  Maybe you could get it to work.  I wondered about having some sort of spring board that is shapped like a right angle and you could lower yourself against as you went back.  As you go back, it would collapse to almost flat and when you rock forward it would go back to the right angle position.  I'm not sure what you would make it out of, but it is an idea I had for those of us who are doing them alone.

I have done the rocking with a college math text book on my head all along.  I still have gotten good results.  The thing about it is that it keeps my head up and provides resistance.  The book says that the resistance doesn't have to be intense, just slight, so I always thought it was ok. 

My memory is still good.  I can finish projects.  I am more rational in my impulsiveness.   I believe the heavy book added resistance as I rocked, eventhough the resistance is from the top downward, it still focuses right on the area of the STNR. 

Today, my daughter wanted to do the exercises and so we helped each other.  We rocked and crawled while we gave each other resistance.  It is a different feeling than the book method, but I kept putting my head down.  With the book method, I have to hold my head up straight or the book falls off.

I am almost ready to start the second set of exercises.  I am not very good at doing them consistently.  But I can say that if I had to stop right now and never do another one, I still would be very grateful because it has helped me in so many ways. 

It is great that you are all helping each other on here. 

Anni - what weight are your ankle weights?  Do you have a coach or are you on your own most of us? 

Thank you all for your great comments and suggestions.  I am on my way to buying knee pads, ankle weights, and bungee cords!

[/QUOTE]

My ankle weights don't have any marks on them to tell me how much they are.  I got them a long time ago as a gift.  But I think they are only a couple of pounds each.

[/QUOTE]

I think if you balanced a small bean bag or something else on your head, you would be able to know if your broke form because it would fall off when you put your head down.  I use a heavy book, like I stated already, for the form and for resistance by myself.

I started back up again today, the skinned knees and sunburn have healed enough to allow it.  My head isn't flat enough for a book and I don't have a bean bag.....but, my reflex must not be too bad because I don't have much problem keeping my head up.  We'll see how things go from here.

I wanted to let you guys all know who are following this post that my hair twisting and chewing habit is back.  I can't figure that one out.  It is disappointing to say the least.  I am not sure why it would go away for a couple of weeks and then some back again.  Maybe as I continue with the exercises it will go away again.  We will have to see.

I haven't crawled in a while because of my back issues. I had one more day at the chiropractor but that got interrupted because my sister's mother-in-law passed away and I attended the funeral and had to cancel my chiropractic appointment.  So, I need to get back to the crawling.

Perhaps the hair twisting is a result of stopping the exercises.  I haven't noticed any other regressions.  I still have good ability to concentrate.  I get a lot done.  I remember things pretty well still.  So I am still very happy with the results of the exercises.  I just wish the hair thing would have lasted. 

Ah, well, we can't have everthing now can we?

Here is something else that I don't think I have posted yet.

My hands have been so dry and scaly since I became a mom and had to wash my hands a lot.  The backs of my hands would get really dry and even begin to crack and bleed.  I would have to put on a lot of lotion.

Well, I noticed something - and I totally attribute this to my ADD and not noticing things. 

Whenever I washed my hands, I never rinsed the back of my hands very well.  I actually noticed that there were bubbles on the back of my hands as I went to dry them off.  Well, I started to rinse the BACK of my hands carefully and I can't believe how nice and soft they are now.

This is sooooo silly!!!  But I told my mom and sister and they just giggled with me over the whole thing.  My mom said she was going to go home and see if my dad rinses his hands the same way, without rinsing the back.  He has really dry skin on the backs of his hands too!

I think crawling has helped me notice so many more things.  It is amazing how many things I just do as I go now.  I find it so refreshing.  And my hands are soft on the backs!!!  It is so nice and  how funny!! I almost didn't post this one because it is kinda embarrassing.  

Well, there you go.  Another chapter in saga of my crawling experience.

Good luck to all of you.  I find myself more and more spending time on other things than hanging out here.  I certainly don't want to desert anyone, so I will check back in time to time, but I am not here as often as I used to be.  I attribute that to crawling also.

Keep on posting, those that it is helping.  I know others would like to know if it is helping you.

Susan, I'm sorry you are having troubles with your hips, it is harder to coach properly than to do the exercises themselves.  Muscles are used here that never are used in any other way!  Have you tried doing them with the coaching modifications?  I am going to check out those knee pads.  My son just likes to wear a pair of larger socks with the toes cut off, he pulls them up to protect his skin on his knees, and we work on the carpet.

It's hard work, and I understand why Natalie can only take it in chunks.  Some days, after day camp, my son is just too tired and will flop on the floor at the end of each run.  Takes us 45 minutes if we can even complete them.  He has a camp coming up out of state, so we try to get in at least 6 days a week to make up for his lost days there, and so far we are right on track.  We are mid week 4.  Susan, if you have the DVD, now might be a good time to get it out and watch throught the testimonials again.  Maybe it will help both of you feel more motivated.

I've noticed some nice things coming from my son, crawling or no, they are nice to see.  Little things.  Our dishwasher broke, and we went to the store to get a sink drain so we could wash them ourselves.  He always has had to take care of his dishes by rinsing them and putting them in the washer, but I was going to see how he did with this transition.  He often has trouble adjsuting to change and doing things differently.  And you can guess how boys are about dishes!  But our fist meal, I didn't say a word.  He walked right up with his dishes, and washed them all by hand, and even washed his glass around the rim.  I was beaming!  He's also starting to express more empathy, understanding towards others, and thinking about others more.  Not so inside himself.  This was a trait that I saw in my ex that worried me.  Almost narsissistic.  I'm having some hope! 

I like this stuff. 

I hope that you all stick with the program to the end.  I would really like to see if it helps your children too. 

I think because I never crawled due to the casts and bar on my shoes that I saw early improvements in myself.  I also might be able to see things that a child cannot see.  I think that the differences will be subtle at first and at the end of the program, they will be much more noticeable.  I know that the book asks you to write down behavior at the beginning of the program and compare it to the end of the program.  I think they do this because the changes occur slowly over time and it is hard to tell if there is a change until you read and compare behaviors from the beginning to the end.

I know how much it has helped me, I hope with all my heart that they are as useful to you and will help you and your children like they helped me. 

Hi guys!  We are almost through with week 6.  We have been doing 6 days a week, to make up for his camp in 2 weeks.  Monday we watch the DVD again, read the book, and start on the second sets.  Mark's excited about doing something different.  Fridays are really hard because he's so exhausted at the end of the day, and i swear it takes him 10 years to flip around to go back the other way for the lap.  Lay down dramtically and roll on the floor, stretch, mess with hair, mess with headband keeping his long hair out of his eyes, play with the dogs, hug the dogs, go potty, get a snack, get a drink, turn on the fans.  I really try to get as much of the distractions out of the way before we start. It's amazing we get through!    Day by day, waiting for something cool to happen at 3 months!  LOL.  We are 1/4 the way through the whole thing.  If we get absolutely NO results, which I doubt will happen, we have had qualitiy time together...1/2 hour each day directly in each others' faces, we have encouraged each other when we though we just could not do another lap and to do more than we thought we could when we were too  tired, frustrated and sore to keep going.  It has already brought us closer together in many wonderful ways.  I'm happy with at least that.    I have noticed strength in my neck, shoulders, and upper back.  changing the light bulbs in the ceiling fan was no problem!  My neck is straighter too, I did just a bit of the chicken neck thing, always trying to bring my neck back, now it just stays back there.

I am so glad we are here, and can share and encourage each other.  Susan, you might check to see if Natalie has developed any muscles in her arms, she might think that's cool.  Anni, I did not know you were getting that much result from doing the therapy only one day a week!  YOu sure are tenacious.  Both Mark and I did crawl some, but not very much.  Late, incorrect crawlers, and on-time walkers.  So you may be right that you are getting such profound results because you never did crawl!  This is all so very interesting.   All of the primitive reflexes are too.

Brett, where/how are YOU??  Anyone else answer the roll-call?? I wanna know too, how the rest of yuz are doing! 

Brettlongmore:  Keep on keeping on.  Do not get discouraged.  One day at a time.  Crawling several times a week is better than not at all.  You have great support and encouragement here.  Best Regards.

Hi Logan, glad you checked in!  That is really great that your son has made such great progress in such a short period of time!  WOW!  I didn't know that by doing them as a coach, that you would benefit from HIS exercises as well!  I do also like the six week checkups, just like with braces, they definitely don't leave you to your own devices.  It's worth every penny.  We are one of them doing the crawling first.  Actually, we did a month of Dore, and they let us take 6 months to do the Bender program.  We are about to start week 6, where we will progress to other exercises.  No earthshattering news to report yet! 

Brett, we were wondering what happened to you, you go get back on the program.  We won't leave you behind. 

Hey guys.  I can't remember if this is the correct forum to post our Dore updates so please forgive me if it is not but I do know that several crawlers here are also signed up with DORE so just redirect me if I am wrong.  My son's 1st followup was last week.  He had a great followup with huge improvements.  The test they do the 1st followup is the posturography and the numbers were huge in terms of improvement.  I was told not to expect alot of improvement for at least 3 to 4 months, but they also said that some people do show tremendous improvement, in fact some only require 9 months on the program.  We were very diligent, and our compliance was great although I am my son's coach, and I not at times it took us a few days before we did the exercises correctly (they change all the time).  I have noticed changes in my son - he can sit down with a book for a longer period of time (even though we make him, he is not choosing to do this and I hope and pray one day that he does), he is less impulsive and overall, I am very pleased.  I hope he is one of those that can graduate in 9 months, but if not, I am willing to go the 18 months or more for PERMANENT change - which is what all of us here are looking for.  I must also say that I have noticed improvements in myself - ever so subtle, but I was told that by coaching, I will get some benefits.  I love the fact that they check him every 6 weeks and that they adjust his exercised to his needs as opposed to just doing a set of exercises for the general population.  When you experience the testing you know there is no way that  2 people are identical in terms of their issues. 

That is it for now - since I can't afford DORE for myself at the moment, I did buy the stopping adhd book but can't get myself motivated yet to do it.  It just looks so hard and complicated!!!!!!

Would love to hear from the outhers regarding feedback and how the crawling is going. It sure has been quiet here lately.  I hope it is because everyone is having such a great summer - school starts in about a month.  Isn't that scarrrrrrry!  It sure does motivate me to get my son better - I don't want to go through another year like last year.

Brett, you might get those e-mails off of there quick, or you will be inundated by a lot of unwanted e-mails.  (not by us, of course, but by cookoos.)  It's kind of a forum no-no. 

Brett, you might get those e-mails off of there quick, or you will be inundated by a lot of unwanted e-mails.  (not by us, of course, but by cookoos.)  It's kind of a forum no-no. 

[/QUOTE]

Thats odd, most boards have IM address links buit into them.  I'm not too worried, thats what spam filters are for.

Who better to talk about leaving the past in the past and starting each day anew.  If God can use a guy that murdered Christians to write most of the New Testament he can surely use and renew us too.

...and yeah, it was Paul in Philippians 3:13 (NLT)

Logan, that is interesting what you say about not crawling much and going right to walking at an early age, and how proud you were!  Aren't we happy when our kid gets there faster than the others?  I have actually read recently, some articles in parenting magazines, that pediatricians are saying now that crawling is not a necessary developmental milestone, because there are countries that do not have the tummy time because of dirt, critters, it is a relatively newer thing for babies to be doing in the last 200 year in our country, etc, and that we just don't need it.  YIKES!  I came across tons of information on the web.

Hi Everyone!

I've spent the better part of this day researching the crawling theory, and to say the least, I'm extremely interested!   I was first introduced to the idea from my daycare provider, who is whole-heartedly behind this, and has recommended the Miriam Bender Achievement Center to many of her parents (we are located just north of Indianapolis). 

She mentioned it because she's noticed that my *almost* two-year-old son is very bright, but has a lot of difficulty sitting still--even for a two-year-old.  I've noticed this too...he absolutely NEVER sits still with me at home for any length of time.  I attributed it to his age, but she asked me how long he crawled "normally," and looking back, it was only about 4 months.

My question is, does anyone know how early you can start helping your child, or should I do nothing until he's 5 (which I believe Dr O'Dell mentions in the book) and can be diagnosed?  Would it be helpful if I just crawled around with him during play time?  I'll probably give the center a call also, but I was just wondering if anyone had any experience.  

My husband has 3 kids from a previous marriage...all three on meds for ADD.  I think this technique could benefit them enormously, but I'm quite certain his ex-wife will not be a willing participant.  So much for that.

logan smith, are you trying to make people who take medication feel bad? 

Not at all.  I think every person needs to decide for themselves what is good for them and their family. 

So if we don't believe that crawling is the cure for ADHD then we aren't believers in Christ??

It sounds too me like you are looking for an argument, and I will not bite your bait. 

Susan, I find her new EEG findings VERY interesting!  I don't know much about them and ADHD.  What did the neurotherapy do for her?  What was the treatment?  Just curious.  About a year ago my son had an EEG done for the absence seizuers, and I've been wondering if  something visibaly "typically ADHD" would show on the wave patterns, but do not know who or how to even ask.   

Either way, it's not surprising there are changes.  Between the Dore and the Bender programs, both are producing somewhat similar results that stroke therapy would provide.  Building new neural pathways. 

