Ritalin for a 3yr old? | ADHD Information

eeyore710

I really don't want to get in a sparring match with you, and I agree that many Head Start (or other preschool teachers for that matter) would not have the training or patience to deal with such a situation, but I have and it was while I was a teacher at Head Start that I did so. 

I had a child(to this day I do not know what his problems were) that would go off of tantrums very similar to the one you described your daughter having.  One day, he decided to throw the trash can full of lunch trash (food, throw away containers from our delivered lunch, paper plates, etc) over during one of them, at other times he threw books around the room in anger.  Both times I and the other teachers that were there..we had a public school teacher in our classroom as well making 3 adults...divided and conquered...the other two teachers took the children into the other room or outside and engaged them in another activity, and I stayed in the room that he had tantrumed in, working on after lunch cleanup, or tidying up the teacher center, until he was finished and then explained to him that he had to clean up.  He of course refused at first, but after he calmed down and realised that he was missing out on all the fun the other children were having, he complied.  I gave him gloves for him to pick up the lunch trash, of course.  It took some time, but we did not ever entertain the idea to send him home...in fact the only time we were allowed to send the children home was when they were ill or god forbid had head lice.  There were many resources for us to draw on including having a pschologist come in and observe him in the class room setting and on the bus ride.  These resources would not be available in a public classroom I do not believe. 

This child was referred for psychological help because of us, the Head Start teachers and came to our preschool throughout, and graduated into Kindergarten.

I just was commenting on your comment that Head Start is a program that "is for all sorts of challenged kids".  I do not want even one family that can benefit from this wonderful program to shy away due to any misconception.  I believe that there is at least one parent on this board with an ADHD child in a Head Start program, and she has gotten much help from the program, they went above and beyond to enable him to stay in the prgram when her needs changed.

Head Start is a program for all sorts of children, challenged kids included, and should not be mislabeled as a program for just the challenged ones.  My grand daughter attended Head Start and tested into the top 4% of her age group to begin kindergarten just before her 5th birthday.

Yes, not every Head Start program is equipped to handle a severely ADHD child, but some are.  Not every Head Start program will have staff capable of dealing compassionately with a challenging child such as yours, but I could have and  in exactly the same way as was done in her new school, did while at a Head Start center.

I am happy that you have access to such a wonderful specialized preschool for your daughter, truly I am, but there is no such program in my area  (as I am certain is true in many areas) and I am sure if there were, it would be well out of most of many parent's price range. 

Again I do not want to offend or upset you, but Head Start is a program that is dear to my heart, and I want to be sure everyone is clear on its virtues, not to judge them on misconceptions.

 

Good morning! Thank you for welcoming me.  First of all want to say your doing a great job with Aidan.  I find counseling helpful too, my daughter at times will be angry with things that have happened in the past and will blame family members for unrealistic expectations that happen then in which we hold no control over.  Having a professional to help her sort out and teach her how to express her feeling in healthly fashion is helping her and the family as well.  The blood work can be very expensive if you have no insurance, but it will be a guide the doctor in prescribing supplements which are expensive too, but a have to.  I have notice in my daughter how it is deeply healing and restoring her memory and her behavior for the better.  The Depakote, Resperidol and other medications the previous doctors prescribe also caused dementia for her and other disfunctional disorders, that is why she is being distoxified from them.  She goes to a doctor that works with a world-renowned facility for the treatment of brain injured children.  Sometimes doctors prescribe medications to stop certain behaviors (like hyperactivity or overeating or depression) and these medications cause serious side effects like renal failure, diabetes, etc. some medications have not been around all that long and do not heal. So,if your child is taking any medication I am sure they are doing it safely for Aiden just make sure that they check those things as well.  So, these test find the underlying problem and then thereafter corrected measures are taken.  My children did not want to drink the juice at first, so I found out what they prefered in fruits?  then I would sneak the celery, beets, parsley, etc. very slightly.  They wouldn't even taste it, after a few weeks I would tell them what they were drinking and since they liked it they didn't refuse to drink thereafter.  Although it sounds as Aiden is too bright for this...you can try making a banana smoothie with a blender and add the juice just a few ounces to it from the juicemaker...hopefully it won't be noticeable???  Will keep him in our prayers too!!! 

