Sudafed: An inexpensive solution? | ADHD Information
I unknowingly self-medicated my ADHD with Sudafed, Caffeine and Nicotine for years before I was diagnosed. Let me first explain... I was not taking sudafed as an ADHD Med. I have a birth defect called Cleft Lip/Cleft Palate and from that I have had total inner ear reconstructive surgery as a child. I have chronic ear infections/sinus infections and my ENT told me to take Sudafed daily. Well... I only took it daily for about a month or so after surgery. Since then I'd only take it when my ear or sinus infection acted up. However, I did notice when I took it.. after a couple of doses I was more productive.. then add in my caffeine (I lived on Diet Mt. Dew) and smoked and man I was a working machine! But... I could not handle taking Sudafed for more than a couple of days for sinus problems because it would cause such terrible insomnia.Now that I've finally been diagnosed and on proper ADHD medications... I don't take Sudafed, and can't drink much caffeine anymore. I've stopped smoking 2 years ago.
[QUOTE=Call_me_Lynn]Katastrophee, do you know if there is a way to avoid the medication rebound?
The only way that I really know of is to take a smaller dose of the same med about an hour before it wears off. In other words, if you take Concerta 54mg in the morning and it usually wears off around 5pm - take 5-10mg of short-acting methylphenidate at about 4pm. It just helps that sudden drop of effect come down more smoothly. I think people who take short-acting forms of stimulants have a harder time since they have a shorter duration of effect. When I started methylphenidate I was taking 5-15mg at 7am, 11am and around 2:30pm. Apparently the crash at the end of the day can really be ugly. I was OK, but I was not taking a massive dose. I also MAY? not be as affected because I also take Wellbutrin. Wellbutrin is an antidepressant that affects dopamine and it works around the clock. It could be that the effect of the Wellbutrin on dopamine/norepinephrine keeps me from having ugly rebound when the Concerta wears off....?
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[QUOTE=katastrophee]I also MAY? not be as affected because I also take Wellbutrin. Wellbutrin is an antidepressant that affects dopamine and it works around the clock. It could be that the effect of the Wellbutrin on dopamine/norepinephrine keeps me from having ugly rebound when the Concerta wears off....? [/QUOTE]Thanks, katastrophee!
I am considering looking into some of the anti-depressants that help control impulsive/compulsive/obsessive behaviors in people with ADD. Maybe that would help me with the "rebounding" as well. Also, I have noticed that when I start off the day with 5mg of Ritalin instead of 10mg, I do not experience the same "crashing" throughout the day.
[QUOTE=Call_me_Lynn]
Thanks, katastrophee!
I am considering looking into some of the anti-depressants that help control impulsive/compulsive/obsessive behaviors in people with ADD. Maybe that would help me with the "rebounding" as well. Also, I have noticed that when I start off the day with 5mg of Ritalin instead of 10mg, I do not experience the same "crashing" throughout the day.
I LOVE Wellbutrin. By itself it was not enough to fully manage my ADHD symptoms, but it helped me a LOT. My doc thought I needed a dopamine boost because I have always been somewhat of a lethargic slug. I could sleep 24 hours a day if I wanted to and it always seemed like I could never get enough sleep. I have been like this for as long as I can remember.
Wellbutrin was also a Godsend for my impulsivity. It is used commonly in people who are trying to quit smoking and I believe it is undergoing trials as a weight loss med as well. I did have appetite supression initially although that went away over time. What did NOT go away was the obliteration of impulse eating. I have a tendency to get carried away with cravings and now I don't have a problem with it anymore. It has given me the ability to diet without constantly battling myself to stay "good". I feel like when I get to my goal, I will be able to stay there. That has never happened before. I have always put weight back on after dieting.
The nice thing about Wellbutrin is that you do get an immediate effect unlike most antidepressants. It will take 4 weeks or so to get to peak effect, but on day one I noticed a difference. I did not have major side effects although it can trigger anxiety and irritability and elevate blood pressure. It is also a big no-no if you have a personal history of seizures or seizure disorder in your family.
Soooo, as you can tell, I m a big fan....
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Thanks, again!
Yes sudafed has the ability to clear the head, and allow you to do somethings different. especially us adhd ers. but it only works ONCE IN A WHILE, and not an everyday thing. I noticed it years ago. but I stopped taking it because it didn't stop the scramble of things in my head.
maybe you need to have a sleep study done...
Good question: "Is it possible to be a consumer these days - without being an educated - intelligent consumer?" However, I wonder, more specifically, if it's possible to have ADD and not be a drug research analyst.