Hey, with the Bender program, did Natalie go through any of the "restructuring" thing that Dore says happens with theirs?   I'm having a REAL tough time at work these past couple of weeks, I want to try my son's ADderall sooooo bad!  Im having major daydreams, and having a tough time snapping out of them.  THEN, when I do snap out of it, I immediately cannot even remember the wonderful daydream I just had!  

  You are getting real close to the 12 week, 3 month goal, and you are already seeing some subtle changes.  Just remember, in the developing process, just like in the healing process, its a good thing to see SOME good days, rather than ALL bad days as in the past!  There will be more to come.  Thanks for the update!

Keep up the good work girls and Brett.  It is well worth the results in the end.

Just a quick update on my son - he is on week 9 or 10 of Dore.  He has read more this summer than ever.  He really seems to enjoy it and can stay focused for longer times.  Just so you know, he made great progress on the first followup, even though DORE did warn me not to expect it.  But we did work very hard, so apparently it paid off.  DORE also said that they are having patients finish thier program in record time - not everyone of course - but apparently there aren't too many clients that are compliant during the summer months, which of course delays their progress. 

I will keep you all updated, but again for now, keep up the great work.  God bless!

Susan B: You are correct about the neurobiofeedback therapy.  I did over 60 sessions and saw no results whatsover.  One of the more frustrating times because it is not cheap, and I spent so much time and money.  I dont have any of the learning disabilities that you are referring to, and unfortunately for you they did not screen your child for these before you started.  There are many testimonials from people who have been pleased with their results so I think it is an individual thing.

Hey everyone,

It looks like you have all been working hard and seeing some improvements.  That is great!  I haven't been here for a while.  I find that I am getting more and more done, I spend less and less time here.

I went through a depression I believe a couple of weeks ago.  I find that lots of free time makes me feel that way.  If I am not doing a million things at a time, I feel like I am failing. Anyway, I started listening to my self-hypnosis tape and doing some deep breathing exercises that have really helped me pull out of the depression. 

So, I am crawling again and realizing that at the rate that I do it, I will probably take years to complete the whole program.  But I will keep doing it because it has helped me so much.

Here are the results of crawling for me.

I have made a scrapbook that I had set a goal to make.

My bed is still being made every day.

I don't get everything done in my house every day - I am not a neat freak yet, but I work on things and I feel calm about it. 

I notice when things are messy.

I don't jump into things so fast like I used to do - I would start new business or new aspects of my business left and right.  I actually lost a lot of money this way.  I feel like I have much more control over that aspect of my life.  I am still working on my newest idea, but I am so much more realistic about it. 

I find that I forget things once in a while still - but I remember so many more things.  So life isn't perfect, but it's not perfect for anybody.

I give credit to Miriam Bender who started these exercises for being diligent enough to keep on going with them.  I am grateful to her and to Dr. O'Dell and Dr. Cook.

I am still crawling and am into the week 9.  I know I should be way ahead of all of you, but I don't do them often enough. 

I found it interesting that week 9 was addressed earlier as a difficult week for one of the girls trying the exercises.  I have been struggling like I said with a feeling of depression.  My hypnotherapy really helped me and I feel like it is going so much better.

Well, good luck to all of you.  I do hope that you keep on posting and let us all know of your successes and not so successfull attempts.

Anni

i haven't crawled in months and i'm ashamed! 

but i'll start up again some day

My son also had a week of for church camp.  Susan, I hope Natalie had a great time at her camp!  My son came back with a girlfriend!  OHmygosh I'm so not ready for that.  Good thing she's in another state.   One of the camp photographers noticed the "budding relationship" and noted that my son was  merely "present" when around this girl, while she was looking at him adoringly.  Sounds pretty typical of my guy, not real attentive!  But then I heard she was the one who made the moves.  Makes a difference in the interest level.   My arthritis had a chance to settle down last week!  Ahhhhhh!  We are back at it again, into week 9 right now, and going right along with it.  We were doing 6-7 days a week of it, to make up for the week he was gone, so now we are into a normal schedule of doing the therapy 5 times a week. No improvements showing yet, at leas not consistently.  Will see more when school starts and have something to compare to.   Got the Mowgli style cut to a move presentable spikey thing, without really too much complaint, under parent's authority.  That was a good thing, did it all in stride. School starts here next week, and will have to arrange study buddies, and evaluate each classroom and environment.  Summer's over............

Hi all,

I haven't posted here for quite some time but I just wanted to go back on to tell you all that my now 14-year old daughter Kelly and I have resumed crawling after a long hiatus.

We initially started last November but Kelly was dealing with some other issues that needed to be smoothed out before we could continue. I was at my wit's end last year and sounded pretty desperate when Annie suggested we try the crawling exercises. I have read the book several times and am still absolutely convinced this program will help Kelly.

After hitting puberty, all of Kelly's symptoms became much worse and some new issues came about including OCD, mood disorder and a whole host of other things. I tried the natural route for quite some time but it became evident that we needed more to get moving to a place where we could all live in peace.  We're now at that place (thank God).

We have a wonderful psychiatrist that is based out of the Hallowell Center here in Massachusetts. There were initial concerns that Kelly was bipolar. Besides her worsening symptoms of ADHD, her sensory integration issues were magnified as well.

She did not crawl at all as a baby but rolled to get from one place to another. Just before she was born, there was new "research" made public about not sleeping kids on their stomachs because of SIDS so Kelly was always placed on her back. We didn't use a playpen but she was definitely in a walker and a swing. She never walked, by the way until she was 17 months old. Most of the things noted in Drs. Cook and O'Dell's book fitted her profile.

Last November, we only got in two weeks of crawling and it was just too difficult, dealing with everything else. Living in this house was difficult, to say the least. It has taken a while for the diagnosis and the correct meds to help, but now Kelly is still taking pharma-grade fish oil each day as well as Lexapro, an SSRI that has really helped her even her moods, OCD and anxiety and severe shyness. There are no other siblings at home now so its just the three of us.

She hasn't been able to read books since her symptoms got much worse in seventh grade. Before that, she was an avid pleasure reader. She has been able to handle ritalin/concerta during the latter part of the last school year (eighth grade) but has been off it all summer.  Now that things are stabilized, we've had wonderful conversations about the crawling exercises and a few weeks ago, we were finally able to start again. As we crawl, we sing songs and yell and laugh at silly things just to keep us going. God knows they aren't easy but eight or nine months to change a life forever is well worth the effort. I wear knee pads and we crawl on carpet but my knee still bleeds from time to time. I'm in pretty good shape but am also pushing 55 so this is anything but simple for me.

The wierd thing is, she started to re-read the most recent Harry Potter book a few days ago and has gotten more than half-way through it (about 350 pages out of 600plus).

I ask her to read your posts each day for encouragement and she has been. Please keep them going as it really helps us!

Scribe and Kelly:  Welcome back and thank you for sharing your struggles and accomplishments since last year. We are glad you are back, and that the posts have been encouraging to both of you. We find that too.  It's great to know there are several of us going at it at the same time.

SusanB, I had forgot to mention in my last post earlier, in regards to the other infant reflexes, I freaked at the thought of other reflexes not being matured as well.  On one of the phone calls I made to the Center, I was told that not only the STNR would be corrected through the program, but the ATNR as well, which is also known to affect learning when not developed.  Hope that helps. 

Thanks for all of the uplifting posts. We appreciate the support.

Susan B. I wanted to mention that the Hallowell Center is now going to be offering the Dore Program at their main location. I knew Hallowell was a spokesman for the program as his son went through it but I found it interesting that they were bringing the program in house.

Crawling Posse:  Gather round for update! 

This week has been a really incredible week, but it snuck up on me and I did not realize until last night. 

My daily job requires the use of 12-15 computer applications to complete 20-30 finished *products* per day.  It has always been very frustrating, (to the point of investigating meds) to complete these projects, and all the little details involved, that MANY times during the day, I become mentally exhausted, rather lost during each project, and find myself getting up to get a drink, go potty, just walk around the cubes, get supplies, etc, just to give my mind a break.  Easily distracted.  Earlier this week I had noticed that somehow it was becoming less of a mental strain.  The cincher in my suspicions were several projects I was working on rather late last night, and had incredible clarity of thought.  (For me.)  All day yesterday, I did not ONCE feel “lost” in my production process, I easily went from one application to another without feeling like “now where was I?”  I made fewer mistakes, and my production increased dramatically.  I was able to sit longer during the day without feeling like I had to take a mental stretcher.  This occurred even during my evening projects as well, even though I was tired.  This type of resonse is one I would hope to expect from taking a medication for ADHD.

Now I know what Anni was talking about.  My son and I just completed week 9.  It’s a bit early for progress, but I will take it anyways.   The program is truly doing for me, so far, what it said it would do, I am really very surprised, and I am wondering what the future holds for improvements! 

Keep it up posse, you are all doing great! 

Question to the crawlers:

Does this only work if you did not crawl as a baby? Or is there a chance that it might work for me if I started crawling and walking normally. sorry about skipping 52 pages, but its time for me to stop "tunneling" and get some sleep...

Good night

52 pages is alot.   I haven't even gone back that far!  They say if you crawled PROPERLY for 6-8 months, this reflex should be matured.  Not combat crawling, or scooting, or rolling, or somehow other askewed method we might devise at that age, but proper crawling. 

Antarcitca?? Wow.  Welcome! 

I guess the crawling i not for me then, I was rather well developed and my issue during childhood was more hypo than hyper...it just turned around during high school time when I started freaking out a lilbit. I'll stick with the Omegas and maybe Magnesium for now, there's still time to take the meds if it doesn't work.

I'm not really from Antarctica...I was just gagging to get that nice big welcome hug from you guys.......thank you. I am from Bavaria, Germany's Octoberfest State...but in the settings it didn't let me choose that.

I am so happy to read all the positive posts!!!  Way to go guys!!  I am still crawling away, not consistently but still going!  I need to start with a partner that will do the middle section of exercises with me, and I loaned out both of my books to my son and to a friend, so I hope I remember them well enough to know what to do!!  Looks like I will have to order another book off Amazon!

I am so happy to hear that some of you are feeling what I have been feeling!!  I can't wait really, to get to the end.  It is taking me too long!!  But I will keep on going.  I am doing very well off medication still. 

Keep posting!!! If all our hard work will help us, think how many more ADD sufferers it can help too! 

Question to the crawlers:

Does this only work if you did not crawl as a baby? Or is there a chance that it might work for me if I started crawling and walking normally. sorry about skipping 52 pages, but its time for me to stop "tunneling" and get some sleep...

Good night

[/QUOTE]

I think that if you crawled as a baby, that you might not have crawled long enough to mature the reflex.  The way to tell is to look at the symptoms in the book or go to the web site and see if the symptoms there are what you are experiencing.  If they fit, then you might benefit from the exercises.  It can't hurt to try them. 

Good luck to you.

Thanks for checking in Anni!  Real nice to hear from you. 

[QUOTE=candyhound21410]sorry, but what is a crawler?[/QUOTE]

This is an extremely long post and I know it is hard to start at the beginning and try to follow it, so I will summarize, and so can others who post here.

I read the book called Stopping ADHD by O'Dell and Cook.  The idea in the book is that ADHD is caused in 75% of all cases by a reflex in our bodies that we don't notice, but that makes us uncomfortable.  This reflex is in all people when they are babies.  It is a reflex that urges us to straighten our arms or legs when all four are bent at the same time. The authors say that if we did not crawl enough as babies, that this reflex will stay with us and control us, causing ADHD symptoms.  There are exercises in the book, crawling exercises basically, that will mature this reflex and make you comfortable. 

I did not crawl much as a baby because I was in casts and shoes with a bar inbetween.  When I read the book, I was very interested in it for that reason.

I have done about 8 weeks of the exercises and I keep on doing them slowly.  It probably isn't as effective for me to do them this way.  I should do them more consistenly.  But I have noticed so many differences that I find it amazing.  I am so glad others are finding help too from these exercises. 

We call ourselves that "crawlers" because it is a funny way to try and help your ADHD or ADD, but it really seems to work for me and others here.  It is a permanent solutions, which is a major breakthrough in ADHD in my opinion.

Hope that answers your question. 

First update via my son!!!

Today he shared with me that in science class, after finishing their worksheets, the students could have "free time" meaning chitchat and up and around class.  Some of the students finished before him and were carrying on, yet he was surprisingly able to concentrate and focus on his paperwork despite what he felt were distractions for him in the past.  It really surprised him, and that was like the first thing he shared with me when he got home!   

Calicorose,

That is great news. Keep up the hard work.

We've just completed week four.

Hi Scribe!  Good to hear you are still with us!  How are you guys doing with the exercises? 

They are not really HARD, but they did hurt us for a while.  They don't hurt us anymore, but our arms are getting stronger now, as we are doing the "slapper" ones, because of balancing on one arm and moving at the same time.  Those are in part two. 

It's nice there are a few of us moving right along together. Keep checking in, OK? 

Come join us when you can, then, Jerbear!  You know, Anni does them when she can too.  An irregular schedule at it is better than NO schedule at it, evidently!   Oh, and remember to keep your chin up, literally!  I had noticed my son is doing the therapy, more tired, with his eyes on the target, but his nose to the ground and his forhead all scrunched.  YIKES!  Actually had a fight about it last night.  GAH!  Having the neck in the proper postition, actually all of you in the proper position, is what matures that reflex.  They are so WORTH doing.  I like the results fo far, so do join us when you can JerBear!   

