Hello, I am new | ADHD Information

Thanks!!! that sounds like a good idea. i'll talk to him about it and see if he's game. I appreciate your help! [QUOTE=mythreesons]i haven't heard of the marble method. if you have time could you explain it?[/QUOTE]

Here it is--just replace the [dot] with a "period" then cut and paste it into your browser. and I bumped it for you to find, too. We aren't allowed to post webpages due to spamming problems.

http://www.adhdnews [DOT]com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=19898&KW=marble+system

outofoptions,

my son is also on concerta. He was on 72mgs at the age of 7. Concerta is NOT weight or age based, it is success based. When my son turned 10, he went up to 90mgs, where he is now at the age of 11 1/2.

I don't know if it is a med thing for your son, but it might be since you mention the nonstop talking and bothering other kids. I know that my son is like that before his meds kick in, then he is fine, not zombied out, just fine. right where he should be.

We too have no after school dates, he does have one friend who moved and they are on the phone all the time due to video game questions, but my son plays sports each season, no real friends on the teams, but acquaintences. I struggled with my son when he was even your son's age, but it gets better as they get older.

DS started middle school this year, more kids to chose from for friendships and no history from before meds began. So he is happier, but still nothing after school, but social in school, even with a girl who he talks with after school in the parking lot. Things are looking up here, but it did take some time and A LOT of tears, I can't even explain the tissues. I work overnight and my job can be theraputic, just like these boards!!

hang in there, we are always here for you, and your family!!

Mythreesons,

Did I read correctly that your medical team is a pediatricain and a psychologist (correct me if I got this wrong)? This kind of team works as long as the med management is pretty simple. I would strongly suggest starting with a psychiatrist for med managment. Psychiatrists are generallly much more experienced at med management than pediatricians and psychologists are not trained in medication managment so they are not allowed to prescribe meds.

With my youngest, we were successful with a stimulant and guanfacine for most coverage, but added risperdal for a period for anxiety that was being expressed as aggression. We are currently giving straterra a try but can fall back on the previous meds if needed.

outofoptions,

A psychiatrist would be better suited for med management as they have more experience with meds, combos and doses outside what a ped will work with.

Also, see if you can find social skills coaching for your son. Ask the docs, andif you have a university with a child development team, they may offer this service.

The cloud comment is so typical... We have a joke around here, whenever one of the kids jumps quickly to another topic we look at each other and say "chicken". This comes from a T shirt that says something like "They say I have ADHD, but I don't know...hey look a chicken!"

ok here we go again. i swear when things like this happens i feel like a horrible horrible mother. ok, night before last my toddler woke up before sunrise like always and i put him in bed with daddy and i layed on the couch, no biggie. i woke up around 930 to find my oldest (the adhd kid) in the refrigerator. he had eaten almost all of the banana pudding from thanksgiving. there was about 4 lbs in the bowl and he had eaten at least 2 1/2 lbs of it with his fingers. of course i lost it. i said some things i should not have said and i feel horrible about it, but all i could think of was the repricutions of him doing the same thing when he gets older. it bothered me so bad i cried at work. he has been sneaking and stealing various things since he was 3 and he lies about it all the time. im so tired of being upset and angry at him, im tired of him being in trouble all the time but what am i supposed to do when he doesnt listen to anything we say? i mean hes 9, and last night he told me we dont let him do anything when hes not in trouble. what am i supposed to do when i work at night 5-6 days a week, we have a toddler, i am the only one that drives and we live on a one person income? im telling you i feel like the worst mom right now. maybe on my days off it can be just me and him for a little while. last night he told me he didnt want me home because im always mad at him, i told him i was dissappointed not mad and he acted as if he didnt care. i am so upset, but enough of me blabbering.

blessings

miss red

mythreesons- My son 10 is on Vyvanse as well and we are going to take him off this week because of the anger and defiant behaivior, Since we cut back on the vyvanse if has gotten somewhat better. we are weaning him off and are not sure what to do next. I wish you luck ahead!!!Welcome, redbanana! Congrats for being on top of things with your little guy. It sounds like you have a good plan in place for him. I believe that recognizing difficulties and interventing when young is a plus for these young ones. Good luck to you and hope you find these boards to be as helpful as I have.

