Overboard | ADHD Information

I understand that people are trying to be supportive. However, the dx of High Functioning Autism in here has gone too far. Please. Allow the doctors to make these diagnoses. We are not qualified to do so. There are so many factors to take into consideration and most often, not enough questions are asked before the assumptions are made. A poster suggests that their child has one characteristic (of many) that relates to Autism and suddenly they're bombarded with the notion that their child is likely to have this dx? This has happened to me as well.. and no, I'm not in denial.

It IS common for people with ADHD to have sensory issues.

Just thought I would address this issue as we don't want to mislead these parents and scare them with false assumptions. You may instead, want to ask the poster more questions before making your own dx of the child you've never met.

Sorry and thanks.

I agree with INaBox 100%...

I too think this type of on the spot diagnosing is too much...Also, if you consider the stats , ADHD is much more common than autism..so not every poster's child is on the spectrum. Sometimes it could just be plain old ADHD.

I will continue telling parents of kids with symptoms to indeed go to a NeuroPsych. If not, they can't know--and imo it is very remiss not to check your child with symptoms out for autism or any other possble Neurological disorder. It is certainly fine not to take the adivice, although many will be sorry later on. Had we not gotten the advice, we'd still be in limbo with a 12 year old boy, so I disagree and won't stop. Naturally, it is always up to the parent to ignore symptoms. Nobody is diagnosing here. We are suggesting going to professionals who CAN diagnose, such as a NeuroPsych. Nobody here has diagnosed any child.

Which is why they should know of the possibility of bipolar too. ADHD treatment for either bipolar or ASD not only won't help, it will make things worse. "Leave no stone unturned." I know it's hard to face worse dx., but many of us had to and it's helped our children immensely. Many of the kids here have already been diagnosed with comorbid bipolar and autism so it's a viable topic on the boards and I feel it's good advice to tell somebody to test further when it seems too extreme for ADHD. If a parent has a problem with it, maybe it's best not to ask for advice because I think most of us do our best to give the best we have and offer possibilities that can only be realized by going beyond ADHD. Have a good one. I"m off of this post since I've already stated I feel it's remiss NOT to mention these things.

OlderMom38771.2224537037

OlderMom,

I like you and I respect you. I know from your posts what you have been through personally, and I know you do not want other people to go through the same. I believe your wishing to keep people from going through what you have is the driving force of your posts. My problem with your bipolar and autism focus is that the DSM is two inches thick, and in that manual there are a host of neurological disorders and learning disabilities that mimic ADHD. Everything does not always come back to bipolar and autism. When a parent like InABOX says that she does not think her child has autism, I think you should let it go. Mention it once, and if she is not receptive to the idea, then let it go.

lillian38771.3487847222

As a newbie to this forum, I just wanted to say something here. Of course I haven't read all the posts here, but I have read most. Personally, I haven't noticed the people here dx anyone, but rather mentioning that the child should be checked for it, at times. And I have to believe that it's a good thing for a couple reasons- people need to educate themselves on these disorders, some may not even realize there is such a thing. Then, they can take their suspicions to a dr-which I have always read here as the most important thing, and I totally agree- and make sure the dr tests for that. With all the quacks out there, parents need to be armed with info. They may not realize that their child has several symptoms of perhaps bipolar, autism, depression, or whatever. I like to think this board tries to educate, not diagnose. JMO...

Sarah

I agree with in INabox. I also agree the recommendations for further testing is important. I think it scares and panics parents with young children. As far as sensory tendances, rocking etc. These things can go with any child, and to get a diagnosis these tendancies have to have a significant impact on the childs everyday functioning, in order to get a diagnosis. To me listening to others experiences, and what works for them is a more helpful discussion. Alot of kids with ADHD do have other tendancies toward other issues, like sensory issues, anxiety, ODD, etc. It does travel alone sometimes, but not always. You can't put any one of these children in a box. Dr. Samuel Goldsteins books are good for more info. on ADHD.momiss238771.310775463

InABox, your son has: Speech delays (nothing to do with ADHD), sever sensory issues, including food aversions (not ADHD-food averstions have nothing to do with ADHD), CAPD, ABCDEFGHIJ, etc. I would feel remiss in not encouraging you to see a Neuropsych for high functioning autism. Your son has more than sensory issues which I also have because of the bipolar, BUt they aren't so bad that I have to cover my ears or that I have good aversions. Your son is way off the scale sensory wise WITH delays. That isn't common for ADHD. ADHD kids often talk early and often. I get PM's almsot every time I log in with people thankful to know about other disorders. I almost can't log in without that sort of a PM. I haven't, however, spoken to your situation lately because I feel you know enough and are just afraid to face it. Am I diagnosing? Maybe I'm strongly suggesting you see an autism specialist, usually a NeuroPsych, because your son sounds very likely to have it. You don't have to listen. I'm not trying to scare you. I'm trying to help, but, again, I haven't addressed YOU for a long time as I feel you aren't open to hearing any possiblities and that you aren't going to seek out a professional for a new dx. Since your in Canada, maybe it takes longer for a dx. I really don't know and I don't care anymore. IAB, I know your fear. I had it. But I can't promise never to tell others to see a NeuroPsych because the child sounds like he has autistic traits. Sorry. You can choose not to read my posts though.