Jeekers, you work more than I do!  (And I work A LOT.) 

Keep up the encouraging posts calicorose and susan b. It is helping us to keep motivated. We are now in week five so I will let you know as we progress and note any changes I see with Kelly. The exercises seem to be getting easier for us now. We're able to do them right through without taking breaks in between. That, in itself is encouraging. She is going to start high school next week and will be playing field hockey so I worry that the new schedule will encroach upon our progress.

Keep posting, it helps us all!

Wade, I'm impressed you read all those pages, I've not done that!  Well, Welcome aboard. I really LOVE all the ideas you fellas come up with for modifications.  You are so handy, and, CONSTRUCTIVE! 

It takes a passion, patience, persistence, and most of all, FAITH to start and keep going.  I"m glad you all are here, and we are here for each other.  All those things have begun to pay off for me and DS.  It is well worth giving it a go. We are just starting into week 11 here.

So Wade, keep us abreast of how it is going for you, and the adaptations you make to make it work for you.  I wonder if we can get all of the modifications and present them to the Bender Center for an updated edition of their book, if they would have it! 

Thanks for letting us know you have joined us, and we are here for you, you can check in anytime, good or bad.  

Wow, Wade, you are so creative in coming up with solutions! Good for you!

I am starting the foot pull of the ninth week and I came up with a more comfortable way for my daughter to help me crawl.  I put my ankle weights on my ankles and tie a string like yarn to them.  My daughter can walk behind me and give the tug and then resistance.  The thing I worry about it that the helper is supposed to keep the crawler's feet flat on the floor.  But I seem to be able to keep them flat myself, so it seems to be working.

I'm glad you are joining us.  It is great to have you here.  Let us know how it goes.

[QUOTE=susan b.] Hi Calico and Other Crawlers-

We are now on week 14 of the Bender exercises.  Another Sunday, another opportunity to observe Natalie sitting in church.  Her behavior in social situations where sitting is required continues to outperform her little sister's behavior.  We went out to lunch after church and she was totally appropriate at the restaurant.  She sat well in church and the restaurant.  She is so much more compliant than she had been.  She is not as dependent on watching t.v., she is not melting down as frequently, she is seeming so much more age appropriate.  She is more interested in reading.  She is helping around the house more without excessive complaining.  She may initially resist, but she will do what you ask her whereas before you had to continually argue with her to get her to do what you wanted her to do. It will be really interesting to see how well she does in the fourth grade, coming up. 

[/QUOTE]

Susan, I love how Natalie is being helped!!  I am excited for her!  One thing that I was really interested in was her improvement in reading.  I have never been a big reader.  I love to read in sporadic moments.  I would read Harry Potter books to my kids when the books came out.  I had to hyperfocus on them and we would usually read them in a couple of days. 

This summer I started reading Harry Potter again, starting with book one.  I can't believe that I have ended my summer having finished book 4 and beginning book 5. I have never before read that much in the summer by my own choice.  I have read lots for school, but never just casually reading for enjoyment.  It was really fun.  I have also noticed that I could keep all the information from the book straight.   Harry Potter books are complicated as they go along and it has always been really hard for me to keep track of everything going on.  I would always as my daughter to tell me the details after we had read them because I could not keep track of them.  But this summer, I actually have enjoyed reading and keeping all the information in my head.  It has been really nice.

First update via my son!!!

Today he shared with me that in science class, after finishing their worksheets, the students could have "free time" meaning chitchat and up and around class.  Some of the students finished before him and were carrying on, yet he was surprisingly able to concentrate and focus on his paperwork despite what he felt were distractions for him in the past.  It really surprised him, and that was like the first thing he shared with me when he got home!   

[/QUOTE]

Calico,

What a wonderful improvement!!! And that he could actually tell the difference in himself is even more wonderful!  It sounds like he really is happy to be able to work in school!! That is awesome! 

Keep up the encouraging posts calicorose and susan b. It is helping us to keep motivated. We are now in week five so I will let you know as we progress and note any changes I see with Kelly. The exercises seem to be getting easier for us now. We're able to do them right through without taking breaks in between. That, in itself is encouraging. She is going to start high school next week and will be playing field hockey so I worry that the new schedule will encroach upon our progress.

Keep posting, it helps us all!

[/QUOTE]

scribe, I am waiting anxiously to see if the crawling has helped Kelly yet.  Keep in touch!! It is good to hear from you.

Wade, I'm shocked at the Dore price now!  OHMYGOSH.......

How/where did you get the Dore exercises?  They are really simple (on paper, huh).  My son and I had fun with them the month he did them.  His balance is actually really good, mine reeks, on both legs!  LOL.  I fell a lot as a kid, and am very clumsy.  I'm thinking about doing the Dores with him when he startes back up, particularly using the balance board.  They use this in stroke and head-injury therapy.  I've not noticed any balance issues improving with the Bender Program, but will keep that on the radar screen.  I think there are many more surpises in store for us, and I enjoy not knowing for sure how the changes will pop into my own life.   DS is also still surprised by his ability to focus in the classroom, and get his work done in class, where he would end up bringing a lot home in the past.   

Anni, you be careful doing backbends and cartwheels, none of us are 9 anymore.   

Wade, you better keep posting those long informative posts.  I have a really tough time understanding exactly HOW this stuff works.  My emphasis, what I can grasp, is on the end result.    The way you explain the cerebellar function in ADHD ties together the reading and research I've read as well, I just cannot begin to try to pass that information on in any way!  Brain/mouth barrier you know....  So please, bring on the information.  People, on the board, and from everywhere around the world can read this and know there are other ways to approach their ADHD symptoms if they wish.

As for the wobble board, physical therapists use them, so you might try doing a search for suppliers.  The Dore wobble board is a bit more stout that actually their previous one the used to sell.  So do try to check them out if you can, as it does make a difference on how easy or hard you find the exercises to do.

How is the crawling exercises going for you?  Are you getting sore anywhere yet?

Oh, and there is a specific Dore thread going here also, here on the alts, a bit further down, and you are welcome to post your Dore stuff there, if you like.  I will be catching up with that thread more when DS starts there back up again in December.

Wade,

There is an occupational therapy supply house called Therapro that sells balance boards. Their things are all used in sensory integration/balance/coordination areas. They are located in Framingham Massachusetts 1-800-257-5376.

They are great to deal with. Good luck and keep going!

Wade, have you checked into the CD?  I'm such a visual person, I needed to see the exercises in moving, living color.  It was 35 or so off of their website.  Highly recommended for the visual types. 

One word of caution for you, if I didn't write it before, and to make sure you understood, if you are wanting to do the Doreish exercises with the Bender Program.  I spoke with BOTH entities, and the were adamant about not doing the two types of therepies at the same time.  Too much brain stimulation, and remember the Bender program deals with the earlier neurological developments, and Dore, the later.  One does not want to try to develop both at the same time.  For us, it is going to take about 18-24 months to complete both therapies for DS.  I'm sure you understood, just wanted to reiterate, also for the sake of others reading. 

I would hope your mom would help you with your exercises, and would have as much fun with you as I do with my son.  She would probably look forward to spending the extra time with you.  During the summer, I drove over to DS's dads' house to do them with him over there.  Pain, but worth it. 

And, when things get tough, remember we are all here to encourage and support each other through this.   

Wade, I was considering doing the exercises twice in one day and then I wouldn't have such trouble if I skipped a day or so.  Maybe that would work for you and you wouldn't have to drive to you mother's every day, but every other day.  You could check in with the Stopping ADHD authors from their 1-800 number and ask them if that would be an ok way to proceed.  I don't know if doubling up one day would only count for one day or if it could count for two.

It might be tiring to do that many in one day, but I think an adult could handle it better than a child. 

Another idea I had for the pulling area of the exercises would be to attach a weight of some sort to your feet as you crawl, like dragging a heavy book attached to your ankles.  The only thing that you wouldn't get is the tug with the cue.  I have a feeling that this is pretty important.  You could get the cue with a tape recording of some sort, but I can't figure out the tug.  But I think that doing the exercises without the cue is probably better than not doing them at all.   Just some thoughts.

Calico, don't worry about my cartwheels.  I don't think I will be trying them.  I do want to try the back bends though when I am all through with the exercises.  But I'll be careful.  It will just be  pretty funny seeing a middle ages mama trying to do a back bend!!

Thanks for your concern.

Sorry the name crawlers unite caught my attention. I was thinking toddler ADDers posting ,  couldn't help but wonder what they would post about.

Okay  well never mind  silly me . . . guess I was wrong.

So you don't actually crawl but do specific exercises??? This helps ADD, means you can post really long post like the ones above. More mental pictures of adults crawling  . . . .in a group

So

Do these exercise help control  things that like pop into your brain on their own kind of by accident? I know exercise is good for every one and am a supporter of stuff that keeps me healthy. Never considered it as a treatment for ADD, certainly never considered crawling around on the floor. I thought people took pills, did therphy, went to meeting like AA and stuff like that.  

Hmm learn some thing new every day. Well  Pardon  the intrusion!  

Owie, it's hard to do these things with a neck out of whack!  I've got an ice-pick going from my neck to my brain, and down my arm.  Been on ice all week, and my wonderful chiropractor.  Took one day off therapy during the week.  But, will carry on. 

DS has said his concentration is still really very good in the classroom.  He is starting to notice more things.  Each day during one of the classes for 1/2 hour they read.  He always had trouble concentrating even with a good book.  This year, he says it's a breeze for him.  He is getting more reading done in school.  It's still easier for him to focus and concentrate in class too.  This is really a big difference from years past as well, in his ability to organize his stuff in his head, as well as in his books/folders/backpack.  Have not had one backpack floatie yet!  It's like he just "got it" and is taking over himself. I'm not having to go over every little thing with him so far, which is a great relief.  I know he is just getting older and maturing too.  What is also helping, is he found a walking buddy, who had to re-do 8th grade.  DS almost had to re-do 7th, so I think knowing someone so well has put him in gear also.  His buddy is in most of his classes, and they are helping each other out, keeping each other on track. DS thinks he has ADHD as well, and understands, this boy is very motivated to get to highschool. It's good for him to be able to help someone out, as it reinforces things as well. 

DS is also becoming VERY compliant and less argumentive around the house.  He's been very pleasant the last few weeks.  I'm enjoying this very much.  Very good things to say about a hormonal, pimply, unibrowed, peach-fuzzed stache, voice-crackling, all-sorts-of-changes-going-on-inside, young man!   He is really becoming more motivated at seeing results from the therapy.  He even said he didn't need the Dore therapy.  I said, Dude, you're still going! 

Wade, I second Anni's idea of the weights and the recorded verbal cues, if you can't get to your mom's place.  BrettLOngmore had an idea of pulling the cooler attached to the legs with bungees.  I think that would work too.  I'm sure there are more ideas out there, you guys are so creative!  For the first crawling exercises, one idea that was tossed out there, Anni was it you, about attaching the bungees between the knees and wrists for the resistance.  I would think that one might work too.  Trying to brainstorm here.....

Anni, maybe when we are done with these, we can start a mid-aged cheerleeding squad??  But then you play football too, so you are more energetic that I am!  I still think of that lady in the CD, who was crying because now she can swim from doing the therapy. Remarkably cool.

I forgot to mention (gee) that my toughts are also starting to come together more.  I can communicate better than I have, and listen and actually understand others, and not get so lost in what they are saying, especially if they don't get to the point right away.  My brain is processing things in a more organized way.  Very subtly, but there.  This is so cool, waiting to see what falls on my plate of change!   

That is so cool, Calico, that you can see the subtle changes too.  I think that when I don't keep up the exercises that I slip in certain places.  Still overall the difference in amazing to me.  But I am so much more in control of my life.  I love it.

The bungee attached to your legs and arms came from my chiropractor.

I noticed the more organized thought processes.  Then when I stop doing them for a week or so, I notice that I am missing things in a conversation.  It is interesting.  I really need to keep them up and be more diligent.

I haven't see the video but I think I would cry too if I can swim better.  I love to swim, but hate that particular stroke that the book talks about - the front free style.

Keep posting away, Calico, you are such a great support to us all!

Owie, it's hard to do these things with a neck out of whack!  I've got an ice-pick going from my neck to my brain, and down my arm.  Been on ice all week, and my wonderful chiropractor.  Took one day off therapy during the week.  But, will carry on. 

DS has said his concentration is still really very good in the classroom.  He is starting to notice more things.  Each day during one of the classes for 1/2 hour they read.  He always had trouble concentrating even with a good book.  This year, he says it's a breeze for him.  He is getting more reading done in school.  It's still easier for him to focus and concentrate in class too.  This is really a big difference from years past as well, in his ability to organize his stuff in his head, as well as in his books/folders/backpack.  Have not had one backpack floatie yet!  It's like he just "got it" and is taking over himself. I'm not having to go over every little thing with him so far, which is a great relief.  I know he is just getting older and maturing too.  What is also helping, is he found a walking buddy, who had to re-do 8th grade.  DS almost had to re-do 7th, so I think knowing someone so well has put him in gear also.  His buddy is in most of his classes, and they are helping each other out, keeping each other on track. DS thinks he has ADHD as well, and understands, this boy is very motivated to get to highschool. It's good for him to be able to help someone out, as it reinforces things as well. 

