New here | ADHD Information

Hi everyone. I just found this forum a few days ago and am still trying to absorb everything.

My daughter is turning 7 in February and we are having her evaluated for ADD/ADHD. Just filled out the testing form, as did her teacher. We have an appt. with her pediatrician on Tuesday. I know she's ADD. The more I read, the more I am convinced. She never stops talking; she is constantly fidgeting with something; if she's not talking, she's singing or humming; she cannot focus on a simple task without being distracted (ie: getting dressed, brushing teeth).

Every week, there is at least 2 blowouts (there is a potential for at least one a day, but I pick my battles now) - usually in the morning, which leave me in tears. 2 weeks ago, it was "I hate you" - so I put soap in her mouth, then she spit it out and yelled "I still hate you!". I've never hit her before but that got her a slap on the face. Then this morning, I caught her flipping me off. She has so much anger and just explodes with rage. She has no respect for me or her dad (my ex husband, we're divorced.) I just feel like a failure and am totally at the end of my rope. My ex tries to be supportive, but he's an idiot. I told him all about it today and told him "make sure you call her tonight" but did he ever call, of course not.

She is doing great in school academically, she's in first grade but performs at a 2nd grade (if not higher) level - very artistic and creative too. She is very mature for her age. However, her school behavior is horrible. She is always getting her name on the board, yelling at classmates when the "annoy her". I'm afraid she's going to lose the few friends she has. She does great for a few days - then she earns 25 cents for every day she goes without getting her name on the board, and that seems to motivate her. She can be the sweetest thing EVER, but then other times she's a beast.

I'm nervous about this appointment on Tuesday. I don't know what to expect. What do they normally do after they score the tests? Counseling? Medication? Alternatives? It's mind boggling. Thanks for listening.

hello and welcome aboard. the doctor may send your daughter to maybe psyctrist or maybe a behavior developmental ped. for further testing. for i'm guessing this is your regular ped. but one thing that just sticks in my mind when i read you post is its sort of like she has some anger and i couldn't help wondering how long yall was divorced and if their is some tension involved in the divorce. divorce is hard on kids and it can effect them in different ways even in behavior. since i see that money motiviates her i would check out the marble reward system at the top of the forum it works great if implemented correctly. it rewards postive behavior. and thats exactly what makes it so successful even if its just using manners, brushing teeth, picking up. always getting into trouble causes negative attitude. always praising causes positive attitude. for her sake you and your ex try to be a least friends at least around her for it will help her in the long run, i know its hard but hang in there. it gets easier once you get some answers. good luck and keep posting

I have had same issue in regard to that "I hate you". Even if it is hard, the best approach I have been told about is to ignore it. Once she sees that you are not affected by this comment she will just stop it.

When it happened to me I usually got very affected and heartbroken. Now, I try to stand as a stone and ignore this completely. It is hard, but when I was reading your post I started to realize that it has been very long since my son does not tell me:" I hate you". I still need to work out my ds's behavior a lot, but at least in this one, he improved.

I hope you find my comment helpful. I also hope that you find your answers in that appointment.

Welcome. Keep coming here, you will learn a lot for sure.

Welcome.... I'd do your research before you decide on a plan of treatment.... lots of good info here. You can check out the Alternatives to Medication for more info non-medicine related.

Welcome to this very helpful place. Whatever the diagnosis, you will find alot of help here.

As lesnathan said, look at ogram's marble system (top sickied thread of this section of the forums). I has worked very well with my daugther.

Kids with ADHD tend to be about 30% behind thier peers in maturity and they need extra coaching on the proper behaviors than other kids thier age. I had to work with my daughter on what words to use when angry (I am angry not I want dad to die) and what the appropriate way to express anger was (not slam doors and yell and hit). There are threads on these issues as well.

Thanks everyone for the information and warm welcome. I'm going to do my best not to obsess about this until I meet with her ped. But at least I can gather some info here in the meantime to discuss with her at the appt.

Thanks again everyone.

Welcome to the board. Sorry you had to find us. Sounds like your dd has an issue with frustration tolerance. Have you read "The Explosive Child"? I think you'll find a copy in your library. That book was very enlightening for me. Also, she may need to be taught some coping skills for when she gets frustrated. Have you thought about counseling or a social skills group? I am in favor of counseling because I think the sooner you head off ODD before it becomes an entrenched habit, the better off you'll be. Maybe you can ask your school counselor about a social group. As for the "I hate you!" (I got that this morning), I either ignore it, or just say "But I LOVE you!" in the lightest voice possible.

welcome and know that you are not alone. this site has a wealth of knowledge and is very supportive...

read everything you can here...and decide with your pediatrician what the best route for your child/family is.