Good morning everyone,

i'm new to the whole forum/ board thing. I have a 13 yr old boy that was diagnosed adhd w/ anxiety (have no idea where the anxiety is because i don't see it). It's been a rough couple years. i never knew there was anything wrong until a teacher brought it to my attention when we were living in Nevada. i looked into it and the only child psychiatrist was in Reno (hour away), but they were scheduling appts 6 mo out and we would have moved to the midwest by then. Long story short he wasn't diagnosed until Fall 2005 and after trying one med with no avail he was put on Concerta which helped him do an amazing turnaround. The concerta ran it's course and is now on Vyvance. He did great in school last half of fifth, all of 6th and started the first half of 7th ok....after that he started spiraling down hill. The lying is out of control (over stupid minute things) he lies to us, grandparents, teachers....doesn't matter. His school work is pathetic and is failing. i need help. i have no one who understands that i can talk to about this. my husband (step-dad) thinks that most of what he does has nothing to do with adhd and we haven't been getting along because of this. I am basically a single parent trying to cope, deal, dicipline and everything else while keeping my sanity (which is diminishing very quickly). i have a 17 yr old as well as a 4 yr old so i'm sure you can see where my "diminishing sanity" comment is coming from. I could sure use some understanding adult conversation, advise and whatever else you have to offer. I apologize for the novel, but i'm sure you can understand

Thanks!!!!

thanks alot for your understanding bethann, my son's medicine works its course for the 12 hours it is supposed to, but he is still mouthy, lying about little things as well, school work is becoming more of a challenge because im afraid hes becoming more and more lazier. these outbursts only happen at home when something happens that he doesnt agree with. yesterday it happened because he kept coming down the stairs asking for different stuff and finally he came downstairs asking to get his pencil sharpened, my 3 yr old was running around being a toddler and we told him to go back upstairs. so he threw a huge fit, i put him in the corner, he kept on, i told him to go upstairs and sit on his bed, he screamed at the top of his lungs, i called him down for dinner, he ate with attitude of course. he only ate half of his tuna melt and wanted more chips. i explained to him that if he wanted more chips he had to finish his sandwich, which led to more fits. he was made to go upstairs which was 10 times worse, i went upstairs trying to calm him down, told him it was time for bed, he gets up early and he needs his rest. he proceeded to scream and yell at me, i left the room, he punched his tv and i was afraid he was going to hurt himself so i took the tv out of the room. he grabbed my arm yelling and screaming no at me and trying to pull the tv out of my hands. my husband intervined, which is what i was hoping wouldnt happen, and they had an argument that my husband won of course and my son went to bed fussing and blaming everyone for him misbehaving. i went into my bedroom and cried my eyes out. i feel like im losing my son and i dont know how to deal with him sometimes. this morning he was up like nothing had happened, i told him we werent goin to talk about it but that it couldnt be like that. im trying to be patient but im losing my mind. hopefully this forum will help me.

miss red

I have been lurking for quite some time and started to post the other day in
response to some posts. I realized that I should have introduced myself. I
have a 4 1/2 year old son with ADHD with impulsivity. He has been on fast
acting ritalin for about a year now. We also give him 1 mg of melatonin at
bedtime to help him calm down and be able to go to sleep without having
world war 3. We also see a bahvior therapist and he gets a Shadow in school
as well as OT for sensory. I also get parent training which has been a great
help.

I am very excited about being a part of this board.

Welcome Redbanana,

You will find this a supportive, helpful community.

I am new as well and now i feel as if i am at my wits end. i have a 9 year old that has been on medication for about 4 years now. before the medicine started we went through it, my husband and I, and now as he gets older he is more defiant and less obedient. we never know when we are going to have an episode where he just blows up and throws a fit but it happened tonight and finally i made him go to bed which made things worse. i went into my bedroom and cried while my husband made him go to bed. i dont think counselors or psychiatrists will be of much help because it seems my son jsut doesnt want to listen to anyone, his teachers, his doctor or us. All ive ever wanted was for my son to be able to function but its killing me because i feel like im failing as a parent. i try so hard to not lose my temper and keep myself cool but after awhile, i mean, im not superwoman. And we have a smaller son which doesnt have the same disorder and im afraid that he will copy his older brothers behavior. which he has done before. I am scared and drained and just need some advice or help or just to let it out. sorry if i seem like im rambling but i dont know what else to do.

red

I am so sorry to read your post. I have days and nights as you describe.

does it happen at school as well or just at home? Any changes in his routine, at school, or with friends?

Do you think the meds your son is on are working? Do you think he may need a dose increase or med change?

If you are living like this all the time, his meds are NOT helping. I would call his prescribing doctor and discuss what is occurring. He may be depressed or have something else going on, even bipolar.

Call the doctor. He is only 9, there is something that can be done to help him, I bet he too is hurting. Keep us posted with any updates!!

Regards.

mythreesons,

I noticed all the meds that you list, wow that is bit much. Are they working?

My son is on concerta, 90mg, and guanfacine/tenex 1 mg - that is it all day. We tried strattera a few years back but it made him depressed, suicidal thoughts. if you try it, and it does work wonders for some, just keep an eye on your son. He has a lot of meds in his system.

Just wanted to share.

Outofoptions, if it wasn't for my son's meds, he too would have been an outcast at school. He was labeled back in first grade for his adhd behavior and has had trouble shaking the label. HE is now 11!!

That makes me really mad when our children are treated like that.

Does he have any friends, even just one, that is all you need? You really need to make sure he is ok socially wise and with himself for self esteem. Poor guy, that makes me want to cry. I am very sensitive to this stuff and it happens all the time to our adhd'ers.