DS is also becoming VERY compliant and less argumentive around the house.  He's been very pleasant the last few weeks.  I'm enjoying this very much.  Very good things to say about a hormonal, pimply, unibrowed, peach-fuzzed stache, voice-crackling, all-sorts-of-changes-going-on-inside, young man!   He is really becoming more motivated at seeing results from the therapy.  He even said he didn't need the Dore therapy.  I said, Dude, you're still going! 

[/QUOTE]

I sure hope your neck is feeling better, Calico.

I am loving seeing how well your son is doing!!!  It is so exciting to know that it helps kids.  I see them everyday struggle in my classes. If I could only get parents to give it a try.  I am going to send them to this website to read about your great improvements your son and you are having.  I know it will give them hope.

Neck is almost untweeked! 

Here is a journal entry from another forum I posted on yesterday.  Some more amazing aha moments. DS and I seem to be going throught the AaHaah moments together.  He is a bit excited, and not much really excites him!  He's pretty even keel most of the time. He said he is happy with is life, and it shows!  :-)

Wow, the results I am noticing seem to be pouring in now. I went to a class this week for two hours, on an application used for work. I noticed it was really very easy to stay focused on the teacher and what we were doing. I DID NOT DRIFT ONCE! I was able to retain more information after leaving the class, did not feel overwhelmed, and was actually able to understand the presentation without feeling lost in the jumble of words as I usually do. I was able to process the information very easily. And I've been in other classes by the same presenter before.

So, OK, I've got this other class for a hobby this weekend, this would be a real test. Saturday and Sunday, for 7 HOURS each, I stayed focused and did not drift. ONCE! This is truly amazing stuff, because I have drifted everywhere all the time. This is very unusual. It's actually kind of creepy in a way. I'm just not used to it. Maybe I miss my daydreams. I didn't leave either class feeling mentally drained and exhausted from trying to stay on focus. It was so EASY! :-) This is probably the best benefit of being able to focus, is not feeling mentally tired after information consumption. I am feeling very liberated and free from the chains that bind!  (Theme song plays here....)

I haven't been able to attend church in a couple of weeks, so it will be interesting to see how my focus shows a familiar environment.

------------------

Anni, I am very happy for you that you can still do the exercises just when you can, and still get the benefit from them.  It's hard work either way.  Keep posting on the progress you make as you see it, you are not even technically into the 3rd month yet, right?  I think you've got some more amazing things coming up. 

Please, please, please share these threads!  The more options people know they have the better.  That is why I am posting from the beginning of the thought process to the end. 

This is great news Calicorose. It must be so exciting for the two of you. Your progress keeps us going!

We are into our sixth week now so it's a bit early for us to have any results. School starts tomorrow so we'll see how these next few weeks go.

Wade, I second Anni's idea of the weights and the recorded verbal cues, if you can't get to your mom's place.  BrettLOngmore had an idea of pulling the cooler attached to the legs with bungees. 

Scribe, thanks for checking in!  How are the exercises going for you two? 

Wade, good to hear you got your book and are getting started. I remember when we first started, our wrists and my knees and upper shoulders/neck were sore.  mOst of the soreness went away after a few weeks in all areas.  I use the flat foam kneepads, and we work on the carpet.  Had to go to a sporting good's store to get them.

As far as these exercises helping you, the only way to squelch that reflex is by crawling.  So, if you didn't much, or well in your infancy, you've still got it controlling you.  I would think you would still benefit from them, in ways that might surprise you.  Do you at least fit MOST of the profile the describe?

DS and I are both innattentive types.  The old type ADD.  Although, for the reasons explained in the book, both of us have a hard time staying seated or keeping still.  But hardly hyper.  More just uncomfortable.  Many of the things you describe as the way you are, are very similar to DS and I.  In fact, as far as the outside distractions go, these past 2 weeks we have both noticed that we are not as "attentive' to the outside distractions as before, and can keep our thoughts were we want them/need them to be.  I also have a lot of trouble with the sequencing and thought-organizational tasks, as what I have at work.  many steps are becoming easier to do in the proper order and with fewer mistakes.  I can sit longer and more comfortably as well.  It's hard to know what problems you have until they start going away! 

I will check out the article too. I appreciate the information you bring here, Wade!  Thank you for sharing.   

To simply answer that question, I'd have to say we both fall into both distraction and interference.  These past couple weeks have been easier to not get pulled away by distractions, AND to block out the interference.  I understand both are very typical ADHD characteristics.  Week before last, I about had it with a co-worker yacking on the phone in the next cube, which we are not supposed to do because we work in a "quiet" environment.  I would just have to STOP my work and wait till she was done, or go do someting else.  I just was not able to "tune it out."  And, to boot, I've got sensitive hearing.  Past few days, has not really been much of a problem.  (!!!) 

I just double checked with DS, he read these posts and concurred, it is BOTH. 

I do have to admit, I do have some days, and/or moments, where it seems like I've lost the effect. I'm sure that is part of the building process.  I would sure take SOME good parts to NO good parts! 

I do have to admit, I do have some days, and/or moments, where it seems like I've lost the effect. I'm sure that is part of the building process.  I would sure take SOME good parts to NO good parts! 

[/QUOTE]

I feel like this too, calico, and I think it is because I have not completed the program.  If I don't crawl for a long time, I find the organization slipping, and then I will forget one major appointment, but not as many as pre-crawling, that is for sure.  I would say that I go up on the scale and then down slightly, then back up further than before and then down a little.  If I were to look at a chart of how I am progressing, I would see a lot of ups and downs, but when I look at the chart overall, I am climbing all the time.  I hope that makes sense.

[QUOTE=Wade]I have primarily inattentive type ADD.

I was diagnosed with inattentive type ADD also.

I never was described as hyperactive or impulsive. I don't but into people's conversations. I do have a hard time staying seated though for long periods of time, and I do remember being told not to get up to sharpen my pencil so often when I was a kid ( I think in several grades ).

I was never hyperactive either, but I think that I have the impulsive nature in my decision making process.  I did but into conversations.  I interrupted people a lot. I could sit still, but I sat on my legs, and I was very uncomfortable.

My problems seems like it is mainly with these things: Working memory (especially verbal) and sequencing; selective attention, especially in the face of auditory distractions (right here as I sit, for example, I'm typing this up instead of programming because the guy next to me, Adam, does nothing but talk on the phone all day and his keyboard is a really noisy one and he makes a lot of noise in general.  In fact he told me he was AD/HD once).

I can most definitely relate to Anni talking about forgetting to do things constantly. According to Barkley and Adele Diamond and numerous other researches, forgetting and processing information inefficiently are hallmarks of ADD where no hyperactivity/impulsivity were ever present. Anni, do you also make frequent careless mistakes where attention to detail is most important (like algebra or memorization?)

I am ok with algebra and memorization.  That comes easily for me actually.  I'm not sure why.  But the forgetting appointments, that dinner is cooking, that I need to wash clothes for work.  Those things would totally slip my mind.

I guess what I'm driving at is that whereas many traditional ADHD-ers get distracted and leave a task unlikely to return to it, people like me persist at a task but do it slowly, inefficiently, and inaccurately. I very rarely give up and fail to persist. Researchers speculate that this is because of poor "interference control" or "interference inhibition" with respect to their working memory, thus making sequencing arduous and error-prone. I think this is the most accurate description of what I experience --mental interference from outside sources.

I would say that I get distracted and leave the task without realizing it.  I haven't crawled for a week so I had this experience today.  I was driving down the road to a soccer game.  I happen to see a person standing on the side of the road.  He looked like a friend of mine that I dated years ago.  I knew it wasn't him, but the memories of my experiences with this guy came flooding back to me and I started this day dream of something totally different than what actually happened.  I kind of came out of it, and realized I was having a day dream.  I used to not even realize I was having these and would just float from one to another, making up things in my imagination as I went.  But now I can pull myself out and think about my own thinking.  I haven't done the day dream thing for a while, so I was highly motivated to crawl tonight, so I did.
Can any of the other crawlers relate to this? I'd love to know. (FYI, The Adele Diamond piece is good.)
[/QUOTE]

One thing I have realized through all the posting on here and reading other posts is that this STNR affects people differently.  There are slightly different symptoms because people are all different.  And development is so different with each person.  So, I think from what you have said that eventhough your symptoms are not exactly like everyone elses, these exercises could help you too.  I hope they do.

Wade,

I thought of something else.  You said that you were slow and methodical in math and made frequent mistakes.  Well I am ok in those areas I think because they really interest me.  I love learning and so I think I could hyperfocus on those areas.  Also, it was pretty directed.  Any learning that wasn't really directed was difficult for me.  Like coming up with your own lesson, or taking charge of your own learning.  I was totally lost. 

But in keeping an area neat and clean, that is where I struggled.  I could get my room clean when I was young and my mom asked me and my sister to clean our room.  But it would take me all day long to do it!  My sister would be done in an hour and I would be still cleaning out my desk.  (more like moving the papers out of it, looking through them, and restacking them and putting them back in)

Since I have been crawling, cleaning is much easier.  I do it more efficiently.  I actually pick up more things from the counter, or I clean as I go.  What I find interesting is that there is an up and down to this too.  One week I feel like I could clean anything, then things get messy again.  I find that it is definitely tied to how often I crawl and if I allow time to pass and I don't do crawling, things start to get cluttered again. 

From reading all of your posts I am rededicating myself to crawling.  My son helped me tonight and he did his crawling too.  He is a trooper. 

In regards to Wade's question. My daughter Kelly was more the inattentative type--would never interrupt in a class. Actually, was always very quiet in class, well behaved. Was totally opposite on the home front. Always wondered how she was able to control herself for so long every day and then come home and be completely whacko. Homework was always a terrible chore. Distractable, daydreams, very tough time with math. Pretty good in other areas but always difficulty with memorization in general.

Since she hit puberty, she seems more active, more sensory problems and a bigger slob than ever. Every room she goes through is like a cyclone hit it--things left everywhere, drawers totally a mess and left open. The bathroom is messy and gross. Her handwriting was always poor and coordination as well.

She has been seeing an Occupational Therapist again in order to get the sensory track back in line. She had terrible head pain just from brushing her hair.

Today was the first day of high school. We're only into 6 weeks of crawling but last night she packed her backpack, actually found and recharged her phone, made her own lunch (and cleaned up the resulting mess) and I didn't have to ask her to do one thing.

She has Algebra 1 this term and I think this will be a good test to see if the crawling is helping. Somehow, I think things are beginning to have some effect. I will let you know.

Wade, she never crawled at all as a baby and didn't walk until 17 months. Hope this helps. Will update any change that I see.

Just wanted to update you on my son's progress. For those who may not remember my son is in the DORE program.  We are approaching our 3rd appointment next week. 

My son has had an awesome summer. Ususally there are issues with friends etc, and so far, NONE.  There are a few kids in school that my son does not get along with and everyday there would be some sort of meltdown as to how they were mean to him or bullying him.  Well, there are still mean to him and now he is calm and cool and they are NO big deal to him.  This is such a big deal to us.  He is reading on his own before he goes to sleep.  His eye tracking has improved tremendously (I can tell b/c I help him with his exercises) and over all, we are just so impressed with the progress he has made.  We have at least 8 more appointments to go (intervals of 6 weeks) so I am excited about his progress.

Wade - just a note - there are thousands of exercises that DORE has and they individualize these for what the client needs based on their test results.  I dont want to discourage you from trying the exercises on your own, but do want to warn you that you may  not see great results b/c these exercises are individualized based on the testing that they do at each appointment and the exercises build on each other.  BTW - I heard they just introduced financing which makes it even more affordable - $100 a month I think. 

Just wanted to let everyone know I'm not dead!  I have not been able to start back with the exercises untill this week.  So I am officialy back on the boat in week 2.  

Wade, everything you said describes me exactly.

I was never hyperactive either, but I think that I have the impulsive nature in my decision making process.  [/QUOTE]

This part is different for me I guess. Strange thing is that I have always been very indecisive. It takes me forever to make up my mind about decisions. I even look confused sometimes "in the moment" seemingly due to me not being able to decide. I did this twice today driving. I was trying to make up my mind which lane I "ought" to be in. I missed my chance to change lanes both times.

[QUOTE=annidagostini]
I would say that I get distracted and leave the task without realizing it.  I haven't crawled for a week so I had this experience today.  I was driving down the road to a soccer game.  I happen to see a person standing on the side of the road.  He looked like a friend of mine that I dated years ago.  I knew it wasn't him, but the memories of my experiences with this guy came flooding back to me and I started this day dream of something totally different than what actually happened.  I kind of came out of it, and realized I was having a day dream.  I used to not even realize I was having these and would just float from one to another, making up things in my imagination as I went. 

[/QUOTE]

Now THIS I can relate to. I am a cronic daydreamer. I used to do terrible on long tests due to this. It really became a problem for me in the 6th grade. I flunked a final one time which brought my grade down to a C- in the class. You should have seen the look on my mom's face when I showed her my report card in the car. I still get a little sad when I remember how I dissappointed her. All of this happened because I couldn't control my daydreaming during tests. It's not that I would get things wrong. I just didn't get done.

Wade,

I thought of something else.  You said that you were slow and methodical in math and made frequent mistakes. 

[/QUOTE]

Well, when I am slow and methodical I DON'T make mistakes. I just can't speed up on things. I have a hard time with productivity. Give me enough time and I do things really well, including math.

