Desperate for help w/ my daughter | ADHD Information

My daughter is 5 1/2 years old and has been diagnosed w/ ADHD/ODD. She is on Vyvanse and while it helps her during the day, it doesn't help in the mornings or the evenings after it wears off. It takes her a good hour or two to "wind down" after taking her meds in the morning.

My problem has been with her waking in the middle of night acting like a freak! She will crawl into my 14 month old's crib, waking her up and everyone else in the house. I can put my baby back to sleep, but my daughter is awake for 2-3 hours at a time.

I'm exhausted. I have no idea how to handle her. I am so tired of being mad all the time. I dread being around her because she is so annoying.

She is scheduled to see a behavioral therapist next week, but honestly I have no idea how it's going to help her. I know that her meds need to be different or adjusted.

Anyone have kids they can't control? I feel like the world's worst mom right now because I don't know how to control this child. I am seriously at my wits end.

Melatonin for sleep,.33mgs to start and NO MORE than 2-3 mgs total.

Meds and behavior therapy go hand in hand, so it should help.

Trying the melatonin is a great idea, but you may need something from the doctor to keep her asleep all night. A lot of people use Clonidine or Tenex in conjunction with stimulants to ease that rebound you're seeing and help with sleep and hyperactivity in the mornings. Another option for early mornings is adding a small dose of fast acting stimulant as soon as she gets up. This takes effect generally within 20 minutes and you could give the Vyvanse on the way out the door. It will give you later coverage in the eveings too, I just may worry about sleep. Does she GO to sleep at bedtime then wake up?

Diane V39446.3659259259Do not give her anything for sleep unless you talk to the doctor first always be on the safe side.

I already tried the Melatonin bit and it put her to sleep great but it kept her awake almost all night. I gave her a very very very small dose of it and it just doesn't work for her. She does go to sleep at bedtime, but only if I lay with her until she falls asleep...other wise she will sit and get into things. I cannot leave her alone or out of my sight for one second! She is constantly getting into things that she is not supposed to and is destructive.

I just hope the therapist she sees on Jan. 8 will provide some hope for me on knowing how to handle her.

Thanks for your replies.

I don't know about a behavioral therapist helping with sleep issues. I would think that you'd want to go to your pediatrician and ask for a referral for a sleep study http://www.webmd.com/sleep-disorders/sleep-studies. Maybe there's an actual reason that she's waking up. And if there's not, I'd think that you'd have to medicate for sleep.

NoTellin39449.3966319444[QUOTE=NoTellin]

I'm not sure what you mean about not being able to leave her alone for one second .... a LOT of 3 & 4 year olds are like this .... and unmedicated ADHD children are up to 30% behind in maturity than their peers. So this may be normal. As far as getting into things and being destructive -- I've seen a lot of young ones like this, and again an ADHD child is running behind in the maturity department. For a lot of this stuff, you just have to wait for them to outgrow it.

In the meantime, why don't you just instruct her that when she wakes up and everyone is sleeping, she needs to go to the living room and turn on the TV. If she's anything like my son, the TV for him is like a moth to a light. Ya'll need to get your sleep!

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The sleep issues are the least of my problems with her right now. There is no way on God's green earth I would allow her to be downstairs watching TV by herself at night...my house would be destroyed. Her behavior is NOT normal.

She never started waking up until I started giving her that damn melatonin... now she is waking about 3-4x per week and I thought it would be out of her system after 2-3 weeks.

My daughter has always had a hard time falling asleep - she is almost 11. Some nights she is really wound up or other times she will read for hours on end. I will still lay with her to make sure she falls asleep. This is sometimes easier than checking on her every 10 minutes or so.

I would think the melatonin she be long gone from her system after 2-3 weeks. How long has she been on the Vyvanse? Did the waking during the night start with the stimulant use? Have you stopped the med's to see if the sleeping issues at night are any better? I'd talk to your doctor and see if there are other reason why she could be waking up. I agree, I sleep study might be a good idea as well.

I really feel for you. There's no way you can leave her alone, especially if she is bieng destructive. I really think you need to see the doctor, this is not typicla behavior for sure. Is she destructive while medicated? Is this new since Vyvanse or has she always been this way.

The behaviorist wont obviously help her sleep, but will help you work with her on the outbursts and destructive behavior.

