lying behavior | ADHD Information
I read it in Hallowell's Answers to Distraction book. I have it in front of me, page 281!!
[QUOTE=Mom2ADHDboy]Very interesting, Diane. Did you read this in an article or on a webpage? I'd love to pass along this info. to the school. They get so upset with DS for lying. If they understood better where it was coming from, they'd probably be more understanding of his fabrications.[/QUOTE]
You would hope so, but my son's teachers know my son has emotional problems and they still get upset with him over certain behaviors that they should know are because of his problems.
This is a difficult topic. I see the tendency toward lying in my son who is only seven. Although I understand his motivations (embarassment, denial, etc.) I still feel that as a parent I must discourage this behavior. If not, the next lies will be for more substantial reasons. Expecting the school to condone the lying would be doing a dis-service to our kids. They must learn to follow the rules of the society in which they live and we must avoid the temptation to make excuses for them. Don't want to let thier ADHD become a crutch for bad behavior.
No one is saying to condone it. It is just sort of explaining where the behavior comes from and that it is not malicious. Believe me at clsoe to thirteen my daughter just outright blatantly lies about stuff, that is different. I am talking about stuff that there is no reason to lie about. I can tell the difference, but an outsider just says lying is JUST wrong. I was just relieved to see there is an explanation of why some of this happens. Their solution was to explain to help them get past the being embarassed about missing the social pieces and trying to cover that up.
I also do not feel using ADHD is an excuse for bad behavior, but in most instances there are ways to deal with this stuff that doesnt work for the typical child. It IS happening because of her lack of focus. Saying she did her homework when she didn't doesnt count.
We had a long thread recently on lying. The fact that our mostly pre adolescents and teens were just blatanly lying about stupid things and everything from washing their face to what happened at school that day. I couldnt find it which is why I'm starting over .
I just read something where ADHD kids will quite often just make things up or say anything. Not only do they do this to get out of trouble (all kids do this), but because of their lack of focus and missing so much that goes on around them , they fill in the details in their head themselves. Then they are too embarassed to say they dont know or missed it so they just make stuff up or repeat their made up details.......now it's a lie.
This is my daughter to a TEE!!! I can tell she has NO CLUE and just makes stuff up. She does it all the time. Even something that doesnt involve her AT all.
Our newest thing is her friends are trying to get a group together to go an amusement park with a chaperoned group with the parks dept. I told her she had to be going with friends I knew and I called the chaperones to find out what the deal was. She says "my friend is going and both her parents are coming and they will drive me home." None of this was true. Her friend wanted to go and was going to ask if she could go. My daughter couldn't follow the plans so she filled in the rest. I really don't think she was trying to sneak, just had no clue! Boy, how do we fix that!
Heartbreaking, it all comes back to focus for us and she can't take stimulants.................
.
Diane - Yes, that is my son too. Well, at least the lying isn't because our kids are bad.
My son's 5th grade teachers said that if he spent as much time making up stories and excuses on his work, he'd be an A student.
Very interesting, Diane. Did you read this in an article or on a webpage? I'd love to pass along this info. to the school. They get so upset with DS for lying. If they understood better where it was coming from, they'd probably be more understanding of his fabrications.
Metisrebel- That's an interesting theory. I think I'll start jotting down the "stories" he tells and see if I can see patterns in them. He seems to prefer making up information rather than asking if he doesn't know something- like if his friends are talking about a tv show that he's never seen and knows nothing about he'll just act like he knows about it and make up stuff that he "saw" on that show once. The problem is, that as he gets older his friends are going to catch on to it.
The other reason I worry is because his biological father was still telling "stories" in his early 20's (probably still is). He (my ex) used to tell people that he was a Marine (he got kicked out of boot camp, but not until a year after he started telling people stories from his "days in the Marines"), that he was a narc for the local police dept., I could go on and on. My son's neuropsych said I'd descibed a sociopath when he was taking the history. There's always a little corner of my mind that wonders if this could be some genetic thing my son's inherited, although the logical part of my mind tells me that's a rediculous thing to think.
Of course, sometimes I just think my brain doesn't function properly unless it has something to worry about. I guess I got the right kid then. 
The funny part is, when I started to say that A LOT in meetings--you'd be amazed at how many people came up to me afterwards and said, "I had NO IDEA what they were on about either but I was too embarrassed to say it!"
If you can get DD to just SAY it I think she'll be surprised as she gets older how much others, who are also struggling are happy to have it repeated, too.
And the amount of bullspit spewed as truth in this world that makes no logical sense when you take it apart is truly amazin'.
I often say, "Look, I'm a simple person. SPEAK ENGLISH not babble"
After I wrote this I edited because I thought of an idea for your DD.
Can you teach her to re-frame the statements? [So what you're telling me is....] First off, it will look like she's really bright and paying attention. And, if she has it wrong it can be corrected BEFORE she gets into trouble....
MetisRebel39247.6764467593
It seems there is no benefit nor are they doing it FOR benefit. It has become such habit of just creating these facts they start to just do it.
That Karate story is pretty good . It would make me CRAZY if I was the mother, but pretty funny from this side! Sorry, hope that didnt offend you, but you gotta love it. One free Karate class and he's going for his black belt .
I totally understand what your saying Diane- it gets embarrasing to always have no clue, or be missing big chunks of info because you minds wanders. Making up stuff to "fill in the blanks" seems like a good idea at the time.