[QUOTE=annidagostini]

Well I am ok in those areas I think because they really interest me.  I love learning and so I think I could hyperfocus on those areas. 

[/QUOTE]

I think we are a lot alike here. I love learning too and I hyperfocus on the things I'm interested in. Here's the part that I feel makes me a little different from other people I know who are Hyper/Impulsive: When I hyperfocus, I still feel (I'm going to invent a new phrase here) "Mentally Clumsy." Or at least I feel this way most of the time.

[QUOTE=annidagostini]

Also, it was pretty directed.  Any learning that wasn't really directed was difficult for me.  Like coming up with your own lesson, or taking charge of your own learning.  I was totally lost. 

[/QUOTE]

For some reason it is the opposite for me here. My learning is always self directed. I almost never allow it to be directed by someone else. I think that's because I never learned how. I couldn't pay attention long enough to take any hints or direction at all. Once in 6th grade math, my teacher demonstrated several examples of how to work a particular type of word problem. I didn't pay attention to her. So, I figured out my own way to solve it. And I was right. When she called on me to work one on the board I got the right answer. However, she said that it must be just a coincidence since that wasn't the "right" way to do it. Well, I explained it to her and the class with a good deal of confidence. She (and everyone else) were totally confused! That made me realize that I was smart. But, it's been that way ever since. No matter how hard the subject, I always teach it to myself. Unfortunately, this is easier for me than listening and following instructions. That's too bad because it would be a whole easier if I did it by following instructions.

[QUOTE=annidagostini]

But in keeping an area neat and clean, that is where I struggled.  I could get my room clean when I was young and my mom asked me and my sister to clean our room.  But it would take me all day long to do it!  My sister would be done in an hour and I would be still cleaning out my desk.  (more like moving the papers out of it, looking through them, and restacking them and putting them back in)

[/QUOTE]

Me too!!

[QUOTE=annidagostini]

From reading all of your posts I am rededicating myself to crawling.  My son helped me tonight and he did his crawling too.  He is a trooper. 

[/QUOTE]

I don't know if this was directed at me, but I just wanted you to know that your posts are what inspired me to start! I look forward to doing it every morning. I wish I could do it again tonight but I know I just have to have patience and do it once a day.

In regards to Wade's question. My daughter Kelly was more the inattentative type--would never interrupt in a class. Actually, was always very quiet in class, well behaved. Was totally opposite on the home front. Always wondered how she was able to control herself for so long every day and then come home and be completely whacko. Homework was always a terrible chore. Distractable, daydreams, very tough time with math. Pretty good in other areas but always difficulty with memorization in general.

[/QUOTE]

Yeah, this sounds like me. I would have a tough time in algebra mainly because this subject seemed to illicit the most amount of daydreaming on my part. I think that, for some of us anyway, the things that require the most sequencing (the things that are most taxing to our working memory) are the things that are going to illicit daydreams the most. In the absence of sufficient working memory to keep us making smooth progress on a task, daydreaming emerges. At least this is what happens to me I think. According to Adele Diamond, verbal processing is very taxing. Apparently, verbal processing is a "resource hog" on our working memory. And difficiencies with it will show up big on tasks like math.

I also think this is a possibility: Since most working memory being used in school is mostly verbal in nature, a faulty cerebellum (or developmentally delayed) may be the culprit. I am going to make a separate post on this. Hopefully it will make interesting reading for someone. :)

[QUOTE=scribe]

Wade, she never crawled at all as a baby and didn't walk until 17 months. Hope this helps. Will update any change that I see.

[/QUOTE]

Please do! I can't wait to hear more from you, scribe. Thx!

I find it very interesting how many of us doing this are of the innattentive type!  We are all peas in a pod....

Brett, glad you checked in, I was hoping we didn't lose you! 

I am so thankful for each and every one of us here.  I really look forward to coming here and reading how things are going for everyone.  It is somehow really important to me to have and to give encouragement here, as this is so hard, and the results are so far off when just starting.  I just get strength knowing I'm not alone and that we are together.  Acting on faith is a big scary investment.  I cannot thank Anni enough for braving it out on here to post her journey, and inspire us to join her in her quest to re-wire the hard-wired brain.  It's amazing that re-wiring can actully be done, but we ARE!  It is so cool. 

Just wanted to let everyone know I'm not dead!  I have not been able to start back with the exercises untill this week.  So I am officialy back on the boat in week 2.  

Wade, everything you said describes me exactly.

[/QUOTE]

Great. I'm looking for cohorts! I hope these exercises work for you. If it does, please report it to us. This would be really encouraging!!

OK, in reading "Stopping ADHD" I ran across something that is way more interesting to me than the mere issue of an immature STNR. In fact, it makes me wonder if the authors may be overemphasizing the STNR just a tad bit, at the expense of these other items:

"According to many authorities, crawling is essential to:

1) organize sub-cortical, non-thinking areas of the central nervous system

2) form the foundation upon which all future learning and development is constructed.

3) Prevent random, confused, and disorganized learning.

4) Develop neurological organization.

5) Facilitate visual tracking.

6) coordinate the development of both sides of the brain.

7) Develop sensory and  motor systems and general motor skills.

8) Develop shoulders, wrists, and small muscles of the hands.

9) Begin bilateral coordination.

10) Mature STNR"

OK, for those of us who barely crawled but a couple of weeks, it seems that we may be missing out on a lot of primative development besides just STNR maturation. They have a discussion regarding the issue of bilateral awareness, how children who don't crawl may take longer to "remember" which is their left or right side. It's less "automatic" for them. This idea of automaticity is very pervasive I think to cerebellum stimulation programs. Think of all kinds of "primatives" that exist in us to form the basis of logic --reversal (or negation), identification, order etc, that are probably handled "automatically" by the sub-cortical regions of the brain because of how closely they are tied to movement. Now, if just a few of these were not as "automatic" for some of us, there would be all kinds of compromises --mental clumsiness-- in our thought processes.

If they are overemphasizing the STNR it is because they are trying really hard to explain "hyperactivity", it seems to me.

The exciting thing is that if crawling as a 31 year old (or older) is able to mature the STNR, then it is likely that crawling can make other developments that were meant to occur with this milestone as well! There are a lot of reasons for us to crawl!

I've never studied the eye tracking that you are posting about.  I can say that my mind would wander while reading and I would have to re read the whole page.  I know that details of what I read would elude me.  I remember in 4th or 5th grade, having the SRA program - this will date me I know!!  You had to read a story on a card and answer the questions and reach a certain level before moving on.  I remember being one of the fastest readers, testing at a 7th grade level or something.  But I could never keep up with the other fast readers on these SRA cards.  I always understood the main idea of the story, but the little details that they would ask you in the test always made me score low.  I couldn't remember the details. 

As far as other eye issues:  I realized after crawling for a while that I don't look people in the eye when I am distracted with other things.  I didn't realize this until recently.  I told my kids, "I don't look you in the eye very much, do I."  They agreed.  I felt bad actually and have been trying to make a conscience effort to look them in the eyes when they talk to me. 

I'm not sure if that is what you mean by eye tracking. 

I appreciate all your kind words.  It is hard to put into words how much seeing all of you posting on here and joining me and having success feels to me.  It is a blessing.  That is the best word I can think of.

Go Crawlers!!!!!

As far as other eye issues:  I realized after crawling for a while that I don't look people in the eye when I am distracted with other things.

[/QUOTE]

Hopefully you mean here that before you were crawling you weren't making good eye contact. You just didn't realize it 'till after it was improving through crawling! :)

[QUOTE=annidagostini]

I didn't realize this until recently.  I told my kids, "I don't look you in the eye very much, do I."  They agreed.  I felt bad actually and have been trying to make a conscience effort to look them in the eyes when they talk to me. 

[/QUOTE]

I have this exact same problem. It makes it really hard to get dates because when you don't make eye contact girls think you don't have confidence. haha I know this is what I do all the time but I don't realize it until it's too late. I don't know for sure how much this relates to the issue of eye-tracking per se (it probably does) but I always felt that I did this because of how difficult it is for me to pay attention to people to begin with. I'm not paying attention consistently so I "look away" briefly. When you do this strangers are reluctant to get to know you. I really feel that people think I'm dissinterested in them when I do this.

annidagostini said that when she doesn't crawl for a while she might be regressing a little. And, I recall somewhere else calicorose saying that the people at Dore said not to take omega fatty acids because they coat the neural pathways protecting them from getting broken down. For all of us doing any cerebellar-stimulation exercises, maybe we should start using Omegas as soon as we are "done" to protect those new pathways.

Just a thought.

Wade,

That is an excellent thought and one worth asking Drs. Cook and O'Dell. I will email them tomorrow.

We're into our seventh week and still plugging along, not expecting much at this point. I must order the DVD for motivation and to ensure we're doing all correctly. My Kelly still argues tooth and nail but seems to think that things are improving for her on a small scale.

Candy, I didn't know you had joined, or at least tried to join us!  It did hurt us a lot at first.  Our necks mostly, our wrists, our knees.  I would rub DS's shoulders sometimes.  We started the 3rd sets, and we are all sore again.  We think, it's no wonder we skipped this step as babies!  It's just SO HARD! 

Did you get the book and fit the profile?  If so, I want to encourage you to keep at it, because it does work!  Maybe you can start of slowly, fewer laps for fewer days to get your neck muscles in shape. 

Wade, yes that was me about the omegas.  Dore had us sign off DS on using omegas because they actually inhibit the growth of the new pathways.  I think the omegas help once the pathways are there, for the signals to pass back and forth, in layman's terms.  I do miss taking them!  Will definitely go back on them when done here! 

Calicorose,

Do I understand this right, that if we start doing the crawling exercises in the book Stopping ADHD, that we should not be taking omegas?  Just want to make sure we do it right when we start!

Thanks

Southernbelle, before we started, I actually made a call to the Bender Center and spoke with one of the ladies about taking omegas.  Unfortunately, she did not know.  We did go ahead and stop taking them, under the same premise as for the Dore program, that we are building, re-building nerual pathways and don't want to inhibit anything.  I'd rather be safe than sorry.  And, then I know any improvements or results are strictly from the therapy, rather than from the omegas.

Let us know if/when you join us!  We're happy to have you here.   

Susan,

That is great about Natalie.   

I would say that the act of writing an unprompted letter, one full page, in cursive, single space  and looking up words in a dictionary is huge!  I teach 4th grade, and we, as a 4th grade team, assign one page of written story as an assessment at the first of the year.  The kids that have ADHD struggle with this assignment.  They take forever!  They write half the page and want to quit.

So, that is awesome that Natalie did this on her own.

Keep posting! 

susanb,

That is a positive post and I'm going to make my daughter read it tonight when she gets home from a party. It sure helps keep us motivated.

We're in a seventh week. I know its too early to tell anything with us yet but she did start high school last week and has come home and completed her homework everyday after about one-half hour of jumping on the trampoline. I've always had to tell her about 10 times to start in the past but I never even said a word.

Last night, she went upstars and studied for two hours because she has two tests next week. In the past, she would never study adead of time because she said she could never remember what she studied by the time the test rolled around.

Her high school is on a block-schedule program which means four classes at 90 minutes each. How's that for a test? She said that her classes haven't been a problem for her to stay focused at all, even with that length of time. I'm just thinking this is too early to be seeing these kinds of things going on. Maybe I'm dreaming!

scribe,

I don't think it is too early at all.  I noticed improvements after several weeks.  I think that it is easy to say with kids that perhaps they are maturing now, they are in a new grade, they are a year older.  But with me, I could see improvements and I am just growing older, not growing up anymore.  So, your daughter's improvements are awesome!  I think that these are the first of the subtle changes that the exercises bring.  She is able to stay focused, she is doing homework, you don't have to remind her. 

I know it feels like a huge burden was lifted off me when the exercises started to work.  Things came so much easier. 

I crawled today and I am in the second set of exercises.  I have some modifications that I am trying because my husband is unable to help me and my daughter complains that it is too uncomfortable to help me.  My youngest, my son, does them with no complaint. When my daughter is helping me I put on some ankle weights and attach a string to them.  She follows behind, standing, with the tug and command to crawl with that particular leg.  She gives me good resistance with the string.  I still use the book on my head also.  I find that the only difference is that I have to be the one to make sure my feet stay flat on the floor.

After crawling today, I finished a project that I have been wanting to do forever!!  I moved furniture from my unfinished basement family room into a room that I am going to use as an art room/office.  My two older sons helped me move the big stuff.  It feels great to get it all accomplished!! I have been wanting to do it forever.  I organized it and I have all sorts of plans for it. 

Well, thanks for all your wonderful posts.  I love it that these exercises are helping so many out there now!! Yippee!!

Calico,

By the way, I love the little poem in your signature..

Calico,

By the way, I love the little poem in your signature..

Thanks Anni, and CHJones, Oooops, thanks for catching that.  My bad, changed now! 

Loreenna McKennitt sang this poem in a song. It is very beautiful.  Matches my fairy avatar better than the cracked thing.

Feel free to take the "cracked" one.  Your the first taker.

I am just competing for the Doof of the Day.  Again.  You caught me, again.  I'm gonna go "crawl" into a hole now.  With my title and crown.

I must keep my title.  I will gracefully surrender my old signature to ya, but I will fight to the death for DotD crown and title. 

