schools and a question

Are teachers telling parents to medicate thier kids? I had no idea! Are teachers qualified to do this? or are they being referred to couselors, then through the principal, etc.?

I feel that there will always be differences with children in the classroom. ADHD, physically challenged, hearing/visually impaired, language skills as you said, then there are kids who just fight or talk too much (they are not always ADHD), what about the kids who are really shy kids who are scared to participate or speak up. Is the teacher supposed to stop giving special attention to those with these special needs? They are in EVERY classroom. This is what teachers have to deal with. They know this going into the job. I'm not saying that anyone is to ignore the teacher's or other students  needs. But I hardly believe that in an entire class, there is just one child holding EVERYone back. I go to my son's classroom and help out quite often. And 6 years olds get out of control at times. It is not my son, or any one particular child in his class that causes the problem. 

Sometimes a teacher will ask if a child is medicated because that child is far from the norm. Teachers may not be medical doctors or psychiatrists but we do deal with kids all day, year after year. I am sure you want a teacher who will care about your child and want to teach them. It comes with the package. If I care about the kids I teach, I ask the hard questions. I deal with many kids who are on meds. I have a special class of K-6 graders who have been removed from regular education because they are too disruptive or aggressive. These are all very smart kids and I do not teach a special education class. I have a smaller class size and am a teacher who cares. It is the most frustrating and hurtful thing I ever experience when a parent becomes aggressive when I ask about ADHD or other issues. If a teacher asks about medication they are not prescribing. Seek a doctors advice. If a teacher asks you can be assured that your child is not behaving in a way that is helping them learn. If your child is not behaving in the socially accepted manner and the teacher asks about med's it indicates that the teacher believes that your child is not misbehaving on purpose. If your child were misbehaving on purpose the teacher would be suspending them.

Please remember that schools do not turn down anybody. We are a place to educate and that involves cooperation and team work with home. The NO CHILD LEFT BEHIND law requires all students to meet the same standard, no matter what their IQ which is where the law is flawed. All children are not alike. Please be part of your child's educational team. Do not give up.

Sally

Teaching children, means all children.  Not just Suzy-Q in the corner that is attentive and well behaved.  It means all children.  If the teacher cannot accomplish this, then don't be a teacher.  No one said teaching was easy.  No one said that teachers do not have major challenges to overcome on a daily basis.  HOWEVER, that comes with the territory of teaching.  Right?  Parent's can only do so much...

If someone has an issue that their child is missing out on their education due to another child receiving attention from the teacher, then pull them out and home school them.  The parent of the child that is having problems is JUST as much concerned about their child's education as you are about yours.

Teachers aren't miracle workers, yet they chose to be teachers.   Every profession in the world has adverse situations that arise, and the entire world would be unemployed if we all neglected out primary job responsibility when they occurred. 

I for one am tired of hearing about how tough it is on everyone.  What about the child that lives this every minute, and every hour of every day.  He did not chose this fate.  He is the child in this situation.  All of the ownership is not removed from teachers because they have other children in their classroom.  Don't we live in a country know for its diversity?  Yet as long as everyone fits in the cookie cutter of choice....they are happy.

Give me a break.

You are obviously having trouble with your child's teachers. "Not trying to start an attack. But"was how you chose to begin your reply. Sounds like an attack is coming to me.

I understand that you feel the issues are not important but they are important to that teacher. If you make the comments to your child's teacher that you have made to me, you are part of the problem, not the solution.

I do not suggest parents to be silent. In fact, I want parents to use their voice in the appropriate ways. I do expect parents to consider the requests of the teacher and to consider that the teacher wants your child to succeed.

I have parents who disagree with me as a principal and teacher. Some of them are dead on right. Some are also that wrong. 

I don't get upset about it. But I do get offended when then mention they same "little things" all the time. Little stuff should be handled at the school. i.e. why should I be told everyday that he keeps ripping up little pieces of paper? I told her to make him clean it up. That's what I have told him in the past and it helps because he doesn't want to have to stay late to do it. She should be glad that he doesn't throw the paper like last year.