Diane V39447.2376851852You are not the world's worse mother but you probably have the world's worse doctor. A peditrician maybe? Get a psychatrist, trained to diagnose and treat ADHD/ODD. May have to wait for an appointment but it's wotth it. I am familiar with Adderall, Ritalin and Dexedrine. I raised a son with ADHD/ODD. In college, not prison thanks to good treatment. That Vyvance is new, but nevertheless shouldn't some adjustment be made. Probably a different med. Maybe like Adderall 5 mgs. Taken immediately before breakfast. Taken after meals slows the action down. Your daughter is probably 30 to 40 lbs. In the afternoon when it wears off there will be rebound, behavior may be worsre than before meds were taken in the am. Once that is established the psych will probably give .5 mg of Clonidine to calm her down and allow her to sleep. Anyway he/she will know what they are doing and not be operating from the info supplied by the salesperson from the pharmaceitical company. Not prescribing correctly is what causes meds to be controversial when they shouldn't be. There is not a diet solution available. Research established that a long time ago. Your child has severe behavioral symptoms. A combination of Meds and behavioral treatment is required. The meds knock down the intensity of the symptoms so that the child can be taught to behave in a civilized manner. Meds can't teach new behavior. Behavior therapy, if the correct procedures are used, trains good behavior by using experiential learning where naturally occuring behavior is rewarded when good and the undesirable stuff is extinguished because it is followed by some unpleasant event. Sometimes the lessons to be learned are the result of using contrived situations so the child can experience the outcome that you want them to have, a good one for appropriate behavior and one that is unpleasant for bad behavior. In order to avoid the unpleasant outcome they don't use the behavior that brings it on and vice versa for good behavior. A good therapist will use Extinction and Contingency Mangement procedures and teach you how to ignore the small behaviors as your attention is a reward and causes them to continue. Arguing is a killer with the level of severity that your child has. It is constant. You have to make rules, follow them to the letter without discussion because typical parenting practices don't work with these kids. Rational explanations and reasoning is a waste of time that makes the problem worse. The child thinks the door is open a crack and there's a chance to reverse what's headed their way. And on and on they go. You need rules that are well defined for the child so that they know what happens for specific good and bad behaviors. fairness and no surprise is important as well as consistancy in applying the rules. They never get changed or even bent in the middle of a situation. What's promised is what's delivered, the good and the bad. If your child has any propensity for physical aggresion time out is a dangerous procedure. At some point they resist and when you get physical they resist physically and it's only a matter of time before some therapist tells you that you have to restrain your child to show them that you are in control. Of what? Unfortunately very few know of the appropriate treatment for severe problems of ADHD/ODD. Basically there is no effective behavioral treatment. Stars, charts, smiley faces, tokens , too complicated and don't work. Positive comments about good behavior, what a joke. The kid doesn't hear that. They want you to show them the money. When they follow the rules that gets them access to all the good stuff they want. When the procedures you get from the therapist don't work, don't you take the blame. You want tools to work with that work, and learn what non-traditional parenting is about. Typical child rearing practices won't get the job done. Your house isn't a normal one and if you act like it is with all that esteem building stuff and explaining everything to a child all the time you are in for a long 12 years or so. You have to take charge, run things. The protesting only lasts as long as the child thinks there's a chance he can win. One thing for sure. Kids are not in to deprivation and don't want to cause themselves to be deprived of all the fun things that you have to let them use when they follow rules. You'll see all that chaos, anger and hostility leave your home and you will have plenty of time for loving that kid and telling her how proud of her that you are. Rebounder

I agree with Diane V in that you may need to add a fast acting stimulant in the a.m. to help with the morning challenges. Our son NEVER slept, and our MD added Clonidine, and that has helped with the morning irritability. It also helps him to sleep all night. I hope that things improve at your house. Happy New Year!

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Our children are precious in His Sight.

Yes I am married and my dh shares the frustration and responsibility with me. He gives me a break from her by taking her somewhere to let me have some alone time. We are both exhausted.

The waking in the middle of the night never happened before giving her the Melatonin. The past 2 nights she hasn't woken up.

She has been on Vyvanse since July of 2007. She was destructive before she started on the Vyvanse. She was on Concerta before Vyvanse and it wasn't helping us at all. She is very tolerable during the day, even has some good moments where I actually see MY LITTLE GIRL! And then all of a sudden, POOF she has a huge outburst or tantrum and things start all over again.

It wouldn't surprise me if she is bi-polar.

I know her meds need to be adjusted. I cannot wait until we all can get to some kind of normalcy in our lives. It makes being a mom not very fun :(

Make sure the Dr listens to you... I think you have the wrong med... You are obviously exhausted and at the end of your rope. You child knows it and so is insecure... That is not helping. You did not say if you are married or have a partner, if so, they need to step up and help out. An exhausted mommie is not good for anyone.
I would wonder about the childs diet... Try for a day or two to cut out dyes and MSG and asparatame. This will be hard... but you just may see a difference.

Sample diet.
Breakfast.
    Qatmeal or scrambled egg.
Snack
    Bananna with PB
Lunch
    Homemade soup
    apples and PB
Snack
    Apple sauce
    Crackers and cheese.
Dinner
    Baked chicken
    Mashed potatoes
    Raw veggies and Home made ranch.

Try to cook with out opening a can or a box. Do it a few days and see what happens. This is just a quick check. If your child reacts to milk or salacylates this diet will not help. But you have to feed them anyway and if it does help about the end of the second day you will see a difference.

Do you give the child any supplements? Check out the threads.

Good luck to you and rest!!!

[QUOTE=edbson]