Are his meds working, something needs adjusting. Do you think he needs a boost in the afternoon, or a med change? is he starting puberty? What about school and his self esteem, any concerns? Any friends???? How are his grades? I know I asked you this yesterday but is he depressed?

You obviously love him and look you found us here on the boards, you really care

Let us know how you make out at the doctors, but keep an eye on his social life, he needs one. Does he have any hobbies or play sports, etc, video games?? We have to help in this area also!!

how would i know what an adhd episode is from an aggressive episode? my son goes to see his dr tomorrow and im going to talk to her about these episdoes. my son is treated as an outcast at school because he talks constantly, the other children cant get any work done and my son bothers them. the teacher had a day where he had to take blood pressure pills when the school day was over. my son is so smart it just sickens me when he has these fits. im so tired of being blamed for trying to be a good parent but it seems to backfire on me. my son means well, he extremely funny and entertaining, but he also has an extreme anger issue. i read somewhere that parents that come from healthy childhood backgrounds can usually adapt to adhd children and the children grow to be adapting adults. well neither my husband or myself come from very supportive homes so does that mean my children are doomed? i am adhd myself and i have had anger issues in the past but as an adult i have learnt to deal with them. im afraid my son wont be able to make that transition if something isnt done now. i dont wnat him drugged on more medicine than is necessary, so what other options are there? i work nights and with my husband and my toddler its hard keeping things on a schedule in our house the way our lives are. any suggestions of things to try that dont include prescriptions?

miss red

thanks vickie,

i've finally taken him to a psychologist as of last friday. I had a talk with the vp of the school (starting to become a first name basis relationship) and he mentioned he's noticed a change in his demeanor and is becoming somewhat agressive. This has NEVER been the case before. for the past couple of years i have cried out for help to the school and teachers for any ideas, plans etc.. and no one has offered any help. i devised a homework sign sheet that the teachers had to sign and comment if needed. that worked ok....when he didn't forget. Then while talking to the psychologist this past friday she asked me if he was on a 504 plan at school.....i had no idea what she was talking about. then i found out. while taking my son back to school that day i ran into the principal and we along with the school counselor had over an hour long conversation and now have an appt to set up a 504 plan. I am so bitter that not one teacher nor the vp or principal has ever mentioned this plan was available. The vp is add himself and his child is adhd...you would think he of all people would want to help. so now we're going to try the possitive reinforcement thing and i pray that works. i need to come up with some sort of schedule or chart, but at this point my brain is mush. any ideas? Also the psychologist suggested adding straterra to his stimulant meds....something to talk about with the dr i guess. He's already on vyvance, clonidine and busparone along with asthma meds. i feel like we have our own little pharmacy.

Good morning Bethann,

Thanks, i appreciate you sharing. He is on the vyvance of course for the adhd, the busparone for "anxiety" (well actually he was on 72mg concerta, but because of his weight he couldn't go to any higher of a dosage so the dr added busparone to help knock off the edge) the clonidine is to help him sleep which i'm not so sure how well that actually works. The first drug he was ever on was straterra and it did absolutely nothing, it was like he wasn't even on medication. i put a call into the dr and he upped his vyvance to 50mg until his appt Dec 5th. His psychologist said he has a bit of depression, but she seems to think that is stemming from his relationship or lack there of with his father that lives 2100 miles away. typicallly he and his older brother go to their dad's every summer, but this past summer their dad couldn't afford to fly them out and said he'd bring them out at Christmas....that's a bust as well. He rarely calls. Add puberty (just turned 13) to the mix and it makes for a messy dose of i need help.

i dont think he has many friends at school, at least none that i have heard of. as far as activities outside of school, i work nights and cant get him to anywhere and dad doesnt drive. it is only the 2 of us that we can depend on. i am nervous because the dr said today that he may also have ODD and we need to see a counselor and a child psychiatrist. counselors and such never helped me when i was a child, but the meds he takes (concerta 54mg) is the max he can take now due to his weight so we have to see a pscyhiatrist for that. i am really working on myself as well because sometimes i lost my temper because it is so frustrating. i love my son so much and it hurts when i feel like he feels as if he is an outcast. we has a conversation this morning as soon as we left the dr's office.....'you know i love you right?' 'yes mom.............hey what are clouds made of?'

of course i laughed at myself and thought, yep thats my son.

thanks for all your support, it has made a change of wonder even in just a few days.

i haven't heard of the marble method. if you have time could you explain it? [QUOTE=outofoptions]

ok so for the whole pudding incident he got grounded for a month. and trust me he hates it. hes been having some issues in school, lol imagine that, but yesterday he came home and did all his homework IN SCHOOL and did it all right. so we gave him a week off of being grounded. yes he was still bummed out but we explained (while he was still on meds) why it was so. he was still upset but i reminded him this morning of what happened yesterday and you just never know how things will work out. lol of course he tends to forget things ALOT so we have been having better days since the other day. im trying to be alot more patient with him, its frustrating but hes my son and i love him more than anything.