The Icarus Project is ... a non-profit community based website, support network, and underground media project created by and for people struggling with bipolar disorder and other dangerous gifts that are commonly labeled as mental illnesses. We believe that when we learn to take care of ourselves, the intertwined threads of madness and creativity can be tools of inspiration and hope in a repressed and damaged world. Our goal is to help people like ourselves feel less alienated, and to allow us—both as individuals and as a community—to tap into the true potential that lies between brilliance and madness.

- now that's more like it!!!!!!!!! 

Well, you know CHJones, you ARE in good company here, mostly, we are unmedicated!  I like parts of my self-diagnsed ADHD, it's one of the few sources of humor I have.  I have to have something about myself to laugh at.  Oh, and the OCD stuff too.  Wayyyy funny stuff there.  Yay, I just caught a skeeter.  I'll have to check out the forum.  Thanks for sharing, and for caring! 

Pst....add some color & pazzaz to that signature. 

chjones,

I'm glad you found that site.  I might check it out too.  I always thought that the people on this site are looking more for answers than for acceptance only.  You are brave and bold, keep on posting here too please!!

Anni,

Thanks for the encouragement about my Kelly's subtle improvements. I can't believe how creative you are with the modifications you make to get through this program!

Also can't believe you got through the big project that you had put off for so long.

I've also always wanted to ask if you're still selling your art on ebay. If so, what medium? I've bought from there before, that's why I was curious.

Scribe, I didn't mean to ingore your post, but wanted to get home from work giving it some thought.  NO, I don't either think it is too early to start seeing some results from the exercises. It's nice to hear what everyone is seeing at a particular time in the program.  The focus and attention is a big thing for DS and me too, I sat all day in two classes and not once drifted off, so I think I can say I know what your DD is noticing.  It's very exciting, and that things that used to (unbenownst) be so exhausting, like paying attention and taking care of life maintenance things, are becoming much easier.  Like Anni said, and how we feel as well, a relief! 

I hope you DD is starting to feel more confident and happier as well, as some of the struggles start to peel away. 

Pst....add some color & pazzaz to that signature. 

calicorose,

Don't worry, I would never feel ignored if someone doesn't respond right away (or even at all). We are all leading very busy and somewhat difficult lives!

I'm not sure my daughter will admit the exercises are helping her since she really hates doing them so much. When she does offer an improvement she has noticed, there is no correlation between the the program and the "spark".

I'll bet she would like to chat about some things with a fellow teenager that experiences some similar difficulties.  She is very shy (with boys) in person but can certainly chat up a storm online!

chjones,

I'm glad you found that site.  I might check it out too.  I always thought that the people on this site are looking more for answers than for acceptance only.  You are brave and bold, keep on posting here too please!!

Anni,

Thanks for the encouragement about my Kelly's subtle improvements. I can't believe how creative you are with the modifications you make to get through this program!

Also can't believe you got through the big project that you had put off for so long.

I've also always wanted to ask if you're still selling your art on ebay. If so, what medium? I've bought from there before, that's why I was curious.

[/QUOTE]

I do sell sometimes but right now, with school starting (I teach 4th grade and it is so busy right now that I don't have time) I paint watercolors.  Thanks for asking!

Oh, update.  We are in week 14, last week starting the new sets, which include crawling backwards.  I wonder if this is another step where the brain readjusts, because I'm going into brain fog again!  DS seems to be a bit off kilter as well.  He is being a total goofball.  Maybe it's just a phase, I don't know.  The new exercises are difficult in their own, and coaching again is a bit difficult and tiring, so we are each getting a double-dose so to speak. 

On a positive note, I am noticing a bit of very short-term memory improvement at work, where this is required.  I don't catch myself 2 mintues later saying to myself, "now where was I," or remembering names, numbers, etc for log entries.  All very subtle, but very definite. 

[QUOTE=newstepmom]I am confused. In what way do these exercises help with children with ADHD besides the physical activity?[/QUOTE]

newstepmom,

I found the book Stopping ADHD by O'Dell and I posted questions on this site about it.  When I did not get many responses, I decided just to go ahead and give it a try.  I never crawled when I was a baby because I had casts and shoes with a bar on my legs during the crawling months due to semi clubbed feet.  This being so, I was intrigued with the book's claim.  Everyone's experience is different.  The book says that if you did not crawl for 6 months in the proper way, that the STNR (Symetrical Tonic Neck Reflex) can still affect you, causing ADHD symptoms.

I have found that the exercises have helped me very much.  I am still in the middle of doing the excercises and it has taken me longer than some on here.  But the improvements I have seen in my ADD symptoms are so good that I am still doing the exercises. 

I started this post for anyone who wanted to join me in this great experiment.  It is so great to see these exercises helping others.

These exercises bring permanent improvement.  It is so encouraging. 

It would be great if you wanted to join us.

Well,

Here is my update.  Even though I feel like I am slowly crawling, I am still in a position to feel like I am accomplishing so much!   I am still remembering much more than I used to.  I do have times when I will forget things.  Like an appointment today, for example.  I remembered that someone was coming to visit us from my church at 8:00.  I told my husband and my kids about three times throughout the day, then I forgot about it toward the end of the day.  The way it used to be for me was that I would not even remember at all until they came.  I was always surprised when people would show up at the door who were visiting, because I had forgotten I had set a time up for them to come over!!  Now, I remember, but I am not perfect at it.

I suppose that I can't expect perfection in the memory department.  I think I have resolved that I am happy with how things are now.  I know that when I am finished with the program, it will be even better.  But if I have forever how things are now for me, I would be very content. 

I have a new class full of 4th graders and I can see how much this reflex bothers many of them.  I have one new student to my class who was not in our school last year.  He gets emotional, trying to adjust to everything.  He has a hard time staying in his seat.  During art and math I suggested that he stand at the counter at the back of the room because he was standing at his desk to work, bending over his work.  He gladly tried it and now chooses to stand there.  He was able to focus enough to finish a very nice drawing, all colored in, in all sections of the paper (a difficult task for most ADDers).  It amazes me how much this program could help people and how very few know about it.

Wanted to check back in.  I've been struggling with being consistent but have been more consistent than I normally am with things.  I’m only on week 4 and it is hard to stay motivated sometimes.  I just read the thing about the fatty acids….so I’m going to stop taking them.  I have been fighting with some mild depression and its been keeping me from being more motivated, and due to that I haven’t been working out which is a vicious cycle.  But, on a positive note, school has been going good so far this semester, probably better than it has in a couple of years.  Its too hard to say for certain if it is the exercises because of other changes (medication and living situation), but I want to believe that its these exercises because it gives hope for a permanent solution.  

It's great to see everyone's updates, and I'm glad Brett, you are still with us! 

We've had a couple of discouraging weeks; busy, health issues (me), school and afternoon-life still not going perfectly .  But we carry on every week and are still right on track. 

Thanks for the nudge, Anni! 

We just finished week 17!  7 weeks to go.

I gave my chiropractor a copy of "Stopping ADHD," and asked his opinion on it.  His take on it, was that the exercises strengthen the cervicals; the neck area, in turn keeping everything in line.  When the spine is in good form and strong, the blood and nerve flow to the areas that feed from the spine there  are at the optimal.  That's why adustments can help with depression and other mental issues some.  The brain needs needs open flow of blood and nerve flow from the neck and upper cervical area for the best function.  So, this made sense to me too.  And, he also said, as he had before and what is well-known in the therapeutic community with working with the brain, that crawling motions basicall help the two sides of the brain communicate with each other. 

I haven't been very active here, as life has been a little crazy otherwise here at home, but hopefully things are on the upswing again.

HOpe everyone else is crawling along and doing well otherwise. 

Thanks Calico,

I haven't been to my chiropractor for a while.  But he also thought that the exercises would be good for ADHD.

I wanted to post about my improvements eventhough I haven't been keeping up on the crawling, (which I need to keep on doing!!!) but my improvements seem to last and have lasted through this whole time. 

Here is something that I have noticed that is very constant with me now.  When I do laundry . . .

before crawling:     I would always have to check and recheck that I put detergent and drier sheets in with the clothes.  I always had to recheck that I unplugged the iron there also everytime I left the room.  I could never remember from one minute to the next if I had actually done those mundane things that I have to do.  Prior to crawling I would put a dryer sheet in the dryer - you know, the kind that keep static cling out of your clothes - then I would put the clothes in and not remember if I had put in the sheet.  I would have to search through all the clothes to check, or I would just put in another sheet, never checking to see if I had already put one in.  I just couldn't remember if I had put one in or not.

after crawling for a third of the program:        &nbs p;I remember!  I don't have to check anymore.  I remember if I put the dryer sheet in.  I remember if I put in the detergent.  As I am walking up the stairs, I remember if I have unplugged the iron or not.

These things are major for me.  They might seem simple, but I love it that I can remember things that have just happened and that I don't have to check and recheck.  I am more confident - even in the laundry!!!

Thanks for all your posts.  You guys are great!!!

It's the little thangs, ain't it, Anni! 

I've noticed the same sort of things, the short-term memory is better, there is more purpose to my actions during the day, as well.  Even my typlexia is going away a little.  I want to try to pick up the guitar, and maybe the piano again, and see if there is any difference there too!  Those two things are definate communication of L and R brain. 

Keep up the work Anni!  Imagine the things you will notice when you are through wtih the program!  I LOVE reading your posts!  Thanks again for sharing. 

It is great to read about the improvements in these kids!!

I teach 4th grade.  This year I am working with a class of children many of whom have symptoms of the STNR.  I have given the ones that struggle the option of doing their work on the counter in the back of the room.  It is amazing to me how they love to use the counter.  They concetrate better and they actually will request to work back there.  It is not treated like a punishment at all.  I explain to them that some people are more comfortable standing to do their work.  They choose to do it.  It helps me get the class working and keep the disruptions down.

Just thought this would add to the post here.  I wish I could do the exercises with all of the kids in my class.  I will have the book out and will mention it to any interested parents on partent teacher conference night, with my school's permission of course.

yes, welcome, kerbelm!

Keep us posted!

1. How old is your child?
2. Is your child on any prescribed meds or supplements?
   

[QUOTE=ham2006]My kids were late walkers, so I'm guessing that they DID have a good amount of crawling time.  I simply can't remember, and don't know about myself.  I didn't get the book yet - I'll check at the library.  I'm skeptical.  I've tried lots of other "natural" things for other situations that turned out to be nothing.  But, I guess I'm willing to try.  Any feedback for those people who think they had normal crawling experiences?  [/QUOTE]

My youngest son was a very late walker too, but I know he didn't crawled very much.  I had four older children at the time and he was the caboose.  I remember telling them that they needed to let him crawl a little.  They spoiled him rotten!  He just had to point and they would bring him what he wanted. 

Your children may have crawled for a while but if they didn't crawl enough, the reflex can still bother them.  There is a test in the book.   You could give it to them and see if they pass it. I know I couldn't pass the test.  It was frustrating to me.  Since I have been crawling, I certainly have noticed improvements in my memory and my ability to organize and stay focused.

I hope it can help your children too.

[QUOTE=Joani]I just want to thank all you "crawlers" out there for sharing your experiences. I don't post much but I certainly read ALOT and appreciate each and every one of you. Thank you and PLEASE don't stop!
My 10 year old son and I are only 3 weeks into crawling so not much to report other than the fact that this week he runs upstairs the minute we get home from work/school and darn near has the mats set up before I'm out of the car.
I wonder if he'll still be doing that in week 15? I did initiate a fun grab bag filled with little goodies as a reward on Fridays. So far so good. [/QUOTE]

Welcome Joani!  I am glad that more people are trying this method.  Please let us know how it works for your son!

Kerbelm, you may try lightening up on the resistance you are giving your son from the shouder area especially towards the later laps when he's getting tired.  I think there may be a tendency to want to push with the toes, especially when getting tired.  I remember when we both started, the exercises seemed very hard and we got sore.  (Gee, why did we skip this part in infancy??)  But, they do get easier.  For your son being in an orphanage, probably did not get much of that tummy time!  The entire thing for both of us has become a daily routine/ritual, like brushing our teeth.

I forget how old your son is, but he may be able/interested in coaching you if you want to do them.  It's nice to know you and your son have joined us. 

[QUOTE=kerbelm]I've just started the crawling routine with my son a few days ago, and I've noticed that once he's almost finished the Crawling I exercises (i.e. after about 4 or 5 laps), and he's getting bored/tired/acustomed to it, his left foot comes on the ground (i.e. just the toes touch the ground) quite often.


[/QUOTE]

kerblem,

When I began the part of the exercises where it says to begin modification of crawling one - you have to reach your arm up and point your elbow out as you crawl - I noticed that my foot came off the ground.  It is interesting that you noticed that too.  I have to concentrate to get it to stay flat.  The second part of the exercises includes a part where the partner helps the crawler keep feet flat on the floor.  So there must be something to the lifiting of the feet thing.

I think it is cool you are going to try them too!!

susan b -

Thanks for your kind words.  I know what you mean about life changing.  It is amazing to me, the changes in myself. 

Thank you for trying the exercises and being a huge support here on this board. It is so good to know that these exercises are helping.  I love reading about Natalie's improvements.  I think it is amazing! 

Calico, you too!! I love reading your posts too. 

Kerbelm, you may try lightening up on the resistance you are giving your son from the shouder area especially towards the later laps when he's getting tired.  I think there may be a tendency to want to push with the toes, especially when getting tired. 

calico, the improvements you are both experiencing are so cool!!  I love to hear how you are doing!!  Thanks for keeping us posted!  It is so awesome to have these exercises helping all of us here.  It is interesting that those who are really trying these exercises are all being helped.