My problem is when my son lies for no reason. And I don't mean about doing chores or homework (or even filling in gaps)- I know how to handle it when he's lying to get out of trouble or to avoid an unpleasant task or situation. What I don't know how to handle are the blatantly false stories he tells people. One day he told my SIL that he is in karate class, gave lots of details, told her what color belt he was, and what color belt he'd get next, the whole nine yards. The truth was that he attended one free class to see if he liked it before he enrolled, and he hated it- it moved to fast for him to remember what he was supposed to do.
Then the other day in the car he asked me who Bill Cosby was. I told him he was a comedian (and then had to explain what a comedian is) and that he used to have a tv show. Then I remembered seeing that the reruns still play on one of the kids channels that he watches, so I told him that and that maybe he'd even seen it before. So he proceeds to tell me that, no the Cosby Show's not on anymore, that the last show was on yesterday because no one likes Bill Cosby anymore. My reply was that how could he possible know that when two minutes ago he didn't even know who this person was.
I call him on it every time- tell him I know he's lying and why I know it's a lie. What I can't figure out is a reason for it. There doesn't seem to be any benefit to him for make this stuff up.
[QUOTE=jaderock54]I totally understand what your saying Diane- it gets embarrasing to always have no clue, or be missing big chunks of info because you minds wanders. Making up stuff to "fill in the blanks" seems like a good idea at the time.
My problem is when my son lies for no reason. And I don't mean about doing chores or homework (or even filling in gaps)- I know how to handle it when he's lying to get out of trouble or to avoid an unpleasant task or situation. What I don't know how to handle are the blatantly false stories he tells people. One day he told my SIL that he is in karate class, gave lots of details, told her what color belt he was, and what color belt he'd get next, the whole nine yards. The truth was that he attended one free class to see if he liked it before he enrolled, and he hated it- it moved to fast for him to remember what he was supposed to do.
Then the other day in the car he asked me who Bill Cosby was. I told him he was a comedian (and then had to explain what a comedian is) and that he used to have a tv show. Then I remembered seeing that the reruns still play on one of the kids channels that he watches, so I told him that and that maybe he'd even seen it before. So he proceeds to tell me that, no the Cosby Show's not on anymore, that the last show was on yesterday because no one likes Bill Cosby anymore. My reply was that how could he possible know that when two minutes ago he didn't even know who this person was.
I call him on it every time- tell him I know he's lying and why I know it's a lie. What I can't figure out is a reason for it. There doesn't seem to be any benefit to him for make this stuff up.
[/QUOTE]Hmmmm
A simple opinion just because this is what it looks like...
ADHD'ers tend to see patterns or gestalts--not isolated facts/incidents.
It sounds like your son is putting together the patterns [a+b+c=D] but due to age, lack of experience and missing a few bits--the pattern is not accurate. He may not be fabricating--he may be concluding the patterns inaccurately.
The other piece I see is that because he doesn't either understand or believe that other people will respect his intelligently putting the pattern together he makes up or exaggerates HOW he got the information [he went to karate class as opposed to he has learned how a dojo operates] so they will take him seriously.
I can actually SEE the Bill Cosby pattern.
DS does not remember who Bill Cosby is but he remembers the name. You tell him. Bill Cosby no longer has that show. Therefore, since TV shows only stay on the air based on popularity--nobody likes Bill Cosby anymore.
[somehow he does not remember much about Bill Cosby but he can't explain what he DOES remember, that the show was cancelled. He doesn't remember WHERE he got that information, only that he HAS it. Inside his head are millions of bits of trivia that float around forming rebuses]
If you think about it--his basic facts about Cosby are true [show cancelled] and how a karate dojo works is also accurate. So, the patterns are reasonably accurate.
His conclusions are inaccurate. "Nobody likes Cosby" and "I have this belt and can get that belt."
As he ages and takes in MORE information/facts--his ability to see the correct conclusion may increase.
Anyway, that's what it looks like to me....
MetisRebel39247.667337963
I agree. My son makes up stories because he is embarrased about something - usually something school related. He doesn't tell malicious lies.
He has been known to make up stories to try to explain a bad behavior and when we try to get to the bottom of it, he can't keep up the lying so he just kind of explodes.
We take each story one at a time and decide how to handle it. We don't condone lying and he is not allowed to get away with it. If he is lying to teachers and acting defiant and rude, we take away his computer game - the only thing at the moment he cares about.
Here is an example of a story that I know he made up because he was hiding something in school. Part of his 504 plan is that I communicate with the teachers through notes, e-mails, etc.
Well, over the past month we have been communicating a lot because my son has just decided to not do his work (for whatever reason.)
One night, as I was talking to my son about making up his work, and that I had to check all his work and that I had to send another note to his teachers about making up work, etc. etc. he says to me," my teacher said she is tired of your notes and the teachers don't want anymore notes"
Well, we know that is not true since by law, the teachers have to follow the 504. I, ofcourse, verified that this was never said. However, I did not get all bent out of shape because I knew why he said that. I just continued sending notes.
He has lied about hanging up his clothes and then I find them rolled up in a ball behind his bed. You got to laugh - he tap dances around and just doesn't understand how they got there because he swears he hung them up.
Too funny, we get those lies too.
I am not talking about that stuff though. I am talking about her missing the social cues or so much of conversations she just creates her own scenario of what took place in her head rather than say she didnt understand, or maybe her head i always missing such big chunks of whats happening she doesnt even realize, so she just says....................whatever..............half the time it doesnt make any sense. It's not really lying. I might say hwo did you eat lunch with today.....she has NO clue who was at the table expet her and her best friend, so instead of admitting she paid no attention to other kids she just says "so and so" and "so and so", like that. Then if I say, well "so and so" was not in school today, she says "Ohhhhhhh, yeah I forgot".