You might want to re-think your "grounding" policy for the future.

A month isn't going to have a bigger effect on an ADHD kid than a day or two. Limited attention span. And having an ADHD kid underfoot for a whole month can drive the parent nuts.

A few hours or whole day[s] away from a playstation, TV set or removing a favorite toy can often make more impact than a week of grounding and driving yourself crazy. "Grounding" doesn't motivate all kids. What motivates yours? Think about this, seriously. I knew one kid that would jump into line over money. He couldn't stand to lose a nickel without heartbreak. With one, put away the [groan] Barbie PlayHouse. Other kids, it's other things. Be creative!

What do YOU think would really impact on this kid?

The punishment needs to fit the crime. More is not necessarily, more effective.

What is the most likely consequence if I eat YOUR dessert? Or your cookies? Or your lunch?

i only have limited time to be at home but do you think my one day off would benefit at all? like on my one day off just do me and him stuff? maybe he look forward to that?

ABSOLUTELY! If you give him some positive attention then you have "leverage". The more the child has invested in the relationship, the more he is likely to want to please you.

You need time to yourself and hubby as well.

However, having say, two Munchkin hours to play a game, or go somewhere as his 'special time' [for the first while, I would not take this away no matter what he's being punished for] gives you both the opportunity to put the relationship on solid ground.

Go have some fun with him. You might surprise yourself

i dont know, but your suggestions about adhd'ers helps. it makes sense because alot of times ill be talking to him and he just kind of stares at me lol and then ill say what did i jsut say and he says while shrugging his shoulders 'uhuhhuh'. lol

Yeah that look where the brain is obviously somewhere circling Mars

It's good you ask him--that's a good start to see what he actually just took in. If he gives you the answer, praise him for listening. ADHD'ers thrive with praise

hes so funny but when im in a hurry he seems to slow down. so i either start really early or get him into fast mode and then it takes forever to slow him down since its so easy to get started.

'sigh' thats my boy.

[/QUOTE]

Actually he sounds adorable. If you have an endless pudding supplier

You can try this trick and see if it works. I used to use it with clients who were "speedy" whether it was substances, mania or ADHD.

Start speedy. Then, by conscious effort slow your own breathing and slow your speech over the course of a few sentences while looking in his eyes and speaking. Sort of *will* him to do the same. See if he "comes with you".

I've only done that with adults. Let me know if it works with a kid?

You also might check out this
http://www.adhdnews[DOT] com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=19898&KW=marble+system

i only have limited time to be at home but do you think my one day off would benefit at all? like on my one day off just do me and him stuff? maybe he look forward to that? i dont know, but your suggestions about adhd'ers helps. it makes sense because alot of times ill be talking to him and he just kind of stares at me lol and then ill say what did i jsut say and he says while shrugging his shoulders 'uhuhhuh'. lol hes so funny but when im in a hurry he seems to slow down. so i either start really early or get him into fast mode and then it takes forever to slow him down since its so easy to get started.

'sigh' thats my boy.

[QUOTE=outofoptions]

It sounds like he had a blast

I don't mean to laugh but I had to. I once at a whole tray of my mom's lemon chiffon she made for guests at Christmas.

Every year since she makes me one so I don't raid the fridge and I'm 50

Is he on medication? Overweight? Underweight?

of course i lost it. i said some things i should not have said and i feel horrible about it, but all i could think of was the repricutions of him doing the same thing when he gets older.

Apologize if you said anything cruel. Show him the way.

it bothered me so bad i cried at work. he has been sneaking and stealing various things since he was 3 and he lies about it all the time.

One step at a time. Okay? When is the last time you saw a doctor/therapist and what did s/he say about this behaviour?

im so tired of being upset and angry at him, im tired of him being in trouble all the time but what am i supposed to do when he doesnt listen to anything we say? i mean hes 9, and last night he told me we dont let him do anything when hes not in trouble. what am i supposed to do when i work at night 5-6 days a week, we have a toddler, i am the only one that drives and we live on a one person income?

Okay, whoa back there K?

Look, you're exhausted, you're frustrated and it sounds as if you're financially disadvantaged as well.

Let's take this one step at a time, shall we?

im telling you i feel like the worst mom right now. maybe on my days off it can be just me and him for a little while. last night he told me he didnt want me home because im always mad at him, i told him i was dissappointed not mad and he acted as if he didnt care. i am so upset, but enough of me blabbering.

blessings

miss red

[/QUOTE]

Unless you have a few bodies buried under the washer, you are not Ma Barker and manic munchkin there is not Hannibal Lecter.

