morning rages...need help bad!

Hi, I'm new here but have been lurking for a while.  I need help so bad it isn't funny.  My dd10 rages from waking to getting to school.  Anything I have tried has not worked.  Waking her gently to firmly to singing to being silly waking her up.  I have to wake her 2 hours or more before time to leave out the door....5:15 am.  All I have to do to trigger it is say 3 things, get up, get dressed and eat.  If I don't say that, all is great but she doesn't finish anything.  At school she is wonderful, great, and I am jealous as heck that they get the "nice" kid and I have to wake the alien in the morning.  I'm venting too.  Today was especially horrible.  The "I hate yous and I don't want you as a mom" among other choice daggers were thrown.  These are normal here.  Sad.  I reply with I love yous and I won't talk to her till she talks to me calmly and kindly. I tried to ignore her till she talks nicer but all that got was top of her lungs screaming.  But it gets sooooo hard to stay above and in control of all this chaos.  On top of this she has a twin brother who has Spastic Quad Cerebreal Palsy who I have to get ready for school too.  It seems lately that if she can't get a rise out of me she picks at her brother till he is crying and then I have two kids who are out of control. 

I walked her to school today to see the school counselor, she's good and understands quite a bit so I feel I can get ideas of help from her.  But today I kind of lost it.  I dragged dd in her office and just broke down before really getting anything out.  We all sat down and the counselor and dd talked, I couldn't cuz I was trying hard to control the tears.  DD left for class and I talked.  I'm ready for a padded room.  The counselor told me if I have a bad morning I can call her and she'll get an officer over to the school to have a talk with her.  I don't see how that will work.  I'm willing to try anything.  I can't keep this up for much longer.  Funny thing is is that after school she is fine.  Your normal 10 yr old.  But I'm still a mess from the morning today.

I read here and I see everyone handling things better than me and I'm sitting here thinking there were some times I wished I wasn't a mom.  Has anyone thought that or am I horrible for thinking it?  Also, and this is bad, I'm in remission from cancer, and had the horrible thought that if it came back I wouldn't take treatments........just to find peace.  I feel sometimes I live in hell.  Ok, that was terrible.  I'm just not strong today.  Please, no yelling, have enough of that, I just need to know if others out there feel the way I do from time to time.  Usually I can handle it and get thru but there are days I can't. 

Dont beat yourself up so much. We've all been there. We can be strong and diligent but realistically, we're humans too and sometimes we just blow. I think you nailed it on the nose when you said that you come here and read how other people are handling things so much better than you .. but then admitting you're just not strong TODAY. That's all it's about. We're not handling things better than you. It just looks that way. Really, from what I've read so far, you're doing everything right! You have a lot on your plate and from the sounds of it, you're able to keep on top of things .. just not all the time. I've yet to meet anyone who can. I'm glad you've decided to post because this is a start. Getting this stress off your chest is so much helpful and knowing that you have back-up support from the school is even better. You are one person. Don't expect to be a super-mom. They don't exist.

Hang tight and vent away. We all do! Hugs to you .. and I know you'll be taking those treatments if the need arose. You're stronger than you think.

Welcome to the board .  I hope you find a lot of support here because many parents are in your situation, and I would dare say most of us came here because we were at our wit's end, unable to figure things out.  We needed someone else's insight and thoughts, and we needed to vent to people who had been there and could understand. 

I agree with everything Luvmykids02 and InaBox have said, and I could not say it any better, so I won't attempt to.  What I would like to comment on is your daughter's sleeping patterns.  I am curious what time she goes to bed, whether or not she suffers from insomnia, and whether or not she is a restless sleeper.  I also am curious if she acts this way, when she is allowed to sleep in and wake up on her own.  Do you ever let her sleep in, like on a Saturday, until she wakes up naturally?  Is her behavior the same in this situation?  Many ADHD kids are sleep deprived, and poor behavior is not uncommon with these kids in the mornings.  My son has insomnia, and the only time he can be a true pain in the butt is in the morning.  He does not rage, but he's not his normally happy self, either. 

HTH and, again, welcome! 

when she sleeps in she is fine.  She is a restless sleeper.  She goes to bed fine, falls asleep ok.  But she is all over the bed, had to get her a full size one, she was always falling out of a twin size.    If she is sleep deprived, what can I do?  I already send her to bed between 7:30 and 8 pm. 

Thanks for the warm welcome and the hugs!  I needed them. I'd better get to sleep myself.  We are going out to the museum for a day of fun.  I think we all need it.  I love those 2 with all I got, just gets hard doing it all by myself.  Thanks for everything. (sniff)

 Dad, you said what I couldn't.  LOL.

lillian wrote:
 My son has insomnia, and the only time he can be a true pain in the butt is in the morning.

Excelent point Lillian. I dont think my son has had more than 4 hours sleep at night since the day he was born and he will be 19 next week. Many times it was hard to distinguish between ADHD behaviors and sleep deprived behaviors as they can look very much alike.

when she sleeps in she is fine.  She is a restless sleeper.  She goes to bed fine, falls asleep ok.  But she is all over the bed, had to get her a full size one, she was always falling out of a twin size.    [/QUOTE]

Because she does not show any of this behavior when she is allowed to sleep in and wake up naturally and because she is such a restless sleeper, I think you may be dealing with sleep apnea, and the behavior you are seeing in the morning may be a result of that.  I am not a physician, so, of course, I cannot diagnose.  I would try to find a doctor who specializes in sleep disorders and take your daughter in to see the doctor.  I don't know if there is a particular field of medicine that deals with sleep apnea, but I do know in the area where I live, the doctor who studies and treats sleep disorders is a neurologist. 