OlderMom38770.9369328704I agree strongly with INABOX, and also think that people are doing the same thing with bi-polar. Some of these diagnoses have similiar and some of the same symptoms.

Inabox, I certainly understand where you're coming from and will do my part to be sensitive to how I word my posts. I, too, will urge posters to seek re-evaluation because lots of kids are being diagnosed by pediatricians and they're not receiving a thorough enough evaluation, IMO.

About sensory issues, I'm really curious -- can you reference a source that says it is common for ADHDers to have sensory issues? I've looked through a couple of my ADHD books (Hallowell and Monastra, specifically), and there is no mention of sensory issues. My own son has sensory issues, but they are a part of his umbrella dx of bipolar disorder, not ADHD. There is no mention of sensory issues in the DSM definition of ADHD. Perhaps co-morbid conditions that go along with ADHD carry sensory issues, but I don't think you can say it is common for pure ADHD to be associated with sensory issues.

Oldermom, I'm not suggesting to stop recommending a thorough evaluation from a specific professional. That is relevant information. I've noticed people making some pretty strong personal assumptions of what the cause of a given situation is.. and it's not so much WHAT is said but HOW it's been said. Lets be a little more objective and a little less subjective here. People are being advised that their child's diagnoses is incorrect and that's not right. There have been cases where this has been true but apparently (in here) everyone diagnosed with ADHD has had a misdiagnoses. It's ridiculous.

To me, it's not mentioning it as a possibility that's the problem, it's saying it over and over and over. Again, the DSM is two inches thick. Just because your child has been misdiagnosed does not mean the child has bipolar or autism. I am very sympathetic of parents who doubt their children's ADHD dx or think there is something else going on in addition to it, for I was the same. This is the reason I came to the board, in the first place. Of course, I have since found out my son is dyslexic, and many of the problems we were seeing at school and at home were being caused by dyslexia. Finding out he has dyslexia and putting interventions in place at school has changed our lives. He is doing soooo much better. However, that does not mean I am going to ask every parent who comes on the board, "Has your child been checked for dyslexia?" If the parent mentions that the child is having problems with reading, writing, and math, I may suggest it, but otherwise, no. I suggested it to two parents (Leigh and OldTimer), and they said, "Nope." I suggested it to another parent (Poodledoodles), and she said, "You know, I think he may be." So, I've dropped it with Leigh and Oldtimer, but I've continued discussing it with Poodledoodles.

In other words, we can see similarities in our children and the children of other people on the board, but we don't have the right to continue to harp on these similarities, if the parents don't agree. They ARE the parents. They know their children better than anyone here does, and I think we need to be respectful of that.

A Cautionary Note

Effective treatment depends on appropriate diagnosis of bipolar disorder in children and adolescents. There is some evidence that using antidepressant medication to treat depression in a person who has bipolar disorder may induce manic symptoms if it is taken without a mood stabilizer. In addition, using stimulant medications to treat attention deficit hyperactivity disorder (ADHD) or ADHD-like symptoms in a child with bipolar disorder may worsen manic symptoms. While it can be hard to determine which young patients will become manic, there is a greater likelihood among children and adolescents who have a family history of bipolar disorder. If manic symptoms develop or markedly worsen during antidepressant or stimulant use, a physician should be consulted immediately, and diagnosis and treatment for bipolar disorder should be considered.

The warning above from the National Institute of Mental Health in Bethesda, MD, is why I always recommend that parents whose children have bad reactions to meds seek another evaluation to look beyond ADHD. I would be remiss if I didn't -- I have two children who had manic reactions to antidepressants and now have working diagnoses of bipolar disorder. I don't know where we would be if we had stuck with our former psychiatrists who had no clue about bipolar disorder. We had the good sense (and some prompting from posters on this board) to know our kids weren't reacting the way they should to these meds and something was very wrong indeed. I am very grateful that we now know what's wrong and can get our kids the help they need and deserve.