my dd is in 4th grade and was doing very well academically until now. i'm told it often is *seen* in girls in 3rd or 4th grade when the academics get tougher. that was the case for us! our dd doesn't get in trouble for behavior issues at school, or i'm sure she would have been *flagged* earlier.

everyone's situation is different...read and read, listen to your pediatrician's suggestions and come up with a starting game plan. some have had success with diet changes and alternatives, you might want to start with that. we did..but had no luck with that and now are trying our second type of stimulant since thanksgiving break. this is a journey i'm told...try and take care of yourself thru this too! it's hard to not get consumed at first, i know that i did. anyways...there is lots of support here...keep us posted!

shelley

I would not recommend an evaluation done by a pediatrician using Conner's Rating forms. Unless it's a Behavioral Pediatrician, and other diagnostic tools are being incorporated. Lots of things look like ADHD, but are not. That method of dx makes no attempt to flush that out. If you don't get the right dx, it's hard to determine the correct treament.meli...Im sorry medication didn't work for your child and if your looking for alternative treatments, our alternative board is the best place to post. Many members that post here have done years of research, not hours and please keep in mind that when you research information on the Internet, not only consider the information but also the source of information. We welcome opinions and we all share our experiences but passing along information that is either inaccurate or not a proven fact can hinder the decision making process for parents because they may make decisions about treatment based on fear rather than accurate information. There are many members that have had great success with alternatives as well as members who have had great success with ADHD medications and any medication whether it be pharmaceutical medications or alternative medications can be harmful if they are abused, no taken as prescribed or not taken without medical clearance to do so. Not everyone responds well to stimulant medication and there are many reasons one might be non responsive. Unfortunately, there is no cure for ADHD to date, only treatments to manage the symptoms. Hopefully, one day there will be a cure but until that happens, we all are here with the same goal and that is to help our children achieve quality of life. The right answers are different for everyone but data that has proven to be true should be explored by parents instead of immediately written off due to something they read that creates fear within them thus stifles their ability to make an unbiased decision. Good luck in your search for answers

Chaesesmom79,

I'm sorry you had to go through what you did with your daughter! I was a very tough decision to not give my child medication! I hope that by doing this I will be helping every one else with alternitve ways to treat the ADHD cause there for eliminating the symptoms! We need people willing to go through these treatments to find ones that work! I don't mean to make people... How you said use a scare tactic to make people not go the medication rought, Rather to just exspress my feelings I had with them! I will have to chose my words more carefully or just explain my self more clearly in the future! The side effects my son exsperienced were not manageable to me! Maybe they were to you. Every one is diffrent!

One question I had for you. Did you look at the web sites I left on my last Post for you? I was also curious what YOUR OPINION is on these findings!

If you don't want to that is just fine with me!

Good Luck in all you do!

I looked into the web sites. The lab assays are not proven as diagnostic in the manner they are being used (I am a licenced clinical laboratory scientist and used to evaluated assays for clinical utility). The site was sent a warning letter from the FDA for making unsubstantiated claims for the supplements, so they changed the site to make it more compliant with the regs and add the disclaimer that these supplements are not intended to treat disease...

http://www.casewatch.org/fdawarning/prod/2005/neuroresearch. shtml

The methods may some day be shown to be useful, but first they would have to do clinical trials to prove the clinical utility of the methods.

vickie39100.4809027778meli -- i just wanted to mention that the black label on the ADHD meds was recommended by an FDA committee in 2/06, but was rejected by the FDA. In 8/06, the FDA implemented a warning on stimulant ADHD meds (not a black label), which says that the meds are not recommended for people with high blood pressure and structural abnormalities of the heart. [QUOTE=meli]

S Marie,

My 8 year is ADHD and very hard to manage and has anger issues also. I'm not sure what to do. Medication is a nasty thing to deal with. We went down that road and it was horrible. So now hes on nothing agian. Now we are tring amino acids and fish oil supplements so far the third day but yesterday his teacher said his morning was lots calmer! as for a disiplin we are tring 123 magic you can check out at the library. Its going ok but only been a few days. I'm intrested in that marble system I'm going to see what the hubby thinks! as for the I hate you. I sure have hurd my share of name calling. It sure pushes my button. with the 123 magic they say what to do so the name calling is lessining as the days go by. My son is one of the imidiate testers so its gonna be a bumpy ride, as it sounds like yours is too. The book seems like it was a good choice. I hope this was help full If you want more info on the suplements let me know. I feel your pain, you'll be in my prayers!!