Good luck!

I'd like to also welcome you to the board. I was wondering who diagnosed her and if she's been evaluated by a NeuroPsych or CHild Psyschiatrist. That type of raging is not normally typical of ADHD and kids who rage that much usually end up with another diagnosis, which ADHD/ODD being the first one, but stimulants don't help it. I strongly advice seeing both a Child Psychiatrist and a NeuroPsych. Do you have mental illness on either side of the family tree? Mood disorders? Substance abuse? Anyone with suicide attempts? If so, those are huge red flags for early onset bipolar, which mimics ADHD to a point, but the kids are much angrier and stimulants and antidepressants make the kids even worse. Inability to sleep is more a symptom of bipolar than ADHD. ADHD kids often have trouble falling asleep, but sleep well once they do and tend to be early risers. Bipolar kids can't get up in the morning and don't sleep much at all. Bipolar in kids manifests different than in adults and looks a lot like SEVERE ADHD with raging anger, even violence, swearing, hitting us, hitting others--some bipolar kids can keep it in at school and just act out at home, at least in the early stages of the illness. I have bipolar and I had it as a kid, and I can tell you that your attention span doesn't exist as you are always switching moods. I'll show you my favorite Juvenile Bipolar Site as this is the disorder most often misdiagnosed as ADHD in children when it is really something that needs different treatment. If stims aren't working, it likely isn't ADHD. Here are two sites you may want to check out:

www.bpchildresearch.org

www.conductdisorder.com

Welcome PatC Let me start by giving you a big hug I so applaud you for your stength and given your circumstances with all you have on your plate, the first thing you need to do is lighten up on yourself. I am also in remission from cancer and let me tell you that you are a warrior and a hero for suriving such emotional and physical trauma. I can relate to your thoughts about treatment but because you are sucha loving mother, you will do whatever it takes to survive and be here for your children. No one an truly understands unless they have walked in your shoes and while it might appear that other parents are handling things better, if we were we wouldnt be coming here screaming out for support and a shoulder to lean on. We help each other cope here on a daily basis and your more than welcome to join us while we have our pitiy parties lol

You mentioned that you have been lurking here an Im sure you have read the many posts from some very well versed parents here that recommend to all parents who are at wits end searching for answers to first make an appointment  to have your child seen by a neuropsycologist. Venting to a counseler is great to alleviate your anxiety but you need to find out the core problem. Once you ascertain the reason for your daughters behaviors, in a collaborate effort with her doctor, you can get a treatment plan and start the road to healing on many levels for not only your daughter but the entire family unit. I can only speculate but Im sure that your sons medical problems have stirred up a lot of emotional issues for your daughter and Im sure that the fact that you have had cancer has left her riddled with fear as well.

There is plenty of support on this message baord and Im certain you have  a lot of good advice coming your way. In the mean time, take things one day at a time and any time you need to vent, there will always be someone here to listen. May God bless you and your family and please know that you are never alone.

[QUOTE=lillian] I think you may be dealing with sleep apnea, and the behavior you are seeing in the morning may be a result of that.  I am not a physician, so, of course, I cannot diagnose.  [/QUOTE]

That would be my guess too. Again, I'm not a physician either.

I used to have mornings like you are describing - yelling, encouraging, nothing seemed to work.  I finally tried something that I was inspired to do from reading an article in my church magazine.

I had two boys who were having a hard time getting ready for school in the morning.  I stopped yelling, I stopped listing everything they needed to do, I stopped everything. 

I made myself a rule.  I couldn't say anthing except, "Can I help you with something?"

That was it.  It worked like magic!!  That was the only thing I could say, and I had to follow through if they needed help. 

What was really weird (I expected them to say "Yes!!!  Go do this and that for me!")  was that they hardly ever said "Yes, I need help.  They just started getting ready.  It was so weird.  They were so independent that they didn't want me helping them do things like brush their teeth and stuff.  Anyway, our mornings changed into peaceful times!!! They got ready, we weren't late anymore.  If we happened to be late, all I would say is "Can I help you with that? Or Can I help you with something?"  It was funny how easy it was once I started it.

Maybe it will work for you too.

You could also try the discipline program that works for me and is taught and followed at my school (I teach 4th grade)  It is called Love and Logic.  It is a terrific program that helps parents and children survive!  I think it helped me to have a calm life and I truly appreciate it for that.

Good luck to you.  I know how hard it can be to raise children!!!  You are  probably doing a better job than you know.

PatC I just want to say WOW . Its the SAME thing im going threw with my 6 year old son Mike . Your not a bad person for feeling the way you do . There are times when i want to scream . i also have a 5 year old daughter and 3 year old son that dont have ADHD . i just found this site and have only posted once and hope i can find people to talk to that understand what goes on everyday. so feel free and vent . keep strong , thats what people tell me