I may not have been very clear in how I expressed my knowledge of Head Start, but it is exactly what I thought it was, and is an issue for a child like Aiden for the same reasons that my daughter's previous program was a problem for her.  I will tell a little story from her new school that perhaps will shed some light on WHY a program with so many kids doesn't work for a child like my little girl.

My daughter's 3rd day in her new school, she was playing with some toys, and was making quite a mess.  She started to get up to get into something else, and her teacher stood in front of her and said "you can't make a mess of the whole house.  You need to clean up those toys before you move on to the next thing."  This set my daughter off.  She took every toy in sight and threw it at the wall.  She started throwing a tantrum, screaming "I WILL NOT CLEAN IT!  I WILL NOT CLEAN UP TOYS!"  Her teacher said "OK that's fine, you don't need to clean the toys.  But you cannot play with any new toys until those are cleaned up."  My daughter threw a fit for 2 hours.  During this fit, the teacher walked by every once in a while and said "we're playing over here and we would like it if you could play with us.  I hope you put the toys away soon." After 2 hours, my daughter, bright red with anger screamed "AREN'T YOU GOING TO SEND ME HOME?"  The teacher said "no, I've seen this all before, and you can keep screaming if you want.  It doesn't bother me"  A few minutes later, things got quiet.  The teacher walked over and found my daughter carefully putting all the toys back in their spots on the shelves.  She offered to help and thanked my daughter for cleaning up.  My daughter refused the help saying "I made this mess!  I'll clean it myself!" 

She has not thrown a tantrum at home or school in 3 months since this incident.  A teacher at Head Start, or any other normal preschool, is not going to know that this is what needs to be done for this type of child.  And realistically, they have too many other kids to worry about to let one child disrupt things like this.  I know that in some areas, childcare specifically for ADHD kids may not be available, but I am a big advocate of at least getting the child in a small ratio home based situation, where the adult working with the child has a little more leeway to tailor the discipline and methods of teaching than someone in a large organization.  

I know head start helps many families...it's just that in my opinion it's not the right environment to help a severe ADHD child.  The kind of environment provided will just add fuel to the fire. 

My 3 year old is also on Clonidine, although not just to sleep.  She takes 1/4 tab in the morning, 1/2 tab at lunch, and 1/2 tab at dinner.  She is severely ADHD, and it was pretty much inevitable with the family history (mom & dad both on Strattera).  She was having problems similar to Aiden.  It was a nightmare.  I would pick her up from daycare every day with multiple reports of hitting, biting, spitting.  She was climbing the walls and every moment with her was INTENSE.  Our approach was multi-faceted, and within a few months she has turned into a lovable, sweet kid.  She is able to get along with other kids, is helpful around the house, and the temper tantrums have stopped completely.

Her doc prescribed the Clonidine because he didn't want to put such a young kid on stimulants, so he gave the Clonidine to take the edge off the hyperactivity while we watch and wait, and see what is needed when she is a little older.  The first week it made her very sleepy, but as she adjusted, it just helps her be a little calmer and helps her impulse control (the violent behavior). 

We also went to a behavior psychologist for about 3 months, to learn parenting techniques that would help her rather than feed the madness.  We got her into a preschool that is home-based.  The preschool was referred to us by a local resource called Coordinated Child Care, that has a division for special needs children.  Her day care is run by a husband and wife that both have degrees in special education, and actually PREFER ADHD kids.  There are 5 kids in her school to 2 adults.  They have a quiet area set up with pillows and soft things for when the kids get over stimulated and need to throw a temper tantrum or just be alone to re-integrate with their environment.  Coordinated Child Care sends someone to the daycare monthly to observe the kids, and every 3 months we have conferences with the folks from CCC and the teacher to discuss what the next challenge is, so that she is getting consistent messages and discipline from home and school.  It's working wonders, and she even uses the techniques on mommy!  If I am distracted and she is trying to talk to me about something she thinks is important she will say "STOP MOMMY!  Now look at my eyes." and then tell me what she has to say.