[/QUOTE]

Meli, would you ever have him reevaluated for maybe "something else" in addition to adhd, like bipolar? If you treat the adhd with meds, but not the bipolar, the meds. for adhd make the bipolar worse. Just trying to like of anything that might be going on. YOu may want to start over with the evaluation process as well so that you can better help him!

My son is very impulsive so the guanfacine helps him with that daily. And again, the psychopharmacologist introduced us to that! It breaks my heart to see these kids disciplined when they cannot control it. You need to find your son the right medication and dosage, as well as make sure he has the correct diagnosis!

Beth

Sherri

That is wonderful!! I too tried discipline, supplements and diet before moving on to meds. It was a 2 year ordeal with cooperation between me and the teachers, not one of whom ever brought up ADHD, not once. We instituted positive behavior plans, daily reports on behavior/homework, etc. Nothing worked for long. You must know that my son is gifted, and had no 'grade' issues until 3rd grade. He was smart enough that his grades weren't affected, so I said,"oh well, I will let it go,his grades are fine..." Then the A's and B's became C's and D's from a child that tested on the yearly proficiencies in the gifted range, and I sat up and took notice! He also began to suffer in his self esteem, saying to me daily, "Mom, I don't know why you think I am smart, I am too dumb to learn anything!" That broke my heart.

I agree that 4 is very young to medicate as well, and I probably would have done the same as you. It must also be said that many behaviors due to allergy and discipline concerns are misdiagnosed as ADHD...especially the hyperactive kind. My son was never much of a behavior problem, just inattentive and non focusing.

I am happy that changing your discipline style seems to be doing the trick for you, it did not for me.

Just know that if and when you decide to medicate if necessary, there is no need to be frightened off by horror stories...there are countless more success stories and my son is one of them, he will tell you so himself.

=Sherri]meli told me about the 123 magic book last night I bought the book this morning read the book and applied the principals of the book tonight. We had a wonderful night, only one night but that is very rare in my life so I am thankful for tonight. As for meds I have never tried them and can't give any opinion on them. I am reluctant to try them before I have made sure that every other medical possibility is addressed. I have taken my son to an allergist and found out that he is allergic to many many foods which I have eliminated from his diet. His father is diabetic and we are monitoring him for hyper and hypo glycemia. I am hoping that all of his behavior problems can be addressed without meds if not I will medicate. My son is only 4 1/2 and is not in kindergarten. Have you contacted the school district to get the school psychologist involved? That helped me some but they really push meds. I have declined there requests to medicate so far but every situation is different and I am thankful for the help they have given me. I am not as knowledgable as the other senior members on this site, this is just my situation to date.[/QUOTE]

meli told me about the 123 magic book last night I bought the book this morning read the book and applied the principals of the book tonight. We had a wonderful night, only one night but that is very rare in my life so I am thankful for tonight. As for meds I have never tried them and can't give any opinion on them. I am reluctant to try them before I have made sure that every other medical possibility is addressed. I have taken my son to an allergist and found out that he is allergic to many many foods which I have eliminated from his diet. His father is diabetic and we are monitoring him for hyper and hypo glycemia. I am hoping that all of his behavior problems can be addressed without meds if not I will medicate. My son is only 4 1/2 and is not in kindergarten. Have you contacted the school district to get the school psychologist involved? That helped me some but they really push meds. I have declined there requests to medicate so far but every situation is different and I am thankful for the help they have given me. I am not as knowledgable as the other senior members on this site, this is just my situation to date.

S Marie,

meli

With all due respect, medication is not "a nasty thing to deal with" for everybody. Yes there are side effects, but the same can be said of natural supplements if they are overdone, or the quality is not consistent, which can be a problem since they are not regulated like pharmaceutical medicines are.

I am sorry that you did not find one that helped your son, but that is not the case with every child/adult that tries meds to help their ADHD. Some children (like my son) have complete and utter success once being diagnosed and treated with the correct med and dosage. He went from struggling to maintain a C average and focus in class, to being on honor roll for the 3 grading periods since meds were started. He never was on honor roll before. He is calmer, more self assured and happy. Before the meds, his self esteem was in the basement, he thought that he was " too stupid to learn anything" ( which made him sad and withdrawn) even though he tested into the gifted range. Now he strives for all A's and usually gets them. He was 4th in his school spelling bee last week....before meds, he couldn't keep up with the teacher as she orally gave the words on test day, so he failed his spelling tests.

It is fine for you to relate your experience with ADHD meds, but please do not paint all children with the negative experience that you endured...each person's brain chemistry is different and will respond differently to the meds. Mine is not the only success story here, there are many.

I am also glad that you are having success with the supplements, but you must keep in mind that most of the time they take weeks to have an effect.