Look again at what you just wrote above. 1st a teacher can't MAKE anybody do anything. So, they can't make your child clean up their mess. The act of tearing paper would be more severe if it disrupted or was defiant. The comment that the teacher should be glad it isn't worse is a way of focusing on the teacher instead of your child. If your child has an obsession with tearing things, such as paper, maybe you can send him special tearing paper to school each day. A special color maybe so he can identify just which pieces he should clean up. If a child throws things in my school, they are suspended because the classroom is a safe zone. Throwing items is not a safe behavior. I think you do not really believe your child's teacher makes wise choices. I hear your anger in the statement above as well as the remainder of your letter.

But you should understand that when a parent gets defensive, it's because sometimes teachers talk to them, like they don't already know or care that there's a problem. Some of it has to do with the school district you're in. If your not in one of the better nieghborhoods, some teachers tend to assume that you don't care or are not involved in the child's education because that is what they are used to.

I agree with you. Some teachers do talk down to parents. It is so sad. I believe that it can be diverted and healed if the parent comes to the teacher first. If the parent comes and says, "My child has had some difficulties in the past. We have tried many tactics to help him. I would really like to work with you to help him this year. I want to know about things at school. I believe that you will look for the best in my child and that you will continue to start each day as a new day. My biggest hope is that you will treat my child the way you would want your child to be treated." Something like that. Sounds like you have a very angry and bitter attitude toward school and I can only hope and pray that you find balance that will help your child to succeed. I pray that your child's teachers will be kind and gentle as well as firm and consistent. Good luck.

Sally

[QUOTE=monie2boys]Not trying to start an argument. But by "team work", you do understand that both sides have a part in the decision making, right? Parents aren't expected to just go along with whatever a teacher says, just because they have hundreds of students under thier belt. I do appreciate what my son's teacher does and that's why I offer to help any time I can. But I hope she doesn't expect me to stay silent if I disagree with her on something. No one has ever recommended meds to me, but they have mentioned behavior issues. IBy the way I write, I hope you don't think that I live to go after our teacher. In fact, the only real complaint I have ever had involved "home work over the Easter Break" and "not shoveling the snow in the front", neither of which were our teacher's fault. But I HAVE initiated meetings with the teacher and made suggestions for things that might help him focus or stop fidgeting. She also suggested some things and for the most part, it has been working. [/QUOTE]

I do go to the teacher first. They have to understand that my child has certain quirks. Nothing that is going to be dangerous, but just things that she is going to notice during the school year. I bring this to their attention first so she will know that I am already aware of this.

I used "tearing paper" as an example. He's not tearing up his work, it's the jagged edges of the spiral note book. We've since gotten a different type of paper. Not sure why I feel the need to explain that to you.  You focus on how far the child has come, not the things that he is still doing that JUST aren't as important. You should be able to tell a child to clean up his mess. Although they won't be happy about it, most kids will do it without an issue. It's not a big deal.

BTW. I am NOT having any trouble with our teachers. In fact, I had a meeting with one today that gave an excellent progress report. He has really come along way since last year and she expectsa him to do . That is without any meds. He doesn't need them. As I said, no one has ever made the suggestion.

But I would be offended if the teacher ever did. Even asking about meds is a very personal thing. Do you have children yourself? Then how would you like it if someone other than immediate family or a medical doctor  inquire about such a thing? How would you feel if a coworker asked if YOU were on meds yourself? If you have concerns like this about your students, maybe you should go through your guidance counselor or social service representatives to make the inquiry.

Hi:  I can only relate from my own experience but my son's teachers would tell me "little things" about his behavior and at first I beliieved he would either grow out of it, or I would have to discipline him or they don't understand him, he's just active.  Then as things became more complicated in 3rd grade his problems escalated.  Grades fell, my son was anxious, teacher calls about behavior.  Anyway, now looking back (as far as pre-school) all those "little things" that were commented on by different teachers did have a pattern of behavior that was different from the norm.    Just keep an open mind - your ultimate goal is to help your child if there is a problem.  I've learned now that maybe I should have acted a little sooner to get a definitive answer on the problems he was having.  Anyway, I did now and he's doing much better in 4th grade.  He seems happier and I understand where is behavior is coming from and can try to help.