So, we have a happy start, okay? There's hope, yet

What is Dad doing in all this?

dad is right here along with me, he is a stay at home dad to save on daycare since we have no family to help. also he is a little underweight but always has been and eats like a horse. he has been doing this sneaking-taking things since he was alot younger.

we are waiting to hear back from therapists and the dr right now.

and trust me, the boy is well fed. i think he did it for another reason. i just dont know what it is.

Could it be impulsive behavior? VEry common amongs adhd'ers.

I would also apologize for anything that you may have said to him that could be considered cruel. YOu obviously don't want him saying what was said to him so anyone else, nor do you want to trample on his self esteem.

I know that when I like something a lot, I can eat A LOT. And in AM these guys are starving with no meds in their system, they can also put it away, and they love sugar.

I hope this is of some help

Please keep us posted!

[QUOTE=outofoptions]

we are waiting to hear back from therapists and the dr right now.

and trust me, the boy is well fed. i think he did it for another reason. i just dont know what it is.

[/QUOTE]

Oh dear, I wasn't accusing you of starving the little fella!

I was well-fed when I ate the entire pan of lemon chiffon. I ate it because it was THERE and tastes good and I had little impulse control

This is going to sound really crazy I know--but has he been tested for parasites? They're more common than you think.

As for the sneaking--well it's usually related to believing he'll "get into trouble".

For ADHD'ers because we miss vital pieces of information we often stand there looking completely baffled because we don't "get" why someone is confronting us. So we tend to be kind of confused over [which can cause 'sneaking'] what is permissible behaviour and what's not.

So I'm going to post my standard:

HOW TO GET AN aDhd pErSoN's ATTENTION:

First off, with 40 trains of thought flying around upstairs, you are competing with a lot of brain chatter to get through.

Assume that when they are flying by like a terrier on speed, in another room or are not looking directly at you, they haven't heard a word you said.

Make eye contact. Sometimes touch helps, like a gentle hand on a shoulder.

Don't say more than 3 sentences. Remember, you're trying to make your point with a lot of noise going on in there. Anything after that is just blah blah blah blah

Then get the person to repeat back to you what you said. Make sure they processed and understood your instructions.

And a Finishing Note:

THE TEN-ONE RULE:
Use ten parts praise/thank yous to 1 part criticism/correction.

outofoptions....i'm going to have to agree with MetisRebel (btw Metis...you're such a hoot). i've been in this mindset and it is soooooo hard for me to wrap my head around this whole adhd thing, but one thing that helps me check my self and my way of thinking. A parent and psychologist once put it to me like this...ADHD kids "live in the moment" they are not thinking of reprecussions (is that spelled right?) to what ever it is they're doing. If they want that banana pudding their not thinking "what's going to happen if i eat it...or mom's going to be mad" their thinking "i want that banana pudding" so they eat it. my son is 13 and does some of the dumbest things that makes me think to myself "what the crap are you doing or thinking?". Chances are he's not setting out to piss you off and trust me.....i know how frustrating it can be. mine is a liar too and it's over the most minute things that you wonder why they are even lying about. As far as the grounding goes....been there done that. my boy's middle name is grounded and let me tell you, it really doesn't work. Mine doesn't have an achilles heel so there isn't anything that i can take away for punishment that means anything. Add to a step dad that thinks that he's purposely just being disobedient and doesn't really understand the wrath of adhd and you've got one heck of nasty mix. you're doing the best you can, and i've said some pretty rude and mean things myself, but you've got to remember to apologize and explain and do your best to change YOUR habbits. spamula....i'm not sure what we're going to do with the vyvance issue. we saw his psychologist the day we left for vacation (21st nov) and she reccomended we seek a psychiatrist for medication adjustments....general practice docs usually aren't fully up to speed with the concoctions of meds that tend to work the best. So today i got into touch with a psychiatrist and we'll go from there. i sure hope we find something that works well and helps with school because this whole issue with homework, classwork etc.... is burning my biscuits and wearing me thin. Finally he's on a 504 plan (which was NEVER once brought to my attention during the past 6 years that i've been struggling) but thank GOD for the psychologist...on our first vist she asked if he was on a 504 and frankly i had never heard of it. that day i had an hour long meeting with the pricipal/counselor at his school and as of two weeks ago today he's has been on a 504. we'll see how it goes. i pray it helps [QUOTE=mythreesons]outofoptions....i'm going to have to agree with MetisRebel (btw Metis...you're such a hoot).

Thanks

i've been in this mindset and it is soooooo hard for me to wrap my head around this whole adhd thing, but one thing that helps me check my self and my way of thinking. A parent and psychologist once put it to me like this...ADHD kids "live in the moment" they are not thinking of reprecussions (is that spelled right?) to what ever it is they're doing. If they want that banana pudding their not thinking "what's going to happen if i eat it...or mom's going to be mad" their thinking "i want that banana pudding" so they eat it.

I am SO there

I don't buy fast food cuz I will eat it. NOW. If I buy 10lbs of fruit I will make myself sick on it.