I am glad that your son had a good day in school, but so did mine premed from time to time....

chasesmom7939095.7647916667[QUOTE=Sherri]

Bethann, Can you tell me what is a psychopharmacologist?

Sherri

[/QUOTE]

A psychopharmacologist is a medication specialist, also a psychiatrist, who knows all the meds for people with mental health disorders. He prescribes medications, also counsels, as a psychiatrist will do. Mine works for us because he knows how to mix and match meds. to the persons symptoms. Every one is different, no two are alike with our chemical makeup.

You can tell him what is happening and he works his knowledge with medication and knows which one to try. He also knows when to move to a different one, add something to the mix, or just up the dosage. He knows what every medication is for, a world of knowledge! I told him my son wasn't eating with the concerta, so he told me he could prescribe a med. that would give him an appetite while he was also taking concerta. So many parents discuss the weight loss, well there is a med. that the children can take while on the ADHD med. to increase their appetite. Again, he is a wealth of knowledge!

I like using him because my son is young, now 9, but we started with this doctor when he had just turned 7.

My pediatrician referred us to him, however, he doesn't take insurance so we pay out of pocket. I think it is worth it!

Hope this helps!

Beth

Bethann, Can you tell me what is a psychopharmacologist?

Sherri

When I use to scream "I hate you!" at my mom, she'd just give me a real bland look and say, "sometimes I don't like you very much, either." I stopped saying it to her because it didn't get a rise out of her. Just a suggestion. That is exactly the method that I used on my children when they ech went thtough that stage....except that I added "But I always love you!"

Chases mom79,

It is my opinion that any medication is nasty to deal with. I am intitled to my opinion. I feel this way due to my experinces, so Ive been trough the nasty I'm refering to.

Thats grate that you and you son have sucess from the meds but I did hours of reasherch on the meds and all they do is cover up the symptoms of ADHD they are not a cure!

How they affect the brain is actually causeing a depletion of neurotransmitters. You should look into this!

If medication is used they say you need to replace the depleated neurotransmitters. Thats why doses have to be rasied after time!

Medication did work for my son! The sideefects Headaches, weight loss, muscel twitches, could'nt sleep, would'nt eat ect... It did not seem worth it to me! Exspecally scence the FDA black Labled all ADHD medicaton and gives suicded, Heart falier, stroke and sudden death as side effects! WOW scary thought!

I guess by saying all this to you I want you to know where I'm comming from and hope this helps you understand why I don't like meds! No hard fellings I hope!

I will keep your son and family in my prayers!

I hope that I don't affend you because that is not my goal.

My goal is to just share what I have exspereinced in hopes some one gets help for what I went through!

Luvmykids0239100.6058564815

Bethann,

I have wondered about having him evaluated again but we are between insurances right now! Do you have any suggestions besides the pediatrition for a dx?

The meds did what they were soppose to do, so I know that its not bipolor. I was curious about Sensory Prossing disorder!

He has beed evaluated by a pediatric behaviorl theripst. She said it was definitly ADHD!

Any Ideas I'd love to hear them! Thanks!

meli

If you had comprehended my post (which you obviously didn't) I told you that you were entitled to post your experience with meds, but to not try to persuade a parent new to the ADHD experience to not even try meds through your scare tactics. My son has some side effects of the meds, that is true, but they are not debilitating. They are very manageable and the side effects of not treating are far worse. The sudden death that you are referring to happened to children that had heart defects/anomalies that were not uncovered before the meds were used. And if you had researched ADHD thoroughly, you surely would have found that suicide is a side effect of UNtreated ADHD as well. My oldest daughter tried to kill herself in high school because her self esteem that plummeted due to her untreated ADHD. I am unwilling to take that chance with my son. There are also many studies that show that teens with untreated ADHD often resort to llegal drugs in a subconcious attempt to "self medicate". There are even studies out there that say that the abscence of dopamine (the chemical imbalance that creates ADHD) if left untreated, could lead to Parkinson's Disease later in life.

I, too, have done my research. But I looked at ALL the research, not just what validated my opinion....because I also was initially very against giving my son a daily drug.

I am not sure how many meds you tried with your son, but I am certain that had you tried more of them, you would surely have been able to find one that had fewer side effects. I in no way want to tell you not to go the natural route and good luck. The meds used to treat ADHD have been researched for longer than you or I have been alive. If there were so many "sudden deaths" that were definitely attributed to them, they would not be prescribed to our children. It is an emotional hot button and there are plenty of quacks out there publishing half truths to scare loving parents.

So go ahead and do what you want to for your son, and let us do what we want....do not try to sway anyone in your direction...each child is different, many take the drugs with no unwanted side effects....they just usually aren't posting here, they are off enjoying their happy, healthy children.