But I would be offended if the teacher ever did. Even asking about meds is a very personal thing. Do you have children yourself? Yes and wish that his teachers cared enough about him to inquire about his health. Not to dictate but to inquire would show concern. Then how would you like it if someone other than immediate family or a medical doctor  inquire about such a thing? I would appreciate that they see a different side of my child. They have a broader view of normal than I do. Even as an educator my child is his own individual who will be different when he is not with me. Luckily he has had no such problems. But, I do not choose to be offended by someone showing concern.How would you feel if a coworker asked if YOU were on meds yourself? I would laugh. I would however wonder what behavior I needed to reevaluate. If you have concerns like this about your students, maybe you should go through your guidance counselor or social service representatives to make the inquiry. I teach a special class. 12 students grades K-6 all in one room. I work only with students who have behavioral issues. Every student has a story. Every student and every family has pain and I work with the entire family structure. I attend the students doctor appointments, psyciatrist appt., family outings, and even their birthday parties. Teaching is more than the teacher talking to kids about math and science. Teaching must be more than that. The whole village starts with one.

Please do not feel the need to reply to this. It really is not something we can continue to discuss. Agree to agree that we see school and teachers in a different light. I bring things to the Lord and leave them at His feet. I pray over my classroom and my kids, even in a public school. God Bless you.

Sally

Have to add a few things here.  First in reference to "Not just Suzy-Q in the corner that is attentive and well behaved"  Sadly Suzy-Q is the one that probably rarely to never gets my time in my classroom.  I spend the most time with those children that need constant redirection, supervision, and behavior management.  Suzy-Q holds her own so she is the least of my worries.  

I love being a teacher.  I love being a mom.  All of our children have very unique talents and abilities. 

Amen

Pat- I can relate. My son has just finished a full evaluation from the school, thanks to a teacher who pushed for it. He has been doing well in grade 2, but she said to me at a conference" I want to see what he is capable of". (Love that attitude!)  He was diagnosed last year in grade  1 with ADHD.  With medication. his impulsive behavior problems are under control this year.  His evaluation did not show any major learning disabilities ,however ,it did show a weekness in short term memory.  This effects his ability to follow directions. At the meeting they told me based on his ADHD diagnosis he is eligible for a 504. I would check this out with the powers that be in your state.

 I feel very fortunate that my school has a great team of which I feel part of.   Although my son does not require many accomadations in the classroom, I want him to have what he needs in the future, this includes help for the State tests.

Good luck to you-

Mazy:  Thanks for your input.  I am surprised at the attitude of the school Guidance Counselor and quite frankly the Principal of our school.  They seem to want to fight a 504 plan for my son-don't know why??.  At least they agreed to the psyco/educational testing (but I had to push for that) and I have requested they test his motor skills, as I suspect a writing disability (dysgraphia).  I do live in the state of CT and I understand each state can set their own eligibility criteria under 504.  Believe me - I am doing tons of research now.  Even my sons PSY. said Jon should qualify for a 504 just due to his AD/HD.  I did read, however, on CHADD (I'm sure you know this site), that this does not guarantee a 504 placement, but my son may also have other learning disabilities.  Also, just based on his CMT scores I would think this should qualify him.   I found a volunteer group in CT - they act as advocates and will even attend meetings with me at the school.  They really know all the in's and out's of IDEA and 504.  In fact, they told me I should really be requesting an IEP.  I may consider having them come with me and they have already given me good advise over the phone.    Right now I'll wait for his testing results.  I've also requested a copy of all his school records and I am documenting all conversations with the school. 

There is a lot of pressure on schools right now to make sure that all children are on grade level.  No Child Left Behind has changed schools to a high stakes environment.  Schools are becoming more test driven and less student driven.

I teach in a regular ed classroom and I do have to bring up ADHD evaluation questions with parents.  I also am a mom of 2 ADHD kids, so I know the flipside.  I do not know one teacher that asks for meds for his/her benefit.  My Adder's are missing so much!  If meds are used and effective, it is hopefully one part of a therapy. 