I think her improvement is a combination of factors...but that said, even with all the behavior stuff we have done, mom and dad can tell when it is time for the Clonidine:)  I would recommend the Clonidine along with behavioral modification.  AND if possible, get the child out of Head Start or whatever other program he is in, and get him into a VERY small adult to child ratio.  ADHD kids can function quite well in an environment where there are not a billion kids running around, and where they can escape and digest what is going on around them.  From what I know of Head Start, it is for all sorts of challenged kids, and tends to have fairly large groups of kids (large group for a 3 year old with ADHD being 10:1 ratio), which is only going to make ADHD worse.  If the kid is overstimulated, they are going to react.   

eeyore710

Head Start is not for only challenged kids , it is, at least in Ohio, for children in the lower income bracket whose parents cannot afford preschool otherwise.  A disability such as speech would give the child a little more preference on the waiting list (if there is one), but so does coming from a single parent family, living with a grandparent, being adopted,etc..all of which don't always lead to challenging behavior.  Also, it has to be argued that many times a child from a perfect  2 parent upper class home environment can be extremely challenging despite all of his apparent advantages.

In my region, there was no waiting list ( I worked for Head Start for over 4 years), and we often even opened up our enrollment to over income children to fill our classrooms, which had 2 adults to a maximum of 17 children. 

The 10:1 ratio was only used to determine if one teacher could be left alone for brief periods with groups, such as during outdoor play, if one child had to go in to use the bathroom, if there were less than 10 that were still outside playing, then one teacher could go in to assist the child and one would stay outside.  If there would be more than 10 left outside. we would have the cook or the site supervisor (2 other adults that were always available during class hours to assist if needed) take the child to the bathroom, leaving both teachers with the group.

I also had the same misconceptions about Head Start as you before I worked there, and was so surprised to see the classrooms filled with so many 'normal' children.  The major problem with Head Start (at least in my area) is twofold.  Firstly, the teachers and assistants are underpaid so the turnover is high.  Secondly, because they are underpaid, many of the teachers only have a CDA (Child Development Credential is what I think it stands for) not a degree though many have an associates  degree, and many if not all of the teacher assistants are only high school graduates.  This is not to say that there are not wonderful teachers/teacher assistants that are naturally great, that just don't have that degree, but there are many that are not so great simply because they have no training though a lot of training is provided through Head Start throughout the year to the staff.

The standards are changing, and all teachers at least in Ohio for Head Start will be required to have a bachelors degree in Early Childhood Education, and all assistants will be required to have as associates degree in the same I think by the year 2008.  For Head Start to hire and retain these people who have spent a considerable amount of time and money to obtain these degrees, they are going to have to increase their payscale.  With these degees, one can teach preschool and elementary in the public school sector with a much better payrate and benefit scale.

The special home based preschool that you have found for your child sounds wonderful, and I am happy that she has it. The people that run it sound great as well.  I just felt the need to clear up the misconceptions that you had about Head Start.

b_rwhite5

Does Aiden have speech issues?  I only ask because you mention that he has trouble communicating his needs and wants and that he is seeing a speech therapist.

It is interesting to me that he also will only eat 10-15 foods as my grandson,aged 4, has speech issues as well and for a time had speech therapy which had to be discontinued because my son in law made too much money for medicaid and can only sign up for the insurance at work in January of each year, and the sessions cost too much for them to go until they get some coverage.

The therapist told my daughter that the probable reason that he had such an aversion to some foods was texture related and often went along with speech delays.  When we do get him to try a new food, he will put it in his mouth and have the most awful look on his face while he is chewing it, but he will say that it tastes good.  And after a few times of the awful face, he accepts the new food sometimes.  His favorites seem to all be grains, but he will drink juice, and that is mainly how we get fruits and veggies into him....he likes the V8 splash juice which has both in it.

 

chasesmom7939045.3151273148

Hi, everyone. Sorry I have not been here in a few days. My comp. crashed and I just got it back today.

Bharrod, if you want to send a post to a thread, try reading the ENTIRE thread first before you give your opinion. Thank you!

Benji, I hope you are well. Please let us know how you are doing.

My parents made me take it so really I had no choice and I knbow the full effects of ritalin like no one else because I had them all at once and even now though im off I still get the effects so spare me the lectures I know that ritalin is not that good for anyone it may work wonders but wait to they come off it when I did I was so screwed up its was unbelievable but now im just me again 

 

I am so sorry that your parents did that!  Did they not see that it made you worse?  Did you tell them about the bad side effects you were experiencing?  There are many other meds out there that can help you perhaps and some of them are not stimulants...By the way...I thought that doctors would not treat children until the age of 6 in the United Kingdom??  Many other people from there on this board have made that statement...

Strattera helps many adults with ADHD, though I have heard that it may take up to 4-6 weeks to have full effect.  Shire is even coming up with a long acting form of Tenex, which is really a blood pressure medicine that has shown some signs of being effective on many ADHD symptoms.  Their shorter acting form (taken 2-3 times a day) has been being used for some time with good results on some ADHD symptoms and is relatively inexpensive in the U.S., but I see you are in the United Kingdom...so I am not sure of the cost or availability there.

Maybe you should see a doctor and suggest to him/her that you had a bad experience on stimulants and that you would like to try one of these...

I wish you luck in finding something to help you...I also have an adult daughter that was untreated as a child, and she had the same difficulty as you in finding and keeping jobs until she found her niche...she created her own job and now owns and runs a dance studio.

My parents  did not really care it was to help me at school and they though I was doing it on purpose...idiots I swear I was on ritalin at the age of 4 and I got it free.

You really should check out some of the things I mentioned in my post.  ADHD is extremely hard to overcome on your own, and maybe one of the non stimulation meds can aid you.  There are also other stims that are not ritalin...maybe one of them is worth a try? Using a stim when you are ADHD (in the correct dosage of course) only helps the brain to work more efficiently.

You are obviously at a bad time in your life and not too happy...therapy can be a good thing as well.

You are too young to totally give up, so keep on hanging in there...

 

I am glad to here that some of you are having success with clonidine. My 3 year old son was just perscribed it last night. I gave him his first dose last night. He was very crabby this morning. I sure hope that goes away. He has all sorts of difficulties with aggression, following rules, sitting in circle, running around the room and being generally distructive. I am hoping that he can find the calm he needs with the clonidine. Has anyone noticed emotional side effects and did they go away after a while?

Ivanhoe

You really need to read the entire thread before you respond to a topic.  If you had read the entire thread (all 5 pages), you would know that this mother was at her wit's end before she went to her doctor..she has 2 other children that she has no trouble (out of the ordinary) and I am sure that the only reason that her doctor recommended this drug is because he thought that it would help this child.  That being said, the rest of your post needs to be addressed as well.  Her child was having issues sleeping and she already tried the natural method of Melatonin, which failed.  With this med to help him get a good night's sleep, he is a different child.

Your mention of 'textbook learning' makes no sense since we are talking about preschoolers here....I taught preschool for 7 years, 4 of them in Head Start, and never once was one of the children in either school handed a textbook.  Furthermore this mother has nothing but praise for her child's school and didn't send him out of a whim, she sent him for him to learn more apprpriate social skills which he has done.  Here is a quote that you apparently missed:

 

Aidan has never been in day care. I am lucky enough to be able to stay at home with my children. In my area, there are only a few school that take 3 yrs old and they will only take a few each year. We hadn't planned to put him in school until he was 4, but when we found out about the adhd, we knew we had to do something. We applied to many different programs. Since Aidan had never been around other children his age, if we didn't put him school, he would have a difficult time next yr. I was skeptical at first, but this was for Aidan, not me, so I had to give it a try. Even though we had a higher income, he was still able to enroll. Both teachers have their bachelors degee in  Early Childhood Education. One of his teachers has a daughter who has ADHD and the other has a son who is Autistic. There are 14 children in his class. They are 3 and 4 yr olds. Before Aidan started Head Start, he would throw tantrums hitting, spitting, kicking, pinching others. He would hit himself and bang his forehead on the floor. He would throw things at my daughters. He would not listen. He could not sit still. The first 3 days of Head Start were tough, but he is doing great now. He isn't hurting the other kids anymore. No tantrums, he listens and he can sit still! His teachers  give me a report every day. They have always told me not to worry. The tell me that they will help him get through this. I was afraid he would be kicked out, but he hasn't