I agree NoTellin

I don't post to InABox anymore. I still believe that is is remiss (VERY) for any child who has a speech delay, sensory issues, and ADHD behaviors not to see a good NeuroPsych. Why wait? Early intervention lends the best prognosis. If a child rages on stimulants, you bet it's smart to see a Psychiatrist for early onset bipolar, especially if mood problems, substance abuse or suicide are on the family tree. Why give a kid stimulants when they may make him sicker? If I'd have known then what I know now, I'd have gone slower myself and not trusted "professionals" so quickly, especially not therapists or pediatricians. You only hurt your child if you don't check things out thoroughly. There are so many misconceptions and I read them here. Autistic kids do not all seem "in his own world." My son can seem very spacey and can seem very "with it" and has better social skills and behaviors than most of the kids on this board, which is what scares me about the kids on this board. In fact, my son has improved so much that few guess he's autistic. He is--that's more obvious at home--but most people think of autism and think of a kid banging his head against the wall, unable to communicate, mentally retarded...they don't even know what the kids are like. I'mt hankful I listened to the parent who broke my heart and asked me, "Are you sure he's not autistic?" Instead of freaking out though, I went and had him testing intensively by a NeuroPsych. I'm grateful I was asked that question now. There are always parents who are too afraid of what they may hear to take thier kids for further testing. Even ADHD freaks some parents out, and I cant' help that. I do feel badly for their kids because there is help, and they won't get it without diagnostics. Again, I can't not tell a parent, if the symptoms are staring at them, not to check it out. That's not diagnosisng. InABox, you started the thread and get very upset. Has your child EVER seen a NeuroPsych? In the time it would take for you to have your child tested by somebody who understands autism, you could free yourself from all your research done online, which, half of it, is not very good. But yo either can't get a referral (I know Canada is different) or you're just too darn afraid of what you'll hear, which is, imo, a disservice to your precious little one. My best friend is an Aide in a school and her class is all ED (Emotionally Disturbed) and she has told me that so many of her parents rather believe their kids are "bad" rather than mentally ill or neuroloigcally different. She says it's a big teacher's lounge discussion. I'm sure she's right. But the teachers still try to encourage the parents to look for answers, and so will I. Ok, this thread may continue, but it won't change any minds, so I won't read on. I hope you all have a good day and hug your kids :)

OlderMom38771.4459953704

It does seem like posts are given an autism or bipolar spin when it doesn't clearly apply except in some peripheral way. It often seems so extreme to me... I have to skip over them.

I have to say, I am newbie here as well, and after one or two posts, and lots of reading here, I completely stopped posting, and this is exactly why. I was extremely turned off by the internet diagnosis', that most of the time don't seem to be asked for.
There are so many posts here, where the original poster is just asking for simple suggestions on how to deal with certain things. Instead of suggestions, they get asked who diagnosed their child, what was the diagnosis, and they need to go to a neuropsychiatrist because they may have the wrong diagnosis.

While I think the information about NeuroPsychiatrist is great, because I personally had never even heard of one, and the information about ADHD mimickers is equally important...I believe there is a right and wrong time to post that information.
I don't feel that a simple question about behavior or reaction to medication, requires a slew of questions about who diagnosed, and the poster being told they may have a wrong diagnosis, and have they looked into bipolar and autism.
On the other hand if the poster is asking questions where those answers would be relevant, for example, they can't figure out why nothing is working, and asking why, it seems those questions would be appropriate.

I think this forum could be really great. There is soooo much knowledge here, and personal experience (which is why I keep reading), that I think it would be a shame to have people go else where because of this type of thing.

I hope no one is offended, because again, I do think the information is important, and does need to be shared. I think it's just given at inappropriate times. Just my opinion of course

I don't want to stir up the pot anymore than it already has been, but I also have a 4yr old with a diagnosis of possible PDD_nos which is on the autism spectrum but high functioning, but the pysch that she is seeing say's that it could also just pan out to be ADHD as she gets older because it is so hard to dx a young child. Yes alot os the symtoms mimik ADHD but then again when a child can not stop becuase his/her hyperactivity has them so tightly wound up all the time how can they learn how to correctly speak, their brains are not letting them slow down enough to do so. My pschy and neurologist have told me the same things. Yes she has some characteristics of autism but so do you or I if you stop and think about it, I need things to be scheduled everyday or my day just doesn't seem to run right but I am not autistic. Yes if your child seems unattached to reality and yes if your child has sensory issues get them checked, but doesn's always mean AUTISM. Keep your hopes up as do I know that one day soon we will know what they underlying problem really is.

Sincerely

Sandi Dipaola

OlderMom,

Again, you mention autism to InABOX. Why do you do this? Leave her alone.

Well said Lillian.