Reflecting on your points, I find it disturbing that those of us with this condition are left to muddle through an endless labyrinth of connected dots. It feels like we are lab rats and someone has hidden the cheese. Too many paths in the maze end short. We know there is a hidden door leading to more answers, but the Doctor is out. We are left to sniff and search out the door ourselves.
It is frustrating that family practitioners seem to know painfully little about this ailment, yet prescribe meds like candy, usually with no ongoing support: "Take a 27 mg Concerta and let's see what happens." If that doesn't work, we take Ritalin in 8 different forms. None of those work, so we are prescribed Strattera. That doesn't work, so we begin Adderall in all it's varieties. On the way, we realize that we feel more "clear-headed" on Sudafed or some other med that lacks the severe side effects of a "cleaner drug." Are you as confused as I am? (And I don't think it's because of the ADD!)
Too much guesswork! Not enough science! Not enough information or support!
Sudafed doesnt work all that well for me ADD wise. I cant comment really but I can say that phenylalanine with a small amount of b complex is AWESOME for ADD I am not sure sure about ADHD. IT helps replenish the brains supply of neurotransmitters that dont work correctly. Please do some research before you take any supplements. Your mileage may vary.
... currently checking this molecule out - after a similar thread on one of the other ADHD Internet forums implicated pseudoephedrine *exactly* as here - as therapeutic reagent for ADHD.
I have experienced similar effects (fog lifting) - not with sudafed - but actifed - and as a kid.
Back then - actifed was the stronger of the two and it was a strictly prescription-only med.
(The formulation for actifed was changed (relatively) recently - more in wikiP under 'actifed' for details on the switch.)
I think that the key to understanding what's going on here - will be to look at the racemic mixture within adderall
- the single stereoisomer which is present within dexedrine -> and then to align these against the isomers of ephedrine and pseudoephedrine - which appear to mimic the function of dexedrine and adderall.
I must admit that the idea of a precursor to meth being my regular anti-histamine as a kid - makes me wonder (particularly - about all of the many ridiculous excesses which we force ourselves to apply - in the 'name' of doing the right thing)
- when something real important like this goes unnoticed.
I'm also left wondering why a bigger deal hasn't been made about this in the media (something to do with law suits no doubt)
- and yet when a paltry improvement - barely a statistical blip is noted - by a company which has the patent for a *new* product - that we're saturated with information on it from every which way.
I'm really left wondering - is it possible to be a consumer these days - without being an educated - intelligent consumer?
- you know the deal - check out the science for ourselves - look for profit motive - work out whether the evidence for its benefits have been rigorously obtained.
Dunno'
- but I am sure that pseudoephedrine is operating similarly to dexedrine - as these are the two drugs (actifed and dexedrine) - which I know best.
:-)
SB_UK39360.581087963 [QUOTE=shinsetu_hito]Pseudoephedrine is chemically similar to methamphetamine although the biological effects are very different. Because of pseudoephedrine's use as a primary reagent in the manufacture of methamphetamine in illicit labs, USA federal law prohibits buying cold preparations containing pseudoephedrine in quantities greater than 3 packages in any 24-hour period.
Pseudoephedrine is a form of ephedrine (that was banned) However, add drugs are much "cleaner." But the funtion is the same.
[/QUOTE]*So so true I went to an all day training about drugs for my job. It is scary meth and what is out there. For clarification the training was for me to identify is someone is trying to cook drugs in their home or doing any kind of drugs.
I have found Sudafed to be an effective in treating my ADD symptoms. Before Sudafed, I had tried methylphenidate (M) in various forms and dosages over the course of 2 years. M was frustrating because it increasesed my heart rate; made sleep difficult (both getting to sleep and waking up were harder); and gave me feeling of being drugged.
Sudafed (Psuedoephedrine) has none of the negative side effects of Ritalin, but increases my focus significantly. This year I began experimenting with Sudafed and cheaper store brands (Phenylephrine). Both provide the stimulant boost I need without negative side effects.
I've been using these regularly for 9 months (two 30mg tabs daily in the morning). I have not needed to increase the dose. I've spoken with two pharmacists to inquire of any known danger of long term/low dosages use of Sudafed. Both pharmacists said they knew of no risk.
I suspect that Sudafed and Phenylephrine work because they contain a form of Meth (the primary ingredient in Ritalin/methylphenidate), but in a delivery system that is easier on our bodies than the Ritalin rush.
I had noticed a similar feeling with claritin and sudafed. I had always thought that fuzzy headed can't think feeling was allergy related. I would take tylenol sinus and drink a pepsi and be good to go. [QUOTE=Thorns4Life]
I have tried takin stratera over a year ago, but stopped that after several months because it made me really nausea and dizzy. Don't know if I was on it long enough to notice an affect.
