thanks.
There is no doubt in my mind that my DD is hyperactive. The tazmanian devil spinning around is what she's like without medication. Literally. Not even a slight exaggeration there.
I'm fairly certain that she has coexisting conditions, but to what degree are the conditions exacerbated by the Focalin is I guess my biggest question. I don't want to go switching around medication if its not going to make a difference with the other issues. I don't even know if I can medicate for both conditions at the same time. Although I am going to look into the Clonidine after reading other people's posts about that.
I laugh thinking that someone could be both OCD and attention deficite at the same time. What a cruel joke God must have been playing when he thought that up.
just being hyperactive doesnt mean she ADHD was my point. LOTS of things can mimic the symptoms of ADHD.
It gets much more complicated to treat with co-exisiting conditions.
Hi everyone, I've been lurking for about a year and finally decided I needed to register and chat.
My DD is 6and1/2 yrs old and is severely ADHD. As obvious as a blind person is blind and has been obvious since she was an infant.
I finally couldn't take it anymore when she was 4 in preschool because I was sure she wasn't going to live to the age of 5 if I didn't put her on medication. No, a strict diet didn't do anything.
So the first thing the Dr tried her on was Strattera. That didn't work. She became very defiant and downright 'mean' not to mention that her attention and hyperactivity problems didn't diminish much at all.
Next, we tried Focalin. She's been on that for a while now - over a year - and the med has done wonderfully for her.
I've paid the outrageous prices for it because the insurance companies are... well... you know.
She's now on the XR and we have a 1/2 dose shorty pill at 3pm to get her thru homework. (she's in 1st grade).
I have always known she's been a little strange in the OCD department. For a little while, when she was a baby, I thought maybe she was on the Autistic spectrum because she has many of those tendencies and behaviors.
When eating - she has to line up her cheetoes in order from biggest to smallest before eating them. She has to arrange her fruit snacks by color before eating them etc. She doesn't 'play' with her toys, but rather organizes them (but still makes a mess), and now whats most concerning is it seems she has tipped the scale on OCD issues.
I don't know if it's from the Focalin, or if its its own seperate problem.
I talked to her teacher at school and the teacher said it's a problem at school now. She spends her entire time hunting for sparkles and staples in the carpeting. When she goes out to recess, she spends her time 'hunting' on the blacktop for worms (we're in Washington where it's wet most of the time so the worms on the wet pavement are common). Or scouring the barkchips for lost items. (ie: money or hair clips etc) She's picking her hands - any tiny little sore becomes a big one that never manages to heal because she's constantly picking. No, she doesn't have any tics. Just the OCD habits.
she does have a sensitivity toward loud noises - and she's irrationally petrified of dogs and cats. (no pun intended) It was torture for me taking her door to door trying to sell Girl Scout cookies because she wouldn't even knock on a door because she was afraid there'd be a dog inside that would come running to the door and attack her or even just bark.
And the last thing - that takes the cake. She has potty problems. I know it's genetic. I was/am ADHD (not ever medicated because my parents were too poor to have insurance etc) and I have always had bladder control issues too.
I've never thought that the bladder control issues were related, but recently, I've started to wonder if maybe they are. My DD is now on medication for the constant accidents (Detrol) and that has helped tremendously. But she's still a nighttime bedwetter and has been having accidents during the day again recently. (she's currently on a sulfa antibiotic incase it's a small-time urinary tract infection which historically, has caused her to have more frequent accidents when she does have even a mild UTI ).
I just made an appt. with the Dr to talk about her issues because something has to change.
I've already been hunting around the other boards on here and haven't found any answers or even anyone talking about similar issues. I couldn't possibly be the only person who has an ADHD child who also has OCD.. and incontinence problems... am I?
help me.
First off- hugs to you. I know this is really hard.