Cool.

1. Ask them to pretend that they're a heavy freight train.  The train wheels (i.e. shins and tops of their feet) will only help pull the train if the wheels stay flat on the track (i.e. the shins and feet should stay flat on the ground while dragging, and they shouldn't let their feet ride up onto their toes).
2. Being a train, they can only move safely if they stay on the track and move in a straight line (so that hands, arms and legs don't go swinging out to the side).
3. They are travelling through the middle of a city, so they have to be careful and only travel slowly (and not rush through the crawling exercises).
   
4. Since they want to be really careful not to crash, they have to listen to the conductor (i.e. the adult guiding them through the exercises) who will give them the signal to crawl each step only when the track's clear one step ahead (i.e. again, to avoid rushing through the exercises).
   

kerblem, I love your imaginative play while crawling! That is awesome!

Calico, I think I crawl in a box position.  I never really had problems with my knees touching.  Sorry I'm not more help. 

I have noticed that my leg swings out a bit when I'm crawling, and I have to concentrate to keep it coming forward straight. 

Also, I am crazy or weren't we all on page 63 and 64 here on this crawlers post already?  Maybe I'm remembering wrong.

[QUOTE=calicorose]Ahhhh!  I had to go to the bottom of the page to find our threads!  LOL.

Anni, since you are an adult, have you noticed any difference in your impulsivity?  DS and I just finished week 21, and I cannot say really for him, as he is in the throes of hormones at the moment, but I have noticed a difference in that area for myself!  Mostly in the area of conversation. I have been able to pull something out of my brain other that something I wish I had not said at all.  More purpose, again, even while talking, so not just in thought processes and actions.  I've been waiting all week to make sure it was staying, and it seems to be!  I am so excited.  And, let me tell you you all, it is such a boost to the self-esteem!  SusanB, have you noticed this with your daughter?? 

[/QUOTE]

Calico,

Yes, I noticed a long time ago how my impulsivity has changed.  I am more apt to think things through before jumping and doing something.  Especially in the area of my business I am always wanting to start!  I think things through much more carfully now.  I think that I can see into the future better.

In conversations I mostly noticed that I could remember what I had just been talking about, and I could come back to what I had said.  I think that people with ADD know instinctively that we are going to lose that information, so we interrupt and blurt things out, afraid we might forget them later.  But now, I don't do that as much either.  I can concentrate better on what someone else is saying.  There are still times when I zone out and don't listen, but I am in much better control now.  I have more confidence also, much more.  It feels the same way now as when medication was working for me.  I love crawling!!!!  And no meds!! 

That is so cool, Calico, that you can see improvements in yourself.  Keep on posting!  I love to read these!

OK, guys, looks like we're going to join you.  I got the book at the library yesterday, and read most of it last night.  My dd has friends over for a sleepover tonight so I can't do the test on her, but I'm guessing since she was in daycare and we were pretty liberal in our use of the swing even past age 1 (yes, I feel awful) that she's got STNR.  Plus, the whole time I was reading the book I kept saying "Exactly!!!".  If I was highlighting, I would have had whole pages highlighted.  We'll try the test this weekend, and go get some kneepads. 

Anyway... brief background.... dd is 8.  3rd grade brought our suspicions to a head that something was "not quite right" - the increased demands are pretty much too much now, homework is awful, grades are slipping, and we're getting more and more frustrated with all the, well, the typical ADHD things.  We did the first half of the eval, but won't get in for the meeting where they tell us if she "really has ADHD" until December!  I need to do something NOW!  I know the exercises take a while to "kick in".  Will we likely see any change before Christmas?  Or will it possibly be a fresh start next semester?  What would be the best thing to try for some relief meanwhile?  (I'm interested in Omega's, magnesium and Focus, but haven't read much of anything).  Anyway, wish us luck!!

• wants to flop on the floor when het gets frustrated
  
• having trouble sitting at a chair during dinner
  
• having trouble writing, especially for more than a minute or two
• had trouble crawling as an infant (from what we could gather, given our exposure to him from only 18 months onward)

Calicorose:  You benefit from the exercise because you are following along with the exercises - remember when you watch your child track the bag or the ball?  I have to tell you, it is tough being the coach when you need the exercises!

Susan:  My son DID not crawl hardly at all. He was walking at 10 months.  If I only knew then what I know now.  I was so excited he walked so young.  Boy, was I clueless.  This country, and maybe others, are raising generations of children that do not crawl, so unfortunately, I think this problem is going to get worse not better.  Also Susan, I would not hesitate to take your child to a chiropractor.  If you go to a good one, he can offer many suggestions that your MD will not.  I also noticed Brett's signature, and I to thought the same exact thing.  I too am a believer, and isn't it wonderful that we worship a God of 2nd, 3rd, 4th.... chances.  Brett's signature is a great one. 

brett.

yes, the sticking the neck out thing is me.  I noticed that I can sit up straighter while driving.  That is a given.  I am much more comfortable driving now.   I asked my daughter to notice if I was not sticking my neck out as much and she said that I don't do it very much any more.

I am still finding that the improvements have helped me.  I went through a hard part of the summer when I worked at a temp job and I got very little sleep in the right hours.  I threw me off totally and now I am back on track with my sleep.  I organized an area downstairs for my scrapbooking and artwork.  I have a gray computer nook that I have never really used except to pile things on and to hold boxes, etc.  I cleared the whole thing off and organized all my stuff and now I go there to do my artwork and scrapbooking instead of all over the kitchen.  This is the best improvement I have had all summer.

I also notice that I am not as panicky about things.

I still have to do a lot of the crawling.  I do it once a week if that.  I have not been consistent at all.  But I know they have helped me very much.  I need to keep doing them.

Mu daughter and I are doing them with a strap to provide reisistance.  It is similar to the dog leash idea.  It is so much better than crawling in front of the person!  I hated that part.  But I suppose it is more difficult for someone who is bothered by the reflex too.  And I supposed it is still bothering me some since I am not all the way done with the exercises. 

I had all these plans to be so dedicated to do them this summer with my kids!!  Oh, where are the New Years Resolutions when you need them?

[QUOTE=calicorose]Hi Ham!  Welcome to our trains! 

I remember 8.  That is when DS (Dear Son) started having a tough time with the increased demands of 3rd grade.  We read through parts of the book together, and I humbly apologized to him for get off the couch (all draped over it funny) and straighten up.  I knew it at the time that he hated it, but you know, it's PROPER.  Blah!  For us, week 12 was a magic week when results started pouring in, like literally overnight.  So next calender year will probably start getting better for her. 

Until then, can you get her on the 504 or IEP plan so her teachers know and can help her with adaptations?  Many of the alts do seem to take a while to kick in.  ONe word of caution with the omegas and these neurotherapies.  And I don't know how this really works, but with the Dore program, they actually made us sign in the contract to NOT take omegas during the therapy, because the oil coats the neural pathways as they are growing, and slows them down.  I'm assuming there is some neural building with the Bender therapy as well, even though the ladies at the center could not comment on using omegas during the therapy.  I'd rather be safe than sorry, so we are off of them.  They really did help though!  The magnesium and Focus formulas sound like great things to try too.  Many have found they helped.

Stay in touch as you get started!
[/QUOTE]

That's good to know about the Omega's.  I'm not familiar with the Dore program, but if the two programs are similar, it seems it would be better not to do the Omega's right now.  Anyone else see anything contradictory about using magnesium and Focus with the crawling exercises?

She's in a parochial school, so we have a few more hoops to jump through before there's an IEP or 504.  I need to read up on 504's.  I use IEP's all the time at work, but I'm not familiar with 504's.  Her math teacher did finally tell us yesterday that if her math homework is taking too long at night, she can dictate the answers to us and we write them down.  Hurray!  Parent-teacher conferences are next week - I'll see if I can get that from the other teacher too.

[QUOTE=calicorose]
~It is FREEDOM from the chains that bind.~

[/QUOTE]

EXACTLY!  Perfect description of my feelings about what crawling has done for me!

Hi Shelly!  Wow, crawlers are coming out of the woodwork.  Please, please, PLEASE keep posting?

As far as holding back a grade, I cannot really answer your question, perhaps if you post one on the parent's section of this board, others will chime in with their experiences.  I know that boys can be generally a bit behind the girls in maturity anyways, and ADHD just brings them a bit lower than that.  I can see it in DS.  we put him in 1st grade because he did seem ready, and daycare was getting pricey.   If you are considering it though, I'd say the younger the better.  I've talked to a couple of parents that did that, and all (parents and children) were very glad they did it. 

Tell your son, and you as well, that we are with you in this journey, so keep it up, you've got a lot of support and encouragement here, and we would all enjoy hearing updates from you.  Have you tried Kerbelm's train idea?  We turn on our favourite music and just chitter chatter while doing them. It's been a great reconnect time.

And wow, what a nice break to see all these posts today, I'm working at the computer today, so I'm not usually so quick to catch these all! 

Shelly123,

Welcome!

That is great that you also are trying these exercises with your son and that you are noticing some improvements. 

I second the motion for all of us to keep on posting!! It is so motivating to have others trying the same things.

Hi all,

Just wanted you to know we were still here and devoted to moving forward. Kell and I have had some more issues to deal with and we haven't gotten past seven weeks but are devoted to carrying on! Could not possibly do that without your help. Thank you all so much for your inspiration and you incredible progress. Please keep up your good works and posting. It is very motivating and I'm asking Kelly to keep on reading so that we can hang in there and change our lives.

scribe,

It is wonderful to hear from you.  You were one of the first to take me seriously on this board! Thanks!

Calico!

I love reading about how you have not gotten a teacher phone call!!  That is awesome!  I wonder when you finish with the program altogether if there will be major improvements in your DS's grades too.  That would be great.

NoTellin, I just looked up the age for you, and any child over the age of 5 can participate in this program.  I did also visit the ATNR issue with DS, just to cover all the bases, and actually talked with the ladies at the Bender Center.  I forget which one I spoke with, but she did say that the therapy does address and correct BOTH reflexes.  Which is good news for you and your son. 

You can obtain a good price on the book, through Amazon, and I went ahead and got the CD too, I needed to see the full range of motions.  When you read the book, your guy will probably fit the profile this program will help, if when you are going down the list and saying to yourself, yes, yup, uh HUH, OHMYGOSH this is MY CHILD!  

Welcome ham2006!  I'm so glad someone else is joining us!!!  It has been a wonderful experience for me.  I am happy that others are finding that same help!  

Phyl, the symptoms of this reflex bothering you are listed on the website - www.stoppingadhd.com - you can also read in the book the symtoms.  Mostly there is discomfort when the arms and legs are bent at the same time.  The neck is also tied into the reflex.  When a child has to sit at a desk and write while looking at the board to copy the information, that is very uncomfortable.  Students in my class - I teach 4th grade - whom I suspect of having the STNR bothering them, are always getting out of their desks, sharpening their pencils, pushing too hard on their pencils, standing up without even thinking about it, etc.  I allow students the choice of standing at the back counter to do their math assignment for the day.  These students choose to stand there on their own.  They can concentrate and get further on their assignments than if they were sitting.

The test you asked about is a crawling test mentioned in the book.  I couldn't pass it myself.  You crawl backwards in the correct position (head up, hands flat, and body in the box position) while someone is applying resistance.  I just had my husband hold onto my pants as I crawled because it was hard for him to get onto his hands and knees. Then you are given words to spell.  You should be crawling along before you are given the word.  When the crawler begins to spell, the things to look for, according to the book, are a decrease in crawling efficiency (you slow down, put your head down, etc)  or you spell the work in cadence with the crawling.  That means you spell each letter as you make one crawling movement.  I know when I would try the test, I would actually blank out in my visual way of spelling and I would get lost in the middle of a long word.  It was frustrating to me, but gave me enough of a reassurance to actually start the exercises. 

Thanks Susan, and Anni, for concurring on the impulsivity thing.  I know that when I share about the improvements, some will be comparing to the DSM criteria, and that is how I am gauging things. Of course, improvements that are not listed there are ocurring as well, which is even better.  Susan, I rememeber around week 9 is when I started to notice things, and it was the short-term stuff as well, and remember that I had done an additional 3 weeks before that, on my own with no coach.  So, you as well, may be technically a little early, and I mention that for the benefit of the other crawlers, as you have been coaching your daughter PRIOR to starting properly on your own.  Coaching is crawling as well, so there has to be something to it as well.

I've also noted a jump in maturity in DS too.  He's in 8th grade, but is almost around grade 6-7. I really wish I had held him back in 6th grade, as he switched schools then, and that would have been perfect timing.  I don't know if he will really be ready to succeed yet in high school, mature-wise, despite the hard work. 

I'm getting REAL tired of this too, but I thank you all for continuing to post, it really does keep us going, I really don't think I could do it if there was no support here.  So, thank you all for continuing to post as well. It really means so much.

Calicorose,

Do you know whether it is possible to hold  a child back a year if they are on special ed?  Our child is 8 in 3rd grade.  Really strugling.  We were thinking of letting him repeat a year if they will let us.