My doctor has offered to try me on Ritalin, but I hesitate. HOWEVER now that i am haveing what appears to be a "clear head" since I been taking the pseudophedrine, i want to consider it.
Dose anyone have any suggestions?
[/QUOTE]I was put on Straterra by my general practitioner doctor years ago. I took it for one week. I spent most of that week on the couch, foggy headed, sleepily watching TV. It was bad. A year and a half later, I finally got evaluated by a psychologist and medicated by a psychiatrist. She put me on Ritalin. Half an hour after taking the first pill I knew it was the thing for me. I've been on it for about three years now, and I am astounded by the results, especially when compared to my experience with Straterra. I would never go back to living my life the way I did before Ritalin, nor would I ever wish it on anyone else. I hope you will decide to give other ADD medications a try.
(Ha. I just realized how long ago the original question was posted [2005!]. Oh well, I guess it applies to anyone else reading with a similar dilemma. Also, I started Ritalin at one 5mg tablet, 4x a day [20mg total]. I have just increased to two 5mg tablet in the morning, and one 5mg tablet, 4x a day [30mg total]. I sometimes take more, if I have a longer day. I am also playing with the increase right now so it has been varying a bit.)
Call_me_Lynn39347.8600694444
Still taking Sudafed...
I also experienced the foggy, drugged-out feeling while taking Strattera. I found Ritalin insufficient because, after the Ritalin was used up, I was non-functional. In order to get moving again; to get something/anything done, I had to have more Ritalin. I didn't like being so dependant on it.
Biochemistry as I understand it: the reason Ritalin causes such a hard "crash" is because the Meth puts our bodies in "alarm mode." While in this mode, the Meth depletes our Dopamine supplies (apparently those of us with ADD have less Dopamine than others). These supplies are stored in vats in our brains and the vats control the release of Dopamine, so we can access it more readily in an emergency/crisis (Aha! That's why many of us with ADD are always so clear headed in crisis situations!).
Unfortunately, since Ritalin forces us into "alarm mode," it depletes these vats of the Dopamine and eliminates our ability to respond in a crisis (without more Ritalin). The worst case scenario is that we awake in the night to a fire in the house and can't function without our Ritalin "hit." Personally, I'd rather deal with the fire without wondering where my pills are.
I think the next step for me is to try Aderall. After Aderall is consumed, does it leave you non-functional like Ritalin?
[QUOTE=I TRI]
I found Ritalin insufficient because, after the Ritalin was used up, I was non-functional.
How long did you take Ritalin before you started feeling non-functional without it? Can you give some more examples of your experience with this?
Some of what you write sounds familiar. I take short-acting Ritalin. I think I haven't switched to long-lasting because I want to have control over when I put it in my system, possibly to avoid the non-functioning you're describing.
Ritalin left non-functional...
I have not had much experience with short acting Ritalin. I started with the long acting forms (Concerta and Ritalin LA). Concerta lasts about 14-16 hours and LA lasts 8 - 10. After these wore off, I felt very drained. It seemed like I had enough energy to watch TV but do little else. Additionally, I wasn't tired enough to sleep.
I also struggled with a peculiar short temper during the "wash out" stage (end of the day) with Ritalin and Concerta. I believe this is because methylphenidate puts our brains in "alarm mode" and purges essential brain chemicals from our brains (dopamine, adrenaline, and noradrenaline). Without these chemicals, we are left more vulnerable than we were before we consumed the drug. If we can time it perfectly, so that the vulnerable state hits when we can get to sleep, maybe we'd be all right. Unfortunately, after 2 years of experimenting, I never was able to get the timing down.
I am very curios to find out why drugs like Sudafed seem to work without the helpless, drained feeling after they are consumed. From my understanding, it's the Meth in Sudafed that makes it an effective stimulant (the same Meth that's in Methylphenidate). So why am I still clear headed and energetic at the end of the day after I take Sudafed?
[QUOTE=I TRI]So why am I still clear headed and energetic at the end of the day after I take Sudafed?