You really mention a lot of issues that sound like "red flags" as they say, for non-adhd disorders. I can tell by your post that you know this, too. Have you seen a specialist or just her pediatrician? If you haven't seen a child psychiatrist I would do that immediately. I don't mean to sound alarming, but the sooner the better- if she has a co-existing condition along with the adhd- or a different problem that is being confused for adhd- a good child psychiatrist or nuero-psychologist should be able to help. At least it will give you peace of mind, knowing that you are going to try to find some answers and get the best possible treatment for your your little girl.
Good luck to you and your daughter.
I agree 100% with kidsinspace. You need a new evaluation. This is an example of why they dont like to diagnose ADHD before age 7. I'm not at all saying it cant happen, just this is one of the reasons people like to wait. I'd get a an evaluation from a neuropsychologist, and I'd see a psychiatrist. She very well may have co-exisitng conditions that can be exacerbated by the Focalin. The Focalin may be exacerbating the picking. My daughter does not have OCD, but last year on Concerta she started picking, compulsive scratching, and at one point pulling out her eyelashes, it was TERRIBLE, stopped the stimulants, ALL of that stopped. We had never seen those behaviors before or after. She has been on other stimulants both before and after, and we've not seen any of those compusive type behaviors, just then. She may need to try another med, there are a lot of options. You need WELL trained psychiatrist (psychopharmocologist if possible).[QUOTE=skyqueen]well, I was thinking that the Clonidine was mostly for the sleep issues - which are really starting to be a problem She lays awake in bed ... and picks the sores on her hands. Picks picks picks picks [/QUOTE]This is also my first time a any kind of chat room and I think I just posted an empty reply.
Anyway, I agree with most everybody else's reply. You should certainly get a second opinion on the possible OCD. My son was diagnosed with ADHD just before he turned 7, he is now 8. I have to watch his eating habits closely. Through trial and error we have found that salt, spices and sugar drives my son crazy. If we throw him off his routine, he is weeks getting back on track. Example: xmas morning he woke up at 2am in the morning, understandable with santa coming but he didn't go back to sleep. I was three weeks trying to get his sleep pattern back to normal again. He was getting up every morning between 3 and 4 am. Which made for one hell of a day, at home and school. He has changed types of med's, 2 times. I have lost count on how many times we have changed the dosage. He was on concerta, the highest dose she would give him, but the teachers was telling me that it seem to wear off aroung 10:30 in the morning which it suppose to last between 10 -12 hours. now he is on Ritalin which he has to take twice a day, which is a pain, but he is eating better. Night time is the problem. By the time I get home from work, its gone and close to impossible to get any homework done. I end up losing patients and raise my voice. Then by the time he gets to sleep, I am crying because I think that I am not a good mother because I am losing it with him and for the most part he can't help it. Anyway, I could go on and on because this is my first time on this chat but I would like to hear from parents that lose it with there kids. I'd like to hear someones story about how to have the patients and have no guilt.
There's a high frequency of tolieting issues in ADHD children. No medical evidence though. You can see it on this board, alone. My son did this. I tried everything. Turns out, he just wasn't paying attention to his bladder when it announced that it was time to pee. And if he did, he forgot about 30 seconds later. I've cleaned up more bathroom accidents than I care to recall. What worked was the bedwetting alarm. I got the one that vibrates, flashes, and makes 8 alternating loud obnoxious noises and wakes up the entire house. He stopped wetting his bed because he hated the noise. I used it during the day any time he was home, and finally, he stopped wetting his pants during the day. I didn't do this until I'd tried everything under the son, and he was 5.5 years old and wetting his pants at school. Nobody wants to be remembered as peeing in their pants at school.I agree, just being hyper is not ADHD, my Oldest is extremely "energetic" and hyper, but no ADHD.
It sounds like she is dealing with alot more than ADHD, or maybe not ADHD at all, I would see a psycologist or neuropsychologist for an evaluation.
Focalin, or any stimulant could exacerbate any comorbid conditions, and alot of times these need to be under control or "stabilized" before a sti is introduced.