Teachers should let the parents know what behavior problems they are having, work with the kids/parents on that problem. (discipline at home if necessary), wouldn't that be lovely.  Teachers get a bad rap for calling home.  We get told we are calling home about every little thing, that we are picking on him/her because of his/her ADD.  I've seen it on this board.  I've heard it at school.  It is a fine line.  Teachers need to let parents know what kind of behavior they are seeing, but we are also supposed to "read" the parents to know how much they will deal with. 

We all know how frustrating living with an ADDer can be, and we love them with all of our heart (most of the time.)   

I type the following up because of some attitudes I've witnessed (in some) not all of the educators at my sons school.  From his 3rd grade teacher who didn't recognize any of the symptoms of ad/hd and repeatedly disciplined my son without suggesting further evaluation to the point of extreme anxiety until I finally did step in.  To his teacher this year who said "your son just needs to learn not to rush and to learn that these "tests" are important.  To the Guidance Counselor who said "your son hates school and rushs" to the principal who said "your son probably won't qualify for a 504 based on his grades even though he has ad/hd.  What is some input - from teachers as well as parents before I request the principal distribute this.  I found in researching the internet, that some and by all means I know not all teachers have misconceptions about AD/HD.  Some also have attitudes that it is over-diagnosed or not a real disability or that the AD/HD is fixed if they are on "Meds".

JUST FOR TEACHERS

KEY FACTS YOU SHOULD KNOW FROM A PARENT THAT WANTS YOU TO UNDERSTAND HER AD/HD CHILD

AD/HD IS NOT A CONDITION MADE UP BY DOCTORS AND THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT JUST TO DEFINE “KIDS THAT DON’T SIT STILL, DON’T LISTEN AND DON’T PAY ATTENTION”!  IT IS A MEDICAL DISABILTY THAT DOES EXIST. 

AD/HD IS A DISABILITY AS DEFINED BY CIVIL LAW AND IDEA.

TELLING AN AD/HD CHILD TO FOCUS OR ELSE – IS THE SAME AS TELLING SOMEONE IN A WHEELCHAIR TO WALK OR ELSE OR A DIABETIC TO LOWER THEIR BLOOD SUGAR – OR ELSE.

HERE ARE SOME CHARACTERISTICS OF AN AD/HD CHILD

THAT YOU MAY WITNESS –

DISORGANIZED

EASILY DISTRACTED

ON TASK AND FOCUSED ONE MINUTE - OFF TASK THE NEXT

DIFFICULTY CONCENTRATING -

ESPECIALLY WHEN THE MATERIAL IS DIFFICULT OR BORING

CONSTANT FIDGETING

BLURTING OUT ANSWERS AND INTERRUPTING OTHERS

CONSTANTLY GETTING UP FROM THEIR CHAIRS

MANY ARE ANGRY, SOME ARE NOT

EACH AD/HD CHILD WILL DISPLAY MANY OF THE ABOVE CHARACTERISTICS BUT NOT ALL OF THEM.  MANY WILL HAVE OTHER LEARNING DISABILITIES AS WELL OR OTHER BEHAVIOR ISSUES,

SUCH AS ODD, THAT CO-EXIST WITH AD/HD.

IN LOOKING AT THE CHARACTERISTICS ABOVE, REMEMBER IT’S YOUR RESPONSIBILITY TO ENCOURAGE THE AD/HD CHILD BY USING CORRECT TEACHING TECHNIQUES IN ORDER TO MAXIMIZE THEIR POTENTIAL:

HELP THEM TO ORGANIZE THEIR WORK

         MAKE SURE INSTRUCTIONS ARE CLEAR

LEARN WHAT IT TAKES TO KEEP THEM FOCUSED AND INTERESTED

LEARN WHAT MOTIVATES THEM TO BEHAVE (POSITIVE REINFORCEMENT)

HERE’S SOMETHING YOU SHOULD REALLY REMEMBER:  AD/HD CHILDREN DON’T WANT TO BE “DIFFERENT” FROM THEIR PEERS OR DELIBERATLY TRY TO BE DIFFICULT.  IT IS A MANIFESTATION OF THEIR DISABILITY.