[/QUOTE]I notice the same "vulnerable" state when Ritalin wears off, but I didn't really experience that when I first started taking it. I've been on it for 3 years now. I noticed it more when I increased the dosage. Perhaps Sudafed would have that same affect after extended use. I bet we'd be hard-pressed to find a doctor who would recommend taking Sudafed every day for 3 years, though :)
[QUOTE=Call_me_Lynn]
I notice the same "vulnerable" state when Ritalin wears off, but I didn't really experience that when I first started taking it. I've been on it for 3 years now. I noticed it more when I increased the dosage. Perhaps Sudafed would have that same affect after extended use. I bet we'd be hard-pressed to find a doctor who would recommend taking Sudafed every day for 3 years, though :)
The "vulnerable state" is called rebound. It potentially gets worse as doses get higher and is typically more severe when taking short-acting stimulants than longer-acting ones. I do not know exactly what causes it (other than the stimulant wears off quickly and so the affected neurotransmitter levels drop - and each one at a different rate - causing irritability, depression, etc). It is very common and everyone responds differently. I have never had an issue with rebound on short or long acting methylphenidate but some people have an AWFUL time....
I never noticed that Sudafed helped my ADHD symptoms (just increased my blood pressure and heart rate). However, different people respond to each stimulant differently so I am sure it helps some people and not others - just like Adderall or Ritalin help some but not others.
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[QUOTE=floofthegoof]
That said, I *swear* that adderal cures my allergies.
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lol
Been there done that...hated it. I remembered the ADD from being a child when I was taking Metabolife...worked fine but the amount I had to take was unreal... Aderall works much much better and you know I haven't had a cold or sinus problem actually since I started with the Metabolife...lolWhen I was in my 20's and would go home to party with my older sister, we would take some Sudafed before we went out because it made us feel "better/normal" not drunk/weirded out. It gave me some energy to enjoy myself more. I didn't know then that I had ADD so I only associated that sense of "normal" with Sudafed and alcohol. I was scared that taking the Sudafed for any other reason than it's intended might lead to something "more dangerous or illegal" so I limited my use and eventually stopped totally. I am home in bed with a cold and have been using the Sudafed to clear me up... it's not working... not for the cold and not for the mind. I believe that what you are experiencing is real for you but I agree with the last post that you should check with a doctor about long-term use. You don't want to add something bad to an already "bad" situation. Good luck!
[QUOTE=dregan]Sudafed works great for clearing the sinuses but recently I have noticed that it also works great for clearing the head (It has pretty much the same effect on me as Stratterra but without the nausea and out of control heartbeat). I've tried looking for some info on using pseudoephedrine for ADHD on the internet but haven't come up with much. I have found that it is chemically similar to adderal but so far haven't heard of anyone using it long term for their ADHD. It works great for me and at .00 for a 24 pack its pretty cheap too.Has anyone else noticed this effect from Sudafed or know of a reason why it shouldn't be used?
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Which kind of Sudafed did you use? How many mg of pseudoephedrine were in it?
The main reason is you won't be able to use it long term. If you take sudafed everyday you will build up a tolerance and have to take more and more. Can't imagine taking a whole package of sudafed just to get through the day. Other cheap over the counter solutions work that way too. Caffiene works great for helping with ADHD symptoms but before long you need more and more just to get through the day.
Of course you'll need to up your dosage of prescribtion meds every once in awhile but no where near as much as you will have to increase OTC meds.
That said they do give you a nice boost. I'm currently on Adderall and sometimes I add caffeine to my diet when I'm having a tough day. Nicotiene works the same way (when I used to smoke) I would run for a cigarette when I would start losing focus to give me that extra push to get me back on track.
I've spoken with parents that used caffiene before finally turning to meds. The general consensus was the caffiene helped for about a year then it was no longer effective.
The problem with cold medicines is that you can't have them long term or they cause damage to organs. The medications designed for ADD were meant to be taken more long term.
I have been using caffeine since childhood. It makes me alert & able to accomplish more in one day, but doesn't fix the daydreaming. My mind wanders anyway. It does fix the foggy-headedness & allow quicker thinking. I have caffeine crashes a lot before it starts working again, though. 8(
Hi,
I too was searching the web for information on ADD and psudaphedrine... I have suspected that i have add for sometime now, but have not fully sought treatment. Any way... I started using som pseudophedrine for a cold last week, and have been so "clear" headed...my productivity and concentration at work have been wonderful and i have been able to keep my house organized.
My husband was the one that mentioned it to me that he wondered if it was the pseudopehdrine that was helping...I personally thought it was far fetched but, am hopeful.
I have tried takin stratera over a year ago, but stopped that after several months because it made me really nausea and dizzy. Don't know if I was on it long enough to notice an affect.
My doctor has offered to try me on Ritalin, but I hesitate. HOWEVER now that i am haveing what appears to be a "clear head" since I been taking the pseudophedrine, i want to consider it.
Dose anyone have any suggestions?
Thanks.