My Mom was smart. She had an "off limits" drawer in the fridge and one "off limits" cupboard--everything else, well, knock yourself out

[and shhhhhhhh I still ripped her off for the baking walnuts and chocolate chips]

You moms could try that and see if it works for you.

With my ADHD teen foster kid, I allotted him per week for HIS stuff that no one was allowed to eat and we put his name on the stuff. He got to pick what he wanted [Ramen noodles & chicken wieners were big].

Ya really got to be creative with ADHD kids.

my son is 13 and does some of the dumbest things that makes me think to myself "what the crap are you doing or thinking?". Chances are he's not setting out to piss you off and trust me.....i know how frustrating it can be. mine is a liar too and it's over the most minute things that you wonder why they are even lying about. As far as the grounding goes....been there done that. my boy's middle name is grounded and let me tell you, it really doesn't work. Mine doesn't have an achilles heel so there isn't anything that i can take away for punishment that means anything.

Maybe you can work the reverse. How well does he do rewards?

Didja try a "token" system?

Remember, ADHD'ers feel less pleasure from praise and are less adept at behaviour=consequences connections.

I'm almost tempted to say, "buy him a playstation"--give him an hour for everything he does right and deduct an hour for bad behaviour

Add to a step dad that thinks that he's purposely just being disobedient and doesn't really understand the wrath of adhd and you've got one heck of nasty mix.

That sounds tough. Parents need to be on board together with these kids. Chaos adds to their chaos and it gets messy

you're doing the best you can, and i've said some pretty rude and mean things myself, but you've got to remember to apologize and explain and do your best to change YOUR habbits. [/QUOTE]

Just keep boogy-ing along moms. It's a lot of live and learn

ok.....creativity (for something like this)is not a strong suit of mine. i am a very detailed oriented person.....i like for people to throw ideas at me (of course in detail) and i will mix and match and go from there. in regards to the playstation.....we already have a ps2 and an xbox 360. he only gets 1 hr a day typically for games and then tv takes over until bedtime of course after dinner, homework, chores and shower. i'm working on the rewards chart/ calendar, but i'm having issues trying to devise one. i've never bought a birthday cake or halloween costume (3 boys--17, 13 and 4) so i do have some creativity in my little pinky, but this chart thing is kicking my hiney. i don't know what it is. What chart thing? Ya lost me there 3sons.

Why don't you sit down with the kids and let them help you devise a system?

And maybe it's bugging you because you know in your mommy heart of hearts this solution, isn't all that workable for your particular family needs?

a reward chart of sorts....something we can visually look at so that he can see progress in behavior, school etc....

I can't say that this isn't a workable solution, maybe it is maybe it isn't, but i won't know unless i try and frankly i don't really have too many other options.

[QUOTE=mythreesons]

a reward chart of sorts....something we can visually look at so that he can see progress in behavior, school etc....

I can't say that this isn't a workable solution, maybe it is maybe it isn't, but i won't know unless i try and frankly i don't really have too many other options.

[/QUOTE]

Did you try adapting the Marble Method?

Visual is good for kids that are inclined that way. You know your munchkin the best.

Also, look over the history and see what has worked and what hasn't for clues

Good luck and keep us posted

I am going to change the topic, went to my first parent training evening tonight, my first meeting in my life as an ADDer with other people with experience of ADD, I could have cried and laughed at the same time, why has it taken me so long to get this sorted out, 45 and son 11, he still isnt diagnosed. I can only suggest to you lot out there, try to get in some sort of group. I havent got two heads and I am not green, there really are other really normal looking people out there with this. The funny thing is , they think it is only their kids that have it. I live in Europe and there is very little in the way of ADD support, you are miles ahead over in the states. I recommended this site so will see what happens. Am very grateful that I found you lot, this forum has been a saviour.
The things which I took real comfort from was when one of the women said, my daughter sits in the bathroom with her toothbrush in her mouth, completely still, not brushing, just dreaming, then she comes out of the bathroom and she asks her have you brushed your teeth, oh I forgot. Whereas my son sits there with the toothbrush in his mouth, completely still and that is almost as close as he gets, he rarely gets nearer but if he doesnt do it at all he just says, yes I did brush them and unfortunately lies.
sink39785.6948148148 [QUOTE=sink] I am going to change the topic, went to my first parent training evening tonight, my first meeting in my life as an ADDer with other people with experience of ADD, I could have cried and laughed at the same time,

Good for you! Sounds like it was an excellent experience for you

why has it taken me so long to get this sorted out, 45 and son 11, he still isnt diagnosed. I can only suggest to you lot out there, try to get in some sort of group. I havent got two heads and I am not green, there really are other really normal looking people out there with this.