Clonidine is not going to help OCD tendancies, it really only helops with hyp[eractivity and impulsiveness, very little for focus.
I am curious, how long did she take Strattera?
My child, age five, is also OCD with ADHD. His symptoms aren't quite as pronounced as your daughters, but it's there just the same. The bed has to be made a certain way for him to go to sleep, he will only eat out of one kind of bowl. He also has sensory issues. He doesn't like certain clothing or sheets, and he will not wear a sweat shirt, because they "make me hot". Lord forbid I put the cereal "under the milk". That's just asking for a meltdown. He also doesn't like a lot of noise. Extra stimulation tends to upset him, and we, too, have thought about some degree on the autistic spectrum, but our pediatric psychiatrist doesn't think so.
I definitely agree with kidsinspace about the pediatric psychiatrist. I wouldn't waste any time.
The bladder control problems...as a mom, and a nurse, I have never heard of that being related to ADHD. You might want to consider looking into a pediatric urologist for her. You need to make sure there are no physical reasons for this.
edbson is right. Clonidine will not help the OCD. My child takes it to help with sleep issues, or the lack thereof.
well, I was thinking that the Clonidine was mostly for the sleep issues - which are really starting to be a problem She lays awake in bed ... and picks the sores on her hands. Picks picks picks picks
she took strattera for about 4 or so months if I recall. Maybe 5 months.
And, there is no doubt that she is ADHD. Hyperactivity is the least of her problems. Although her hyperactivity might be 1/2 the reason for her inability to focus. She started the medications before kindergarten because she couldn't sit still long enough to hold a pencil much less learn how to use it. She was completely unable to learn the alphabet (by sight) because she couldn't concentrate long enough for any sort of classroom work for even a second.
She started kindergarten at the skill level of a 3 year old because that's where she was at when we started her on the medication. She was barely at beginning kindergarten leven by the time she finished kindergarten and at the start of 1st grade, she tested bottom 3 in the entire 1st grade class (of 4 classes of 24 kids each) for reading and was put into the Reading Recovery program. She has now graduated from that (a little early) but it has been a serious struggle to catch up to the rest of the 1st graders. I am happy to say that she *is* catching up ever since we started her on the focalin. And I'm happy to say she's only had one accident at school since starting her on the detrol. (she had 5 accidents in the first 7 days of school and THATS when I put her on those meds)
I'll be getting several more diagnosis' before all is said and done, I fear.
skyqueen: your daughter and mine could have been separated at birth. she did not display the major ocd until we went to stims. now it is amazing and frustrating to watch. personnally i think that the stims just highlighted it, and it is possible that she would continue to have it no matter what med she was on. we put her on zoloft 25mg. and that has helped a lot. she now stills does things but is more acceptable to change. yesterday she let two of her friends sleep on her bed when they were playing house! big mile stone for her (she doesn't always let me sleep with her, because she is afraid that something will happen to her toys that she keeps on her bed.) i find that she is worse it i harp on her about it. so now i try to be more positive and reassuring.
we took my daughter to a psychologist, psychiatrist and now we are seeing a developmental peds. she was dx with adhd, some ocd characteristics and a pragmatic speech delay. Wow, tell me something i don't know!! she struggles in school, but has a great teacher this year, and is making strides. she is also being tested by the school for a LD. i too thought that she might fall somewhere on the autisim spectrum, but her doctor said she was too social (although awkward) to be autistic.
i have two daughters, my oldest (1st grade) adhd and my yougest (4yo) who is the picture of normal. i always feel bad that my older one got hit with every negative genetic aspect of her father and me, and i also feel bad that i seldom worry about my younger one.
Unfortunately I am almost positive your child is autistic. My son is and your child
has the exact same symptoms. Your process and my process is the exact opposite. I know my son is autistic but has very bad ADD that I am now in the
process to treat. PLEASE have your child screened for autism, the signs are classis.