Sudafed works great for clearing the sinuses but recently I have noticed that it also works great for clearing the head (It has pretty much the same effect on me as Stratterra but without the nausea and out of control heartbeat). I've tried looking for some info on using pseudoephedrine for ADHD on the internet but haven't come up with much. I have found that it is chemically similar to adderal but so far haven't heard of anyone using it long term for their ADHD. It works great for me and at .00 for a 24 pack its pretty cheap too.Has anyone else noticed this effect from Sudafed or know of a reason why it shouldn't be used?
Your line of thinking is dangerous. Ask your psychiatrist about any long term medication or you'll end needing a liver transplant or something.
That said, I *swear* that adderal cures my allergies.
Yeah Strattera cures my sinusitis too! I wonder what the deal is with that.
Yup we all had a cold here lately - and my sons nose was the clearest on the dexamphetamine - I was jealous.
But did you know when on dexamphetamine (and probably all stimulant meds) you cant take cold and flu medication and some cough mixtures.
Before I put my daughter on Ritalin, I would give her Sudafed (generic of course) when she had a cold, before school. The teacher would later tell me that she had a "WONDERFULL" day. (My daughter that is. Well, probably the teacher too). She as right on task and very focused. The peds. doc said that it was a stimulant and had the same sort of effect as Ritalin.
Schwep
I do notice that sometimes when I take Zyrtec D it clears my head. It works better than concerta. Concerta makes me feel tired and zombie like. The psuedoephedrine makes me more alert and awake, but that is not what it's used for and there are probably adverse effects to using a decongestant daily.Pseudoephedrine is chemically similar to methamphetamine although the biological effects are very different. Because of pseudoephedrine's use as a primary reagent in the manufacture of methamphetamine in illicit labs, USA federal law prohibits buying cold preparations containing pseudoephedrine in quantities greater than 3 packages in any 24-hour period.
Pseudoephedrine is a form of ephedrine (that was banned) However, add drugs are much "cleaner." But the funtion is the same.
Here's my 2 cents. I'm not sure where you live, but I live in Oklahoma and with all the meth labs around here our state has really cracked down of over the counter meds that contain pseudophedrine. You have to sign in at the pharmacy to get it. I think you are able to still by something like 30 boxes per year(thats alot) but you also run the risk in this neck of the woods of getting arrested for alleged meth manufactering! (My pseudosister-in-law just went to fedral(SP) pen yesterday in Texas for 5 months for bring it across state lines). Yikes! -I don't think that would help with an ADD or ADHD problem. Point is... As meth becomes more of a problem I'm sure this will happen in other states, It might be cheaper in the short term, but like the others who have posted, the long term ramifications are probably more trouble than it's worth.
I have used Sudafed off and on for years for my allergies. I never noticed a difference. But you do build up a tolerance for the stuff. When I found it no longer worked to stop my nose from running like a faucet I switched to a Rx for Flonase (which has zero effect on ADHD). Thanks for all of your input. I am not planning on taking pseudophed for the ADD symptoms I have...I just thougt it was interesting that my husband pointed it out to me that it had a positive affect on my attentio, and because of it I searched the web to see if it was a coincindence or any truth to it. I would never consider doing this long term because of the health risks. Because others experience it I have now called my doctor to make an apt to see if she will go ahead and try me on Ritalin.
I have tried Stratera, but did not like the side effects. Since most of you have experience w/ this - what is the usual starting dose of ritalin and what are some effects, and expectations I should have?
I pray it is confirmed and works for me, because I would truely love to have an answer for why i do the things i do...or don't do, and then will have an idea where the root of the problem is which will help me deal with it better.
[QUOTE=JazzAngel]Been there done that...hated it. I remembered the ADD from being a child when I was taking Metabolife...worked fine but the amount I had to take was unreal... Aderall works much much better and you know I haven't had a cold or sinus problem actually since I started with the Metabolife...lol [/QUOTE]
Have you lost weight on your aderall?
I take Sudafed occasionally when I really really need to get stuff done. too much pseudoephedrine + too much caffeine + ritalin prescription + exhaustion + flu-like cold put me in the hospital my heartbeat was so fast so long. don't do it like that anyway. only time ever in 42 years in the hospital or emergency room.Can I make a confession please, while we are on this subject?
Ok, here goes: back in the day, if I REALLY needed to get something done at my job, I would take a Midol (y'know, for PMS)....MAN COULD I GET MY WORK DONE ON THOSE!!
and then, I started doing something dangerouse, right before I went to get help for my ad/hd...when I got like, really outta control with anger, I would take an allergy pill to make myself go to sleep. I always felt so much better when I woke up.
But I knew it was dangerous so I went to get help....I don't use none of that stuff no more.