Just look for people whose socks don't match--we're everywhere

The funny thing is , they think it is only their kids that have it. I live in Europe and there is very little in the way of ADD support, you are miles ahead over in the states. I recommended this site so will see what happens. Am very grateful that I found you lot, this forum has been a saviour.
The things which I took real comfort from was when one of the women said, my daughter sits in the bathroom with her toothbrush in her mouth, completely still, not brushing, just dreaming, then she comes out of the bathroom and she asks her have you brushed your teeth, oh I forgot. Whereas my son sits there with the toothbrush in his mouth, completely still and that is almost as close as he gets, he rarely gets nearer but if he doesnt do it at all he just says, yes I did brush them and unfortunately lies.
You'll get past that if you both look at it as working out a solution instead of good/bad

[/QUOTE]

I'm so glad you went. Good for you! Sounds like it did wonders for your morale

[QUOTE=outofoptions]

we are glad to have you, and im telling you this site will work wonders if nothing else for your own sanity. Its funny when you talk to parents of 'normal' kids and tell them all the great 'fun' things that happen in our house. they think my son is just oh so funny, lol and then i suggest he stay a night with them and they look a little panicky. hmmm wonder why .

Yeah ADHD kids are the cutest--until you get them for more than a two hour stretch...

im going to recap a little only because i havent been here but you guys feel free to move on ahead without me....

My mom told me [when I asked her why she never grounded me] "Never ground the kid. Then you're stuck with a bored kid under your feet. That isn't punishing the kid--it's punishing the parent!"

last night while i was at work, of course, my son had an episode. he played hooky from school yesterday and had to stay in bed all day. halfway through the day he realized he should have went to school but the damage was done.

So the light dawned in his head--unfortunately sounds like he didn't take it very well.

bedtime last night, he threw a fit and screamed and wailed again and got in trouble. this morning when i seen him for the first time i told him how much i expected him to help daddy instead of make things worse and how i was dissappointed in him for misbehaving like that. i didnt lose my temper or anything, i was just straight to the point. i told him he was at least grounded for a few days because he knows better and he got the point.

Hey, great!--You got through the brain chatter!

Oh twaddle. I had a cartoon of a convention of "People from Function Families"--there was one guy in the room

It's not "what you come from"--it's how you're willing to learn and adapt and about resilience.

its so hard to believe that those of us who arent the June Cleavers or Martha Stewarts are destined to corrupt our children. i praise you ladies who are very warm and affectionate to your children but thats just not me. he knows i love him 'i hope' and he knows he can come to me about anything. however, he also knows im the iron fist of the family. my son is that age that girls have cooties and me being the only 'girl' in a house full of boys is just loads and loads of fun lol.

Well and ya know--you're like...well...uhm...Mom...

lol anyway, i just wanted to update and say that i am first working on myself and my anger issues and with that ill be able to deal with him better. thanks for all the support.

blessings

[/QUOTE]

Good for you. Sounds like you're trying hard.

Keep us posted

im going to recap a little only because i havent been here but you guys feel free to move on ahead without me....

the grounding works for my son only to a point and its only to a point we make it stick. my son earned his time back so the month didnt work, but it was for the dramatics of the situation as to why we said that. last night while i was at work, of course, my son had an episode. he played hooky from school yesterday and had to stay in bed all day. halfway through the day he realized he should have went to school but the damage was done. bedtime last night, he threw a fit and screamed and wailed again and got in trouble. this morning when i seen him for the first time i told him how much i expected him to help daddy instead of make things worse and how i was dissappointed in him for misbehaving like that. i didnt lose my temper or anything, i was just straight to the point. i told him he was at least grounded for a few days because he knows better and he got the point.

heres what i have problems with. i read somewhere awhile back that parents who come from emotionally stable families deal better with adhd'ers but does that mean that those of us who came from quackpot families will be horrible parents? its so hard to believe that those of us who arent the June Cleavers or Martha Stewarts are destined to corrupt our children. i praise you ladies who are very warm and affectionate to your children but thats just not me. he knows i love him 'i hope' and he knows he can come to me about anything. however, he also knows im the iron fist of the family. my son is that age that girls have cooties and me being the only 'girl' in a house full of boys is just loads and loads of fun lol.

lol anyway, i just wanted to update and say that i am first working on myself and my anger issues and with that ill be able to deal with him better. thanks for all the support.

blessings

yes vickie you read that correctly. we went with a psychologist more for counseling than for prescriptions. she specializes in ADHD children and is very up to date with medications. i have read several posts now that a combination of concerta (which worked very well for my son....for a while then it seemed to be less effective) and tenex seem to work really well. i have always been told that concerta was a weight based med. my boy is 13 and is a whopping 80 lbs. about the time we upped his dose to 72mg of concerta he had his tonsils out..he lost 10lbs in 5 weeks. so at age 101/2 he dropped from 70 to 60 lbs. it took him 2 years to gain back the 10 lbs and in the 6 mo since he's been off concerta and on vyvance he's been gaining weight steadily. Still way under weight for his age.

ok so yes my team right now is just the pediatrician but she is looking into him having ODD and when she comes with the diagnosis on that, we will be forwarded to a counselor and a psychiatrist. the medication options are out of her control now since he is at the max she can do for him for his age and weight. so a child psychiatrist is in the works.

i feel horrible for not being here with him all the time and not having as much patience as i feel i should but i am trying. its just so dag on hard. we havent had anymore 'episodes' since the other night but like i said before they come and go. he is unruly angry towards his little brother, as brothers are, but the bad habits wear off on the little one and then we have extra work we have to do to fix those habits. GRRRRRR its so frustrating.