Suggesting it to someone is one thing Auntie. Enforcing it like a bad habit is another. I took Oldermom's advice and yet that wasn't enough. She still believes I'm in denial. She also magnified my son's symptoms more so than she should have. I explained to her in the past about his symptoms and why certain symptoms may look like it's associated with ASD. Yet for some reason, she feels the need to prove me wrong. I'm not in denial. I have followed through with her suggestions. I have taken the neccessary measures to have it looked at. That wasn't enough. She still insists that my son has ASD. I think her personal opinions is over-crowding my better judgement. This is after all MY son and I'm the one who sees him on a daily basis and have experience with ASD myself. I'm not some mom who is completely in the dark about this subject and she knows that.

Make your suggestions and then leave it alone. I'll respect you more for it. I don't need to be drilled. I do have a competent mind of my own. Thank you.

hi my son is 4 yr old and has just been diagnosed by a peadiactric psychiatrist with adhd. i asked her on a scale from 1 to 10 what did he rank and she said about a 8 (my grandmother said she had not seen him in all his glory yet) because he bounces off the walls like a bullet ricochette. anyway he has an appointment with an ot for sensory issues he also has appointments for behavior management but he has only been diagnosed with adhd. thanksIt is very hard to find a neuropsych for those of us who do not live in a large city. It is also very expensive. Our children are worth the money, but you cannot get blood from a turnip. Lillian, I agree with you. Mention it once and drop it.I believe that the recomendations for further testing are important. However, I feel that we should steer clear of diagnosing. We do not know the child involved, nor are we doctors. Every child is different, and may display their symptoms for a variety of reasons. I also feel that when we diagnose, we are at risk of frightening or offending certain parents. Particularly parents of newly diagnosed children, who are just learning to cope with the ADHD diagnosis. I feel that we are all here to share our parenting and life experiences-what has worked for us and what has not. I enjoy having a place to vent and share successes with people who truely understand what I am dealing with. As NoTellin mentioned, in many cases, when people begin to diagnose, I often skip over the post.[QUOTE=OlderMom]

Are you psm? [/QUOTE]

My son has language delays because the brain injury he had at birth was located in the part of the brain that processes language. I've mentioned this several times about the bleeding he had at birth (in two areas of his brain). Also, I never said my son has severe sensory issues. He has auditory sensitivities. I was told by a very reputable Occupational Therapist; a Psychologist and pediatrician that auditory sensitivities is common with children with ADHD. It's not in its criteria but they often go hand-in-hand. I'm also aware that food sensitivities and language delays aren't associated with ADHD. I don't recall ever saying that they were. And despite what you believe, I DID have him assessed by a psychologist who specializes in Autism Spectrum Disorders and discussed with her a lot of these issues. I almost hoped that he WAS on the spectrum so he could get the funding and support he'd benefit from. Unfortunately (and fortunately) he wasn't diagnosed with this. I've also mentioned several times that I work with children with Autism so there's no need for me to be 'afraid' of this diagnoses. I'm well suitable to handle this disorder. This is exactly what I mean though. I have explained my case yet I'm STILL told that I'm afraid. I know my son best and I have taken the necessary measures to have this checked out.. and the buck hasn't stopped yet. I'm also aware that there's more to his ADHD diagnoses and will be looking into CAPD and will be keeping my mind open to other possibilities.

It's one thing to suggest that a particular set of characteristics are associated with Autism - it's another thing to say, "Sounds like your child has High Functioning Autism." over and over again .. objective vs. subjective.

Thanks everyone for your support. I was hoping I wasn't the only one who felt this way. Also, despite it all, I know we're all here to be supportive to one another so this thread, by no means, was written out of disrespect to any one individual. I'm just trying to give everyone heads-up that's all.

.IMac38945.8440162037Thank you steppingstone.

My point of view: I came to this site looking for ADHD information. I would read Older Mom's suggestions but rejected them. To be honest, I didn't even want to think about bi-polar. But after reading over and over the signs of Bi-polar and actually stepping off my "stuck to the ADHD DX" I started looking at Bi-polar. Most of you know I have been coming to ADHDNews for a long time and just a couple weeks ago it hit me - I mean really hit me that my neice has early on-set Bi-polar. The bottom line - thanks to Oldermoms persistant posting it may never have been pounded into my head there was way more going on with my neice than ADHD.

With that said, I never really posted about my neice and her recent symptoms so maybe I would have gotten defensive if she responded with the suggestion of bi-polar. And maybe I'd even be posting in this thread agreeing with all of you. I don't know???

Maybe, Oldermom - keep a notepad by your computer and write down who you respond to, quickly jot down important facts and then leave it at that? I hope you aren't offended because you know I luv ya.