DISCRIMINATING AGAINST AD/HD STUDENTS FOR ANY REASON IS A VIOLATION OF CIVIL LAW.  THE BEST WAY TO AVOID DISCRIMINATION IS TO BE COMPLETEY EDUCATED ON THE DISABILITY AND TO LEARN WHATEVER YOU CAN ON HOW TO TEACH CHILDREN WITH AD/HD.  YOU WILL PROBABLY ALWAYS HAVE ONE OR TWO IN YOUR CLASSROOM. 

TEACHERS, AS DICTATED BY CONNECTICUT CHARTER, ARE REQUIRED TO TAILOR LEARING FOR EACH STUDENT AND MEET THEIR SPECIAL NEEDS FOR LEARNING. 

HERE’S A BIGGIE TO REMEMBER:

WHEN AN AD/HD CHILD IS ON “MEDS” – IT WILL NOT FIX THEM AS IF BY  MAGIC.  THEY WILL STILL HAVE MANY OF THE AD/HD CHARACTERISTICS THAT AFFECT THEIR LEARNING.  THEY WILL PERHAPS STILL BE DIS-ORGANIZED, AND WILL STILL NEED YOUR PATIENCE WHEN GIVING INSTRUCTIONS.  THEY MAY STILL FIND IT DIFFICULT TO ALWAYS BE ON “TASK” .  THEY WILL STILL GET DISTRACTED EASILY.  THEY WILL STILL STRUGGLE WITH THEIR LEARNING DISABILITIES.  THEY STILL NEED YOUR HELP AND GUIDANCE IN THE AREAS OF BEHAVIOR, SOCIAL SKILLS AND LEARNING SKILLS.

ACCEPT ALL YOUR STUDENTS FOR WHAT THEY ARE.  CHALLENGE YOURSELF TO FIND OUT AS MUCH AS POSSIBLE ABOUT HOW TO REACH ALL OF YOUR CHILDREN TO THE BEST OF YOUR ABILITY.  LEARN ABOUT EACH OF YOUR STUDENTS STRENGTHS AND WEAKNESSES.

ENCOURAGE THE AD/HD CHILD IN THEIR AREAS OF STRENGTH.  COMPLIMENT THEM WHEN THEIR BEHAVIOR IS GOOD.  MOST ARE VERY INSECURE AND LIKE TO HEAR KIND WORDS!  

DON’T ADD TO THEIR LOW SELF-ESTEEM BY TREATING THEM AS IF THEY ARE A NUISANCE.   DON’T TELL THEM THAT THERE IS SOMETHING WRONG WITH THEM.  REMEMBER HOW THEY MUST FEEL WHEN THEY ARE “DRESSED-DOWN” IN FRONT OF THEIR PEERS.  HAVE COMPASSION FOR THE FEELINGS OF THESE LITTLE KIDS.  THEY DIDN’T ASK FOR THIS PROBLEM.  THEY ARE REALLY YOUNG WITH LIVES FULL OF POTENTIAL AHEAD OF THEM.  THEY AREN’T ACTING LIKE THIS JUST TO RUIN YOUR DAY.

YOU WILL NEVER HAVE ALL PERFECT LITTLE ATTENTIVE KIDS, THAT DON’T SPEAK OUT AND SIT QUIETLY IN YOUR CLASSROOM.  IF YOU EXPECT THAT AND TRY TO CHANGE ALL OF YOUR STUDENTS TO FIT SOME PERCEIVED MODE OF PERFECTION, THEN STOP AND RETHINK THIS IDEA. PLEASE!

Daniel's mom--Ian is the same way.  Church was a nightmare, but it is better.  SI is a challenge. 

In reference to monies for kids on meds, our school does not get money for kids on med.  We do get special education monies for SPED kids, but not all adhd are SPED.

Tessa,

Can you give me advice for Sunday School teachers. I am beginning to work with my church - parents and SS teachers - I know what works in regular schools but Sunday Schools are so much harder. Any tips would be greatly appreciated.

Sally