LOL that made me laugh and if you know where i could get some shirts like that id be grateful. not that he would wear it but when im having a bad day or just so fed up, it would be fun to pull out lol.

however, he does get it from me, but i am more ADD then ADHD now, as getting older i learned to control it. ill be glad when he grows and matures more so he can start to have friends and focus in activities more.

thanks alot you guys, this has been a saving grace for me.

blessed be

Miss Red

outofoptions - I just wanted to let you know it does get better! My daughter in 3rd grade (and younger ages too) was very much like your son.   She would fly off the handle at the smallest thing, she was aggressive, violent and destructive. People outside our home would have been shocked by her behavior. I got to the point where I could no longer take it and sought help. This was when we had her evaluated and received the ADHD diagnosis. At the time, she would have also been put in the ODD bucket as well.

Once we started medication for her ADHD, I had a totally different child.   The majority of her behaviors stopped. It was so much more peaceful at our house until the start of 5th grade.   As her anxiety increased, so did the bad behavior.   We sought the help of a therapist.    This in conjunction with an increase in medication made a huge difference. Like Bethann's son, we use concerta and tenex.   Dosage is symptom based not age/weight.   My daughter is on 2 mg of tenex (.5 in the AM, 1.5 at night) and 27 mg Concerta (though might need 36 mg but ok for now).   My friend has 3 boys all with ADHD and all of her kids have differing doses.

My daughter is currently in 6th grade and doing well - both socially and in school.    My main issue now - and it's probably more of a puberty issues - is mouthiness and more yelling in the evenings. At least she isn't throwing things like she used to.

Here are somethings that have worked well for us.

1. Work on on behavior at a time.   For us, it was compliance.   We did a simple chart and tracked every time she said "OK" and followed through with what we asked.   Once she earned a tally, that was hers to keep and we never took them away. We kept it all positive.    She used the tallies to earn back her DS and then a new game. After about 2 months - she told me she didn't need the chart anymore.

2. Violent behavior is a "never" behavior and the consequences are REALLY expensive.   At one point, my daughter had pretty much everything removed from her room expect her bed and clothes.   After hitting and kicking me, she spent an entire weekend in her room missing all of her activities.   She absolutely hated being alone and since then has only had to spend a minimal amount of time in her room.

3. Don't engage in fights.   There is no reasoning with anyone in this mode.   Find them a space to cool off and only once they are cooled off - do you talk about what happened - what happened, what where you thinking, what were you feeling

4. Teach them feelings vocabulary.   Anger is sometimes a result of some other feeling - like frustration, disappointment, scared, loneliness, etc.   There is a poster called "Managing your Anger - What's behind it."   We had to teach her what a "disappointment" person looked like and how they should react.

5. Spend time with each child everyday doing something they want. The more positive time they get with you the better they will feel about themselves.    They get in trouble so much of the time that they get so much negative feedback...

6. Learn to predict what might set your child off and prepare both yourself and child.   I had a journal and would chart and keep track of my daughter's behavior. I was able to find patterns and learn to work around things that would normally cause issues trying to avoid setting them up to fail.

Books that I have liked:

Greene's - "The Explosive Child"
"10 Days to a less Defiant Child"
"Transforming the Difficult Child: The Nuturing Hear Approach"

Hang in there...

HorseMom39769.0003819444

i think your suggestions would help alot but could you help in describing what a 'simple' chart would look like? like i said im not always able to be here and i need something that can be carried through even when im not here. maybe sticker chart or something easy that can be bought for fairly cheap? kinda like that?

suggestions.......

Our chart was REALLY simple - a piece of paper taped to the fridge. Every time she did what she was asked, we marked down a tally. I was VERY generous in marking down tallies. I'd ask her to do stuff that I know she would have done anyway - just so she would be successful.    At the end of the week, we added them up. You could do stickers if that was more motivating that tallies on the paper.

My daughter is the creative type - so she colored the sheet and told me what color the tallies had to be.    As a page got full, we'd take it down and put it the notebook/journal I had going.   We'd sometime bring it with us when we went to see our therapist.

This system worked extremely well for us because is was simple.   Ever other charting or point/reward system we tried just didn't work for our family.   We as parents would never remember to follow through. My husband could even do it - if he remembered. He is more ADD than our daughter - though I don't think I will ever get him to admit it.