My son is very bright, but missed being accepted into our schools gifted program by two percentage points on the group assessment (CogAT) given in 1st grade. In second grade he was diagnosed with ADHD and has responded well to medication. The next chance to be assessed for the gifted program comes up in about six weeks. I plan to request as an accomodation that he be tested invidually rather than in a group setting, as I really think that may have made the difference last time.
Meanwhile, our psychiatrist has asked us to have our son put through a complete neuropsych evaluation. That is scheduled for next week. I was hoping that the IQ test results from the exam might come back high enough to show those to the school when I ask for an accomodation on their gifted testing. But, I'm concerned because the doctor performing the neuropsych has asked that our son not be on his medication when he comes in. He doesn't believe it will affect our son's IQ score. I'm a little skeptical about this. Surely, being better able to sit still and concentrate will improve his score, right?
Any thoughts or suggestions?
Part of what the neuropsych tests for are attentional issue so they will be able to differentiate. The neuropsych will be on your side and can probably help you get this accomodation. Good luck!
My daughter missed the COGAT's by a few points also, We had her IQ tested as part of her full evaulation at school and her IQ tests was high enough they placed her in the gifted program. We now have a GIfted IEP and a 504 fo her ADHD. She LOVES the gifted class - plus there are only 4 kids in that class so that helps. Good Luck!
When I underwent neurpsyc testing the doc wanted just the opposite: I was on medication for the full roster of tests given the first day. Then I was asked to come back 4 days later, with no meds in my body, and re-take several of the tests. The difference in results made the whole thing much more interesting and revealing for the neuropsychologist doing the testing, which confirmed that yes, I did have adhd. Most interesting test results for me was the IQ stuff. Will your doctor be asking your child to come back for any testing on medication?
The doctor and the school are looking for different things. The doc is looking for the presence and extent of learning disorders and needs to see your son unmedicated. The school is looking to see how well your son will do in a gifted program and should see him at his full capability and be tested on meds. Unfortunately, the test can only be given once a year and be valid. If the doc feels the meds will nto make a difference, why does he insist on no meds?
My youngest scores higher with meds than without. It is because she actually does the "boring" parts on meds. Without them, she won't stay in her seat and need constant redirrecting.
vickie39296.6713425926I took my son to a private psychologist to have him tested and his school accepted the results. I am a teacher and I know that when they are tested in school it's not always done at good time. SOmetimes the psychologist comes in right before lunch, or right after p.e., or at the end of the day. You just never know. I sometimes think they rush also because their caseload is so heavy. Plus, doing it privately, I had the results in a report in one week and called the school and requested an IEP meeting. I took him to a psychologist first thing in the morning about an hour after his medication was given. He starts the gifted program in a few weeks (He'll be in Kindergarten)We had my son tested with medication, at the school. We wanted to see what his true IQ would be with out the behavior issues and distraction.
This has been interesting reading for me! My son was tested for learning disabilities in first grade. The testing was done because of concerns of the teacher in reading as well as his behavior in class. The testing included IQ testing. The results showed that he may have ADHD and that his IQ is high enough for gifted education. We ended up that year with a dual IEP for reading and behavioral support and gifted ed. Two months later in working with his PCP doctor ADHD was confirmed and we started him on Concerta a month before second grade began. This year was more smooth than last year, but in an effort to provide him with more support we are now working with a therapist to gain additional insight and strategies. I'm wondering now if we might have his I!Q tested again at some point to see how he does when on his meds. Some of the battery of tests they used showed lower scores than the therapist would have expected with a child of his IQ. Could it have been that he was bored and was tuning out? We are just beginning to realize that he does this - and it could be the reason homework is such a struggle.
This year's IEP for third grade is minimal in behavioral support, the reading support is now gone (he is now reading at a 5th grade level) and it mostly concentrates on the gifted ed.
I feel like I've just hit a gold mine of information! I can't wait to keep reading!
kstarspa139305.2718055556I have been told this will be one full day of testing, but there has been no mention of a return. The doctor performing the neuropsych said that the reason he does not want my son on medication is because he needs to get a "baseline."
But, if ADHD affects his ability to concentrate during an IQ test, isn't that a skewed result that doesn't adequately measure his "true" abilities?
I don't think you can take the same IQ test within two years and have the second result be considered valid. This is because when someone takes a test the second time, he or she always does better. So, if we wanted to know what his IQ score would be while on medications, we'd either have to administer a different test or wait two more years.
Thanks to everyone for giving me your thoughts!
[QUOTE=vickie]The doctor and the school are looking for different things. The doc is looking for the presence and extent of learning disorders and needs to see your son unmedicated. The school is looking to see how well your son will do in a gifted program and should see him at his full capability and be tested on meds. Unfortunately, the test can only be given once a year and be valid. If the doc feels the meds will nto make a difference, why does he insist on no meds?
My youngest scores higher with meds than without. It is because she actually does the "boring" parts on meds. Without them, she won't stay in her seat and need constant redirrecting.
[/QUOTE]
Vickie, thanks for your input! It is because we can only do an IQ test infrequently that I'm concerned about having him take an IQ test unmedicated. My son is very guilty of "skipping the boring parts" of things, so I think his score will be affected at least somewhat if he is not on his medication. The more I think about it the more I think the IQ test should be conducted on a different day, because I agree that the other tests they will perform need to be done without medication.
[QUOTE=2girls]My daughter missed the COGAT's by a few points also, We had her IQ tested as part of her full evaulation at school and her IQ tests was high enough they placed her in the gifted program. We now have a GIfted IEP and a 504 fo her ADHD. She LOVES the gifted class - plus there are only 4 kids in that class so that helps. Good Luck! [/QUOTE]
Glad to hear it worked out for you! Sadly, if our son does not score high enough on the CogAT, he cannot get in to our gifted program no matter what IQ score we bring them. Or at least, that's the written policy. This seems quite strange given that the CogAT is a group-administered abilities test, not an individualized IQ test, and probably isn't as accurate a measure.
We didn't know when he missed the CogAt score by two points that he had ADHD, or I would have asked for a retest on his own (and on medication). Live and learn. He'll be medicated and on his own this time and hopefully that will make all the difference.
I have a friend who used to be a lawyer with the DOE's Office of Civil Rights. She advised me to file a complaint with that office if the school refuses to give his CogAT test individually due to his ADHD diagnosis, which would trigger an investigation. Hopefully it won't come to that. I'd rather work with them than against them.
My son was tested by a psychologist while he was assessing him for ADHD. I can't remember what his exact number was but he scored average to below average. The Psychologist said not to show the school his test results because he would be dubbed special needs. After being on concerta for a few weeks the school gave him the same test (IQ) and he scored above agerage :-)Before his diagnosis, my son scored very well, in the 128 range. BUT, that was with a 100 score (smack dab average) in the math section which he didn't finish. The psychologist seemed to think he'd do significantly better in that area with meds, but we've never had him restested. Our school in our SMALL town barely makes its budget now, let alone with any gifted and talented classes, so it's really moot. We make sure to extend his lessons here at home, as well as making sure he has reading material at the top end of his lexile range. I'm jealous of you all with G&T programming!!
I'm so glad to have found this topic being discussed as we are