I have been on this site several times.  We are on Week 18 of crawling exercises.  We have seen improvements in organisational skills and handwriting.  Our son's arm used to hurt a lot when he had to write.  Now he says that it does not hurt any more.  We've only got around 3 mths of exercises left to go we are on phase 3.  Its really hard to do this every day.  My son hates them.  But somehow, I really want to complete them.  If we keep on going regularly, we should be done by Febuary.  We had started on June 1. 

jerbear,  I have my daughter help me with resistance.  She holds my upper arms as I go back.  With the exercises that are coming up for me (They change every 8 weeks) I will need someone to help me because someone else has to give a command and a tug on your leg before you begin crawling.  The book says that this is important to the brain.  So, I will have to get someone to help me at that point.

I think that the rocking helps and that you should still use the resistance of the band, even if you do it for longer.  I would use the resistance because the authors told me - I think in a phone call that I had with them once - that if you don't have resistance that it takes much longer to mature the reflex. 

Anyway, I would try to keep the resistance in there if you can.  I think the book on the head - a heavy book - is some resistance and should count for something. 

Is there anyone who could help you?  A friend perhaps?

Hi Joni,

Wow, that sounds like a rough time.  I think is seems every individual goes through the regression, if any, differently.  And yes, if that is what it is, then I woud DEFINITELY take it as a good sign!!  I lost a part of my field of vision somewhre in there as well, around that time frame.  It was a bit worrisome, but thought I'd hold out and see if it corrected in a few weeks, which it did, as I didn't want my doc to look at me really funny.........

I  would assume all is "well" if everything else in his school, home, diet life is going well.  Maybe he's is store for some big changes too!  Hang in there, for me it was a good few weeks in the period, but everyone is different.  Should be the home stretch after the holidays for you then, and you will see the improvement shining!!

[QUOTE=NoTellin]I have just found out that my son has one sided ATNR. He did the army crawl as a child, using his arms only. Will this book help him? He is only seven, which is why I have not explored this thread much before. I figured he is too young. [/QUOTE]

I remember reading or hearing from the authors somewhere that the crawling will also mature other reflexes, but that the STNR is the one that they focus on. So, these exercises may help your son.  Like stated, you can begin the exercises at age 5.

Good luck to you and your son.

Welcome to all the newbi's and thank you Anni,

Anni,

Don't you feel like you have created an incredible wave out here? I feel like you are our mama when it comes to the crawling world! Please keep up all of the great, inspiring posts from newcomers as well as veterans like susanb and calicorose. It may take us another year to finish this, but we will and I know I must write a book about this entire experience. It is all truly awsome!

Keep posting.

Sorry for so many posts!!!  But I had to add this.

Yippeee!!! I remembered today!  And I remember so much better since crawling began!

I remembered that my husband and I had a dinner to attend with my stepson.  Usually before crawling, I wouldn't remember until I was in the driveway and my husband was there, waiting for me to get home so we could go to the event and we were late because I forgot.  Or he would call me at work to remind me.

Now!  I remember on my own!! I just sit there and think "do I have anything going on tonight?  Oh, yeah, I have that dinner to go to!!"  It is so easy!  Before it was like a big blank slate in my mind.  Or I would not even wonder if I had anything going on.  I would just drive home, not even thinking about what was next.  But now, I am always checking my thoughts to see what I am supposed to be doing.  This is such a great change.  I cannot even tell you what it means to me.  I feel normal.  It makes me cry to type this. 

Since I have not seen the book yet, maybe someone can let me know if the way my son prefers to sit is an indicator.  He prefers to sit in a W formation with his feet facing away from his body, heels up close to his rear.  Our psychologist mentioned that this was odd to her, but my pediatrician doesn't think anything about it (I've asked her a few times).  Is this position addressed in the book?  I'm going tomorrow to see if my local library carries the book.

Thanks!

[QUOTE=scribe]

Anni,

Don't you feel like you have created an incredible wave out here? I feel like you are our mama when it comes to the crawling world! Please keep up all of the great, inspiring posts from newcomers as well as veterans like susanb and calicorose. It may take us another year to finish this, but we will and I know I must write a book about this entire experience. It is all truly awsome!

Keep posting.

[/QUOTE]

I really feel great about this post.  I am very excited that there are so many joining us now.  But it is only because others have been willing to post and to try this method.  We really should be giving the credit for this success to Miriam Bender and Dr. O'Dell and Cook for writing about Bender's  discoveries and for sharing them so freely in this book.  It still amazes me that we can purchase this book for only a few dollars (try Amazon - the used copies - I found some today for under $4.00 plus shipping!)  and that the exercises are all in the book. 

I do feel like the mother of this post  and that is a great feeling.  Keep on crawling everyone!!!

[QUOTE=Joani]Wow Anni,
My son is not only ADD/ADHD but has Aspergers sprinkled in for flavor. This is also his first school year without "hard" meds and it's not been easy for him, me, or his teachers, but certainly much healthier. He's put weight on and his heart now beats regular again. He has no behavioral problems, just hyper and can't focus on anything (except playstation) for very long. We'll keep chugging along. Thanks again.[/QUOTE]

Joani, I'm so glad you are here and working with your son on these exercises.  I had a student last year in my 4th grade class who has Aspergers.  He is such a great kid.  He actually was quite social.  He almost won the election in our class for class council representative!  I always wondered if these exercises would help him in any way.  It will be great to see if they help your son.

[QUOTE=susan b.] 
Thank you also for sharing about the "Words Their Way" spelling program.  I looked it up on amazon.com and they had a book on the program.  I'm thinking about ordering it for Natalie.  Today we reviewed some of her old phonics cards that she worked with the ed psych on.  I thought a review might help her spelling.


[/QUOTE]

Susan, I am glad that things are improving so much with Natalie. 

I was going to tell you that there are different books to use with the Word Their Way program.  There is a main book.  Then there are three other books we use, depending where the student is in their spelling abilities.  You have to give a test to see where to start.  Of course, it wouldn't hurt to review, but if you were to buy the higher level book without knowing, you might be frustrated and so will Natalie if it is not on her level.  How old is Natalie again?  Perhaps I can tell you where most of the spellers in our school in her grade are in the program and then you could start there.    Just let me know and I can help you know which part of the program to begin with.  I would hate you to waste your money buying a book you don't need.

Since I have not seen the book yet, maybe someone can let me know if the way my son prefers to sit is an indicator.  He prefers to sit in a W formation with his feet facing away from his body, heels up close to his rear.  Our psychologist mentioned that this was odd to her, but my pediatrician doesn't think anything about it (I've asked her a few times).  Is this position addressed in the book?  I'm going tomorrow to see if my local library carries the book.

Thanks!

[/QUOTE]

gdaymom,

I am trying to visualize the way your child is sitting.  Is it literally sitting on the feet with the bottom of the feet pointing behind him?

I have seen many children in my school sit this way when they want to see something in an assembly and they want to sit higher when they have to sit on the floor.  Is that what you mean?

I guess in answer to your question, I would say that it is an idicator that the reflex might be bothering a person if they are really trapping their legs and feet under themselves in some way.  So if he is doing that, the position isn't really important. 

There is a part of the book in which a child was getting horrible headaches.  The parents didn't know what to do. When the authors observed the child at school they found out that he was allowed to hand down over his legs with his head hanging down and his arms stretched out to complete his work on the floor!  This was more comforatable to him than sitting at his desk.  I would say that was a pretty creative way to trap the reflex.  So, your child might be using this position to trap the reflex feeling and to stay in one place longer.

I hope that helps answer your question.

susan,

I sent you a private message about the Words Their Way program.

I think it is awesome that Natalie has improved so much since crawling.  I think it is awesome that you can actually see improvements in the eye tracking test and the other test.  That is something we can all look to as we do these exercises.  You have actually tracked the improvement with a test outside of the book.  That is wonderful!  It certainly is motivating to me. Thanks for posting those.

After reading the book Stopping ADHD, I wonder how the authors can know my son so well. My son is 8 years old and was diagnosed as ADHD one year ago. He always has problems on sitting still and paying attention to the class at preschool/school. He fits the profile in the book at almost 95% (from sitting positions to sports). He started crawling at 9 months old and walking at 14 months. He was a good crawler but he did spent lots of time in swing, walker and bouncer. Now he is a typical foot-sitter. He likes swimming underwater. He can not bent his arms when doing free-style swimming. He hates baseball and football. When doing the speed skating, it is hard for him to bend the upper body at the same time bending his legs. We just finished the first 5 days crawling yesterday. We are going to do it every day due to my son's inflexibility. We do have fun on the exercises. I am not sure whether it will help his ADHD, but definitely it is a good exercise for me. My legs and back are sore. I will post his progress as soon as we have it.

Well, we finished day 4 today (started 6 days ago, but two day were too busy to do them.)  The only thing I'm "thrilled" about so far is that it hasn't been the fight I anticipated getting the kids to do the exercises.  My 5 year old just loves any sort of togetherness and attention so he's gung ho for them, which helps my 8 year old be less resistant too. 

Here's a question about the feet being flat.  Are they actually supposed to TOUCH the floor, or just not have their toes curled under.  Both kids crawl with them lifted off the floor.  I tried it, and it seems harder actually.  DS finally got it on our last run tonight when I told him to drag his feet.  Does that sound like we're doing it right? 

Other interesting things - the hardest thing for both of them is not keeping their heads up, like I read from some others but (besides keeping their feet flat) is keeping their hands with their fingers pointed forward.  DD wants to crawl with her fingers pointed out to the sides (which makes me almost step on them sometimes!).  One weird thing DS does is almost every time when we get about 5 feet from the end, he curls his left hand into a fist for the last few feet.  Weird??!!  He's done this every day. 

The kids are little enough that I found it somewhat easier to walk over them and hold their shoulders from the top, rather than crawl backwards in front of them.  However, my back is getting a little bothered by that.  I do try to really tighten my stomach doing it, but I was wondering what other people are doing?  Also, my 5 year old hardly pushes against my hands at all when he crawls.  I'm not sure I'm offering enough resistance?

Someone on an earlier post mentioned noticing what hand their child started out with when crawling.  Is this important?  And one last good thing - all this "movement" with the exercises motivated me to get on my Nordic track for the first time in over a year.  Only 10 minutes, but it's a start!!  hee hee

ham,

I have tried holding onto my son's shirt when he crawls, then I don't have to bend over so much.  It does stretch out the shirt, but it gives good resistance. 

The head is easier to hold up as you go along.  But it is a sign of the reflex that it is hard to hold up.  Also, the hand curling thing I can relate to, but it was with my right foot.  When I added the part where you have to point your elbow out and slap the floor as you crawl, my right foot wanted to flex.  It was the first time I noticed that.  I have gotten more used to it now, and it doesn't bother me so much.

About the feet touching the floor, I would just check the book.  I know with the second set of exercises that the helper is supposed to make sure the crawler's feet are flat, but I don't remember what it says about the first set.

Sounds like you have gotten off to a great start.  I am excited to follow along with you and see if you get good results too.

weiminh_yh,

Welcome!  I'm excited to see if the exercises will help your son.  It is great to have new people joining us!!

Thanks for posting and letting us know you are giving it a try too.  It is so good to have support here.

Joani,

I was wondering if something else might be affecting Josh.  I know that week 6 is early to be seeing improvements, but to see worsening behavior is a worry.  I certainly hope it is part of his restructuring like the others have mentioned.  I can't imagine crawling making ADHD worse.  I work with a girl in my class who struggles with ADD and has been diagnosed with Autism.  I know that some days and even weeks she is off. 

Please keep us posted.

I was reading in the back of the Stopping ADHD book and it has some exercises to do with your child when you finish the crawling.  Some are handwriting exercises.  I thought they were very interesting.  One mentions midline and how you should help your child to cross midline when writing.  So, even at the end of the crawling, there are exercises to do that will help a child to relearn writing posture and such.  I am guessing that they need this because they have developed habits along the way to compensate for the STNR bothering them.  They need to relearn the simple way to do it when you are not bothered by the reflex. Anyway, I thought you two, susan and joani, would be interested in that part of the book.  It is toward the end.

As far as spelling in 4th grade - I happen to teach 4th grade - so I can give you my experience with what my school does and what we expect.

You know, teachers can make a big difference in spelling.  So can programs.  A teacher who hands out the list and expects the child to study at home, will have less success than one who has the students work with their spelling words all week.  

Just to let you know, my school is starting the AWESOME spelling program called Words Their Way.  I have studied it since teachers in my school were implementing it into their classes and the administration encouraged us to do it also.  It is an amazing program.  You might mention it to the teachers in your school to see what they think of it.  It tests a child specifically for spelling placement, and gives them the exact words they need to learn. They then give words in groups and has the student sort the words according to spelling patterns that naturally occur in our language.  I have learned a lot just from beginning to study this program.  I love it. 

Anyway, sorry for the sidetrack!!  Keep on crawling!!!

Imac,

I have sent a message to Oprah's e-mail on line and gave them the idea.  I thought it might get more info out there for people who need it.  If it works like it claims - and it has helped me, then people should know about it. 

Thanks for your kind words.  I wouldn't mind sharing what I know with the media, but I probably write more articulately than I speak.

susan,

I sent you a private message about the Words Their Way program.

weiminh_yh,  that is great that you have noticed something so soon.  I hope it keeps up for you and your son.

Joani,  Keep us posted!  It sounds like you are moving right along!  Let us know if you notice anything improving. 

I'm excited to be following your progress!  Keep crawling everyone!