ASpergers or High Functioning Autism? | ADHD Information
I dont think Trevor (age 6) has just ADHD. Here is what we are going thru:
He is very moody.
He over reacts to everything if we tell him no on something he goes into a rage throwing himself on the floor or against the wall yelling and screaming and saying mean things, or he will begin to throw things around. Everything and anything will start a fit.
Everything is an argument! I mean everything with everyone!
He is smelling everything, even if he touches something he has to smell his hands. This is anywhere we are.
He constantly plays in his hair and sucks his tounge (sp?).
He gets ingrossed in cartoons and has to watch the same ones every morning or he gets really upset!
He can not tie his shoes no matter how many times we show him (this may be normal kid though).
He was never flushing the toilet, so we drew him a cartoon with a him coming in going potty then flushing the toilet and going back to play. Now he always flushes the toilet. Seems to respond to visual more than verbal.
You can tell him something a million times and he just wont get it.
When we put him on time out it will be for 5 minutes starting when he is quiet. He will and has carried on for hours screaming that he will be there forever and ever, no matter how many times we tell him when he is quiet he can get up he carried on for hours.
He has trouble with eye contact and also when he is in trouble he laughs or smiles like he does not care.
He can read and reads well. He can add small numbers. He is not stupid, he is actually very smart. Sometimes he sounds so intellegent and others he just seems out there, in his own world. Heplayes better with younger children than he does older or of his own age.
He does have trouble expressing himself and if he cant get his point across he sometimes will push or shove his brothers and sisters.
I am at a loss, trying to get in with a DR but wondering if anyone has any ideas.
trevors_mom38910.2762268518
Trevor's Mom,
Wow, you were describing my son to a tee. He is 11, soon to be 12, and I still don't know if he can tie his shoes (I gave up trying to teach him so he has been wearing slip ons for years). When he was little he was obsessed with certain t.v programs, now he is obsessed with computer games. He has never gotten along with his peers because every little thing sets him off--he gets bugged at the drop of a hat. He constantly bullies younger kids, especially his sibblings. He was finally tested in school for the Gifted program and tested very high, but his social IQ is very low. I am now Homeschooling him because of his inability to get along with others. He was dx with ADHD at age 9, but I suspect he may be Bipolar because he has rages, usually a couple times a month. He has an appointment with a Child Psychiatrist in August so hopefully he can give us the answers we need. He is taking Omega Mood, Mindsoothe Jr. by Native Remedies and Triple Complex by the same company. He does seem in a better mood since starting these supplements. I know how frustrating it can be most of the time but don't give up, you'll find what you need to help you son
I'm not MomWI, but I can help answer the question. Child psychiatrists generally diagnose by getting a history from the parents and talking with and observing the child. (Ours met with us for one session, two sessions with our son/daughter, and then us for another session before making recommendations for interventions, which included meds and weekly therapy.) Psychiatrists are absolutely the right professional to diagnose mood issues (anxiety, depression, bipolar disorder). But they are not trained in doing the kind of cognitive testing that can help diagnose ADHD, learning disorders and autism. Some psychologists can do that testing, but neuropsychologists have further training in brain function that make them even more skilled to do this testing.
We never had a Psychiatrist do performance testing on my son. He wouldn't even consider autism, and was dead set that the kid had bipolar, even though he wasn't moody and didn't rage. So maybe there ARE some Psychiatrists who do know how to test for high functioning autism. It usually takes anywhere from 8 hours on up, and several appointments. High functioning autism is sort of where bipolar was just a few years ago. Many professionals don't know about it, and pooh-pooh it, and call it ADHD, which is what used to happen to kids who had bipolar. It will take a few years yet. It is mandatory to go to a professional who not only knows about ADHD, but also bipolar and ASD since symptoms overlap, but the treatments are very different. The wrong treatment can steer a child way off track and cause lifelong problems. ASD kids MUST have interventions to reach their highest function. Meds/counelors aren't enough as the kids ARE "clueless" and literally need textbook teaching about stuff most kids pick up simply by being alive. The results can be amazing with interventions, but they need to have them.
MomWI...I'm just curious why do you say psychiatrists don't test? Mine did. I'm just trying to understand the differences between all of these professionals.
I'm beginning to wonder if my son's psychiatrist is a neuro psychiatrist. At this point it really doesn't matter as we have found what we needed to help our son. it's just a matter of curiousity. I found him through my insurance plan. He is very well respected and helped to identify the right diagnosis for our son.
4myson38910.4006828704Autistic Spectrum Disorders are best diagnosed by a neuropsychologist, found at university and children's hospitals. Mood disorders (anxiety, depression, bipolar disorders) are best diagnosed by a board-certified child psychiatrist. In your case, I'd recommend evaluations by both.
It sounds so much like my son, who was first diagnosed ADHD, that it's scary. My son does the same things. I recommend posting on the ASD board. This place isn't the best to answer these questions. I think the ASD parents will tell you to have him evaluated. He is pretty classic for the Spectrum. The higher functioning part of the Spectrum is newly understand and, even ten years ago, when I was looking for answers for my son, professionals were just learning about Aspergers so it often was, and often still is, undiagnosed and called ADHD. Aspergers kids need interventions different from ADHD. Aspergers/HFA is pretty much the same thing, and all Spectrum kids need t he same types of interventions. At any rate, here is the link to talk to other PDD/autism parents. They are a wealth of info--again, most started out with ADHD diagnoses, unless the kids were extremely low functioning. My son is 13. Ten years ago, nobody heard of Aspergers/PDD-NOS. Thank God for progress. Ok, here's the site. It looks just like this one, but addresses Spectrum issues. A few people from this board post there too, or switched to that board. NeuroPsychs seem most "up" on this and know how to test for traits that lean in the direction of AS. Don't expect the same from Psychiatrist (they don't test), Psycologists with the Neuro or talk therapists. Some ASD parents use diet, but that doesn't change the ASD kid from being ASD. ADHD meds help some ASDers and not others. The main treatment are various interventions to bring these kids to their highest level possible. As you noted, many of these kids are so "clueless" it is scary...interentions can help turn the light bulb on, and they desperately need that. We're still working on that with my 13 year old. Had he only been given ADHD interventions, he would not be nearly as advanced as he is today. Yes, these kids tend to be smart! Yet sometimes they can't "get" academics either, at least without an aide. One last thing.Co-morbid mood disorders are commong with ASD. Not all ASD kids are defiant.
www.autism-pdd.net/forum/default.asp
MomWI38910.3842592593I posted to your other post. I now understand more of your frustration. I'm so sorry you are having to go through this. Have you gone to a child psychiatrist that specializes in the area of children. I really think you should work on this. I know that some doctors are very difficult to get into, but if you stress your concerns sometimes they will find a way to fit you in to the schedule. Especially since he is experiencing so many things. Sometimes doctors located in Children's hospitals are able to help more quickly. Back when we suspected my son might have aspergers which he turns not to have it... just ad/hd, they worked very hard to get my son into their appointments. I didn't end up going to them as I found another doctor that had a canceled appt. with another patient and I was able to get in on the spur of the moment. Don't give up. It will all work out.If he may have ASD kids, an ADHD specialist won't be much help. They are not the same, regarding treatment plan at all. neuropsychologist this is where we took Trevor becuase we did not want a missdiagnoses on him. We found a great dr that spezalizes in ADHD kids but now we are over 